Oh, and for sure, I definitely don't keep my pinky on the C# and Eb keys as Ridenour shows (that's REALLY hard!) but I for sure keep them close, they almost don't move.

Maybe one day, I'll get these fingers together, lol.

 

I know the guy is highly respected, but I don't go along with what he is saying. A lot of very, very able players, with fantastic technique, on a range of instruments, have played with a lot of finger motion off the keys. So I see what he is prescribing as mainly an exercise in pedanticity. I have presented reasoning for efficiency of key movement being greater with travel off the key in at least one other thread.

Perhaps we should consider moving our hands only 2 cm, or even less when we applaud. Hehe! Actually the two do have a fair bit in common. We want the pad closure to be as snappy as possible, and when we clap we don't make much sound unless the impact of the hands is pretty snappy. How do we achieve the snappiness? Start the movement with the moving part further away.

 

I know the guy is highly respected, but I don't go along with what he is saying. A lot of very, very able players, with fantastic technique, on a range of instruments, have played with a lot of finger motion off the keys. So I see what he is prescribing as mainly an exercise in pedanticity.

... and of course a lot of very, very able players, with fantastic technique, on a range of instruments, have played with very little finger motion hovering right on top of the keys.

As with the Bis/side Bb/XXX0X discussion, there are many paths to personal excellence.

 

It's been rehashed ad nauseam, so I'm not here to argue the whole close fingers v. far fingers thing. All I'm gonna say about it is I'm in the Kalmen Opperman camp, by way of his influence on my teachers...the less motion and distance, the better...YMMV.

Possibly even more important is to look at the hand position. It shouldn't be moving around to facilitate the register key, throat tones, trill keys, etc... Similar to good palm key technique on saxophone (though that's a little more forgiving, and you can get away with more motion than on clarinet).

And Gordon, I'm not trying to get into arguments with you cause it's futile (since we both clearly have the opposite opinions) but I am always amused by your analogies using things that are semi-related to playing instruments. I don't understand your clapping analogy...it's unnecessary to use more distance/force to get some "snap" in your pads...this neither makes notes come out faster or sound better. Elaborate? (this is not a challenge, I'm in fact curious about your POV).

 

oh, and I should re-iterate. I don't keep my fingers on the LH - C# and RH - G# keys as Ridenour shows. My pinky does indeed come off...but it's exceptionally minimal. In general, I do keep my fingers close (unless there's a tonal or musical reason not to) but playing evenly is more important than anything else.

If you guys can play things like the Jean Jean studies or Giant Steps with fingers all over the place, I can't really argue with that right?

 

There's validity in what he's saying, and I was taught that way, but some allowance has to be made for individual differences. From the video, it looks like he has smallish hands and extremely short fingers. The shorter the fingers, the more important to keep close to the keys. A half-inch of motion for short fingers is much more telling than the same distance for long fingers, assuming proper hand position and finger action. Gifted teachers come up with all sorts of quirky devices that shouldn't be considered the one and only path to virtuosity.

 

There's validity in what he's saying, and I was taught that way, but some allowance has to be made for individual differences. [...] Gifted teachers come up with all sorts of quirky devices that shouldn't be considered the one and only path to virtuosity.

Time was, it was considered that, because a great player didn't have to meet his students halfway to be considered a great teacher. All he needed was absolute authority and he usually got it. If his method didn't work for you, he might drop you or even advise you to stop playing altogether. It was just considered part of the price of art, and typically you did not look for a second opinion.

 

Time was, it was considered that, because a great player didn't have to meet his students halfway to be considered a great teacher. All he needed was absolute authority and he usually got it. If his method didn't work for you, he might drop you or even advise you to stop playing altogether. It was just considered part of the price of art, and typically you did not look for a second opinion.

Ridenour studied with Kalmen Opperman. I studied with someone who also studied with Kalmen Opperman. I can't comment on other teachers, but all people that come from any part of this lineage subscribe to Mr. Opperman's "keep fingers close to the keys" methods. All his books and exercises are also built around this.

And I believe he was one of the uncompromising pedagogues you mention, paulwl, but in this case, I haven't heard anyone complain about his way of doing things, lol.

 

Ridenour studied with Kalmen Opperman. I studied with someone who also studied with Kalmen Opperman.... ..., lol.

It sounds a bit like the string of popes that subscribed to the sun circling the earth. Somewhat blind following. Puppets?

 

I know he was uncompromising...he demanded a lot out of his students and was very exacting about everything (sound, air, technique...etc). But I never studied with him directly...all I know of him I know from his students and anecdotes of his students in books and interviews.

All I know is this works, and his etudes were some of the most useful things I've ever played for developing great technical command of the clarinet. Regardless of who you studied with, a lot of his etude books are useful, especially the finger exercises.

 

I dearly wish jazz were an avenue open to more clarinetists. (Same for another harsh-minded group, the violinists.) It could really open them up, and they in turn would open jazz up.

Funny enough, I stopped my classical path (I was a performance major in school) to study jazz full time. But mainly on saxophone, lol. The classical clarinet chops really made all those big band parts pretty easy though (even the Ellington stuff...some of it is not "easy" unless you actually play clarinet. Jimmy Hamilton was a monster). I'm back to getting my clarinet chops back because I like playing the literature...but never wanted a symphonic job.

Unfortunately, most schools don't have programs that cater towards clarinet players who want to play jazz. It's seen more of a double than a primary instrument. And many who try will not find ensembles to play in unless they form their own. I've run into a few jazz clarinetists around here in NYC, but compared to the 1000's of Tenor saxophonists and hundreds of alto players, they're essentially non-existent.

The general consensus seems to be, when I ask why people don't play it...is that it's really hard to play, lol.

 

I'm glad I didn't know how hard it was when I started...