[DaveMcC]

I am having an issue and don't know what is causing it as it hasn't happened before and only recently started showing up. I have a Yamaha YAS-280 alto saxophone and have had issues with sticky pads, see this thread: https://forum.saxontheweb.net/showt...nent-sticking-pads-on-Yamaha-YAS-280-alto-sax The sticky pads are still present and I have not been able to fix it at all no matter what I have tried, but that isn't the only issue now.

Twice now when I play a G note it barely comes out and it will only will when I play an F then try the G again which fixes it for a while but has returned but often it doesn't. It doesn't happen straight away, only after 10+ minutes of playing.

I have tried a Selmer S80 C** and JodyJazz HR* 6M mouthpieces and get it happening with both. I play on Legere Studio Cut 2.5 reeds on both mouthpieces and a Rovner Dark ligature which I am thinking of replacing with a different ligature. Does anyone know what is going on? Could it be the reed starting to get soft? Despite the sticky pads, all other notes come out OK, so maybe not if for some reason it is just that one note that has this issue. I ordered a new reed so just waiting on it arriving.

 

[saxoclese]

It sounds as if there might not be a positive closing of the G# key. Closing the F key temporarily presses the G# key cup down by way of the adjustment arm which could account for that helping momentarily. The best way to check is with a leak light in a darkened room or to take it to a tech for an inspection. A common cause of a light G# closing is that the low B or C# touch pieces are not allowing the G# touch to come up all the way. Look under the LH table and slowly press down on the low B and then the low C# keys to see if there is a bit of movement before the key touches the tab extending from the G#. This is referred to as "lost motion" and a LH table in good adjustment should have a small amount in order for the G# key to have its full upward travel.

If this is diagnosed as the problem, there is a DIY fix for those who are brave enough to try it. That is to hold the G# touch down and then with the other hand very carefully push down on the arm that extends from the key that closes the G# key cup. The goal is to bend the arm downever so slightly till you can feel the lost motion mentioned earlier. If you go too far and create too much lost motion, simply use your thumb and pry the arm back up slightly. Sometimes it takes a bit of back and forth to get it just right even for experienced techs. There are more complicated issues that might be related such as bell key guards that are bent down, but this simple fix that may help get the sax playing again until it can be looked at by a professional.

 

[Gordon (NZ)]

As per what Saxoclese wrote.

Another slight possibility:
Perhaps there is some jamming in the octave mechanism, such that the lower vent is not closed properly unless the G key is open.
But the F key's involvement would be a bit more obscure. F may be a little less fussy about a slight leak at the octave vent. So you adjust your embouchure/breath pressure for F to work, and that helps a bit with G.

For diagnosis:
While the G is problematic, press on the G# pad cup to see if Saxclese's suggestion is correct.
While the G is problematic, press on the lower octave vent key cup to see if my other possibility is involved.

 

[Gordon (NZ)]

As per what Saxoclese wrote.

Another slight possibility:
Perhaps there is some jamming in the octave mechanism, such that the lower vent is not closed properly unless the G key is open.
But the F key's involvement would be a bit more obscure. F may be a little less fussy about a slight leak at the octave vent. So you adjust your embouchure/breath pressure for F to work, and that helps a bit with G.

For diagnosis:
While playing a problematic G, press on the G# pad cup to see if Saxclese's suggestion is correct.
While playing a problematic G, press on the lower octave vent key cup to see if my other possibility is involved.

 

[DaveMcC]

As per what Saxoclese wrote.

Another slight possibility:
Perhaps there is some jamming in the octave mechanism, such that the lower vent is not closed properly unless the G key is open.
But the F key's involvement would be a bit more obscure. F may be a little less fussy about a slight leak at the octave vent. So you adjust your embouchure/breath pressure for F to work, and that helps a bit with G.

For diagnosis:
While the G is problematic, press on the G# pad cup to see if Saxclese's suggestion is correct.
While the G is problematic, press on the lower octave vent key cup to see if my other possibility is involved.

I am wondering if this is the issue with the octave key/vent. When I was playing the G note today, it seemed OK until I tried playing a middle G with the octave key and it wouldn't come out but playing an F with the octave key didn't temporarily fix that issue like it does without the octave key pressed. I have attached a recording I made today so you can hear the problem as the notes without the octave key pressed seemed to come out fine this time but not with the octave key: View attachment 241500

Update: I slightly tightened the F# adjustment screws to make the low notes come out better and it seems the issue with the G key I was getting hasn't returned, haven't played long enough since to know for sure, but could the adjustment screws have caused the issue?

 

[Gordon (NZ)]

Any one of dozens of things could cause the issue. Only the most likely have been presented.
That's why we use a leak light for primary diagnosis, and only turn screws to exactly where they should be, rather than guessing.

Both the F#/G# and octave area mechanisms are by far the most demanding area of sax adjustment.

For octave mechanism stuff, this may help: https://www.saxontheweb.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=312749#post312749

 

[clarnibass]

Do you mean the screws that adjust the closing of F# (top top key of lower stack) by any of the other lower stack keys? This shouldn't have any effect on G since all of these keys remain open anyway. Unless it was so far out that F# was very low (making G stuffy), but that would mean the lower stack keys wouldn't close at all (if those adjusting screw are what corrected it).

 

[Alain Gen]

I am wondering if this is the issue with the octave key/vent. When I was playing the G note today, it seemed OK until I tried playing a middle G with the octave key and it wouldn't come out but playing an F with the octave key didn't temporarily fix that issue like it does without the octave key pressed. I have attached a recording I made today so you can hear the problem as the notes without the octave key pressed seemed to come out fine this time but not with the octave key: View attachment 241500

Update: I slightly tightened the F# adjustment screws to make the low notes come out better and it seems the issue with the G key I was getting hasn't returned, haven't played long enough since to know for sure, but could the adjustment screws have caused the issue?

I don't know why it does it (quite difficult without seeing and playing the horn), but on G with the octave key, the G jumps to the twelfth (=octave+fifth) instead of jumping to the octave as expected. I suspect your embouchure may be part of the problem (I can hear it is quite tight on the high notes).

It would be a good idea to pay a visit to a tech. The issues you encounter seem to be complex and not the kind of problems that can be sorted by a DIY modification after a discussion on a sax forum.