[gabrielb]

Hi all. I’ve been learning alto saxophone for about 6 months. I’ve been using an old Jupiter JAS-667, which is very good for the time in-which I played it. Lately, I dropped it and it got severely damaged, I managed to fix it but it’s not very good anymore. So I’ve been shopping around local stores for a new alto. I looked at a couple of models.

First, I’ve always been appealed to a new Jupiter, like the JAS-500, which is an international model. I’ve played on one, and it sounds great. The key work is similar to my older Jupiter, and it is very comfortable. It was reasonably priced at around 1000 US dollars. It fits my budget. It was made in China, however.

Next, I saw a new Selmer USA. It was the AS400. I haven’t heard much about this model, nor have I seen a lot of feedback about it. I’ve tried an AS500, which looks notably similar. It sounded alright. It has notably nice features, like a double arm low C. Its priced at around 1200 US dollars, which is above my budget of about 1000 dollars. It appealed to me, because I’ve heard about Selmer’s alright reputation and how it fits under the student/intermediate level, which I feel like I’m at.

I’ve heard about the the highly regarded Yamahas, and sure they sound nice. The YAS-280 is a little to high above my budget, and I’d like to stay near my budget. The YAS-23s are an option, but it’s hard to find some in good condition, I haven’t seen good ones in my local ads. I personally have never tried one, but I am intrigued by reviews. Online is an option, but they are slightly more expensive, and are the same price as the Jupiter. They are in the range of 300 to 800 US dollars. In that case I’d rather get the Jupiter as its new, but maybe the Yamaha is better still...

So, what are best options? I do need to consider that I probably need to actually try them, but in terms of pricing, and perhaps reputation, build, reliability, which is better?

 

[Reet McVouty]

So, my opinion, for what it's worth. You need to start by being more careful with your horn, the value of that lesson being costly and putting you in the situation that you're in now. Based on what you say your budget is low, and from what I've determined you've been pricing new horns here. You should then in this case be looking at used horns. Not knowing where you live I don't know what stores you have available that you can go to to try out a used horn. If there aren't any stores available, I would make sure any online sources you deal with have a return policy.

I think the YAS-23 is your best choice. For one, there should be more of them available. They are the top student model but are built with the same high standards that all the Yamaha saxophones are. You should be able to find a really good one for around $600. Selmer USA makes good horns as well but your selection of used ones would be limited. I personally own a Selmer La Voix soprano and it's a really nice instrument, but my main soprano is a YSS-82ZR.

So, if you're serious about playing, getting a used YAS-23 should be the wisest choice. While your playing that you can start saving for your future pro horn, and if you like the 23 a pro Yamaha model would be a no brainer. Let us know how you make out.

 

[Sigmund451]

If you are going to spend a grand you can get a used pro model with a fresh overhaul near that price...in the least a lot better horn.

 

[JayeLID]

double post

 

[JayeLID]

I would agree with Phil. $1000-1200 can get you a very good used horn.

If you have that budget, you can do BETTER than a Yamaha 23/21/25/26 whatever. I actually think going from your Jupe 667 to a YAS 23 is a step backward.

And FWIW, the Jupe 500 feels much nicer under the fingers than a Yama 23, really.

The Selmers are OK. Not many folks really talk about 'em here, but they are quite OK.

If you went used you could probably afford a Yama 61, and certainly can afford an upper-shelf used Jupe....or even a used Yani can be reeled in for $1200.

You know, tho....the 667 is a GOOD horn. Unless the body is literally split at a seam somewhere, or the thing is road kill....anything is repairable.

Want me to just overhaul it for ya ? :bluewink: It'd only run around $550 or so ...you'd save a ton of $ and I would argue you would retain a horn which is better than the three you are considering, actually....

 

[Dr G]

Hi all. I've been learning alto saxophone for about 6 months. I've been using an old Jupiter JAS-667, which is very good for the time in-which I played it. Lately, I dropped it and it got severely damaged, I managed to fix it but it's not very good anymore.

I fixed my dog, and now he doesn't work.

If you fix a saxophone, however, it should work. If it doesn't, then get it done right.

 

[balticband]

I fixed my dog, and now he doesn't work.

If you fix a saxophone, however, it should work. If it doesn't, then get it done right.

+1

 

[chknbon]

Dr. G, what kind of work did your dog do?

 

[Sigmund451]

Plus with the economic downturn there will likely be lots of altos coming out of the woodwork for sale.

 

[gabrielb]

Yes, I have tried to send to a repair tech, and I got an estimate of about 250 dollars. I paid only 300 dollars for the sax, I thought might as well get a new one if repairing it would be near the cost of the sax when I bought it.

Also, I don’t think “fixed” was the right word I chose, I just got it back in playing condition. Most of the damage on my 667 is on the bell, its been bent a lot really. I managed to bend into an alright shape, but low notes are just as great as before. Really stupid drop by me. I still play it tho, its sounds great. I just thought might as well get another sax.

 

[Dr G]

Dr. G, what kind of work did your dog do?

Stud.

 

[Taragot]

Most of the damage on my 667 is on the bell, its been bent a lot really. I managed to bend into an alright shape, but low notes are just as great as before.

I learned that if the bell is bent, then propably the tube is bent too and that leads to leaks which affect obviously the low notes. If you bend it back by hand it's not likely that you fix all the leaks by accident.

Want me to just overhaul it for ya ? It'd only run around $550 or so

That sound like a reasonable offer (though I don't know the prices in the US). I like the jupiters, too. It's not that seldom that you have to put more money in a overhaul if you got the horn for very cheap.

Plus with the economic downturn there will likely be lots of altos coming out of the woodwork for sale.

Sadly true.

 

[Canadiain]

If its in need of repair, its effectively worth very little right now. You were happy with it, and none of the new horns you are considering are much (if any) of a step up.
If I were you I would pay the $250 to get the horn you already like fixed back up to tip top state. That saves you $750 right now that you can spend on lessons or maybe a step up mouthpiece, (or just keep it in the bank), and in a while if you want to make a change and step up to a better horn you will be able to sell your fixed up horn for a reasonable return.

 

[JayeLID]

Yes, I have tried to send to a repair tech, and I got an estimate of about 250 dollars. I paid only 300 dollars for the sax, I thought might as well get a new one if repairing it would be near the cost of the sax when I bought it.

Also, I don't think "fixed" was the right word I chose, I just got it back in playing condition. Most of the damage on my 667 is on the bell, its been bent a lot really. I managed to bend into an alright shape, but low notes are just as great as before. Really stupid drop by me. I still play it tho, its sounds great. I just thought might as well get another sax.

Now you get into a completely different conversation, however. Because market value has NOTHING to do with value as an instrument when it comes to Jupiters.

Jupes have incredibly low used market values. This has been discussed here before. It is completely illogical, really, because their KHS factories are arguably the best as far as quality-control of any asian factory which makes many different models of horn.

So a used Jupe is always gonna be worth more as someone's personal horn than as an item for sale. Sadly, I have stopped refurbishing Jupes because not only os making a profit impossible....they are actually money-losers for a refurbisher such as myself.

Again there is little logic to it...many 'popular' brands/models with better resale values are inferior to a Jupe made after around 1999.

Soooooooo.....as noted in the previous comment, your Jupe, with a bent bell, really DOES have almost zero market value right now....interestingly, if it had a body with only moderate wear but completely shot pads, it would probably be worth around $200. But a playing horn with an aesthetically/visually gnarly bit of damage like bell damage ? Worth perhaps $80 or so....

Sooooo...your consideration, while it may seem reasonable - "the work will exceed the (market) value of the horn"....is actually a bit off. Because the horn is a better instrument than its market value indicates.

Also.....did I understand this correctly ? $250 to fix bell damage ? That is incredibly high (unless the bell brace is impacted into the tube or the back of the bell). A tech with a decent set of dent rollers should be able to straighten a bell in about an hour....not to perfection, but certainly getting the geometry correct.

I was just making the suggestion because

a) I LIKE Jupiters (as a repairer, they are solid horns)

b) $1000-1200 expenditure may not get you a better horn than your current one (unless you start looking at used horns) - so you would have paid $1200 when a $250-300 repair would have resulted in you having a better player.