[SuperAction80]

I was out at the local jazz club this weekend, and heard a gentleman playing traditional swing on alto and clarinet. The alto just simply projected. It had a very sweet and complex sound that filled the entire room. There was a PA, and the microphone was just a simple SM58. Nothing elaborate, but the tone was simply amazing. It was clearly a 20's horn with silver plate and split bell keys. After they finished up their set, I chatted with the saxophonist for a little bit, and guessed that it was a True Tone, based upon from what I could see from the other side of the room. Sure enough, it was a 1924 True Tone. I did not study the neck to see which version it had, but the front F was present, and the action felt as good as they can on these horns. They're not modern, but they are arguably the best of the era by a good deal, and are quite comfortable. He was using a modern production Slant Link, and we were discussing the misconception about these horns. They're not just these quiet and quaint little vintage saxophones that you can find in abundance. In fact, they're extremely versatile even when compared to modern standards. We both agreed that if you think that a True Tone sounds compact, then you have a horn with leaks. He uses the same setup in modern groups, and I don't blame him. He easily has one of the best alto tones I've come across in quite a while. Bottom line, these are about as abundant on the second hand market as Yamaha student horns. If you find one in good condition, I'd say anything with that front F, give it a chance. These are absolute gems, and they're cheap. And even if you have to factor in the price of an overhaul, they're still inexpensive when considering exactly what they can keep up with.

 

[Tryptykon]

..

 

[Tryptykon]

Had Conn NW II and TT altos at the same time back in '89 and seemed to prefer
the TT, which surprised me.

Now I have a '34 New Aristocrat (# 3 neck) which is sort of last in that line.

 

[KennyZ]

Great
So, if it gets stolen, with $300 you get another one in 5 minutes

 

[Tryptykon]

 

[pontius]

I think also a tone edge on alto is going to be more spread and beefy compared to the Meyer type piece that most alto players seem to want to play.

 

[JL]

My first horn, back in high school (late '60s), was a late '20s TT alto and I still have it! And yeah, it has the tone. Some years back, when I had a Custom Yamaha alto, just for the heck of it, I pulled out the TT and was surprised and blown away when it sounded much better that the Yamaha. I even did a 'blindfold test' with my wife in the other room and she immediately identified the Buescher as having a superior tone quality. I sold the Yamaha shortly after that. Nowadays I mostly play tenor, but still have that TT here if I ever get tempted to pull it out.

 

[Grumps]

I picked up mine on a whim, as the clarinetist for my father's band had one, it was cheap and I figured why not. Next thing you know, it's my go to alto for rock, pop or jazz and my SBA was sold in short order. Not sure if this is compact, or not compact, but here's how it sounds:

https://soundcloud.com/akagrumps%2Fdont-get-around-much-anymore

 

[Tryptykon]

I picked up mine on a whim, as the clarinetist for my father's band had one, it was cheap and I figured why not. Next thing you know, it's my go to alto for rock, pop or jazz and my SBA was sold in short order. Not sure if this is compact, or not compact, but here's how it sounds:

https://soundcloud.com/akagrumps%2Fdont-get-around-much-anymore

You're a terrible musician .

 

[super20dan]

just for kicks i used my truetone with a dukoff on a gig once. worked great sounded awesume

 

[Nathan Bellott]

is that a common opinion, that they have a compact sound? Never heard that and hasn't been my experience. I have a 1925 silver played TT alto that's a monster, it's not even in good shape. Personally I think the American horns from the 20s,30s,40s scream.

 

[Hassles]

I tell many tales here about a young local player I support. I visited her one morning with my TT alto, she'd never seen such an old horn. I suggested she play a long note. I said "play a long note, doesn't matter which one, your choice, just play it as long as you can" - which was a long time. When she'd finished she turned to look at me and said "wow, I wasn't expecting that". And yeah, the TTs voice will fill a room!

 

[Hornlip]

A TT alto in good playing shape was the first split-bell horn I ever had. Great horn, played it on rock & roll gigs. Pretty sure people could hear me. Tickles me that they haven’t been made for 90 years and the vintage market is still flooded with ’em. Currently I have three.

 

[turf3]

Define "compact sound", please.

 

[Grumps]

Define "compact sound", please.

Ever heard the horn of a Kia?

 

[SuperAction80]

Define "compact sound", please.

It's a meaningless, almost marketing like, term I've seen used when describing these horns for years. Reading between the lines, I think that the issue is that most players who perpetuate this myth have old horns that are leaking. Apparently the myth worked in most of the gigging world. This is the first time I've ever seen a True Tone out on a gig, and granted guys like this gentleman and Grumps will make anything sound good. However, there's a certain richness brought on by these larger bores that is lost in modern production horns that are usually chasing the Selmer design.

I've had a New Wonder alto since High School, and have played enough examples of the NWI and II on both alto and tenor to understand what I do and don't like about them. Most of that boils down to keywork, and consistency of tone. IMO, Conn really didn't start getting it all together until the New Wonder II around 1924, and their altos were most certainly more refined than the tenors. Buescher was already ahead of the curve in terms of keywork, but the more I'm hearing what the mid 1920's TT's can do when they're well regulated, the more impressed by them I am. Given their price point, and versatility, they're most certainly a great option for aspiring professional musicians on a budget.

 

[Bottle Opener]

However, there's a certain richness brought on by these larger bores that is lost in modern production horns that are usually chasing the Selmer design.

According to measurements by M. Postma, the Buescher TT alto is pretty much the same bore profile as Selmer and modern Japanese instruments.

- M. Postma :::: saxophones, mouthpieces & acoustics

sax.mpostma.nl

 

[SuperAction80]

According to measurements by M. Postma, the Buescher TT alto is pretty much the same bore profile as Selmer and modern Japanese instruments.

- M. Postma :::: saxophones, mouthpieces & acoustics

sax.mpostma.nl

I recall reading that the TT was the closest to the original Adolphe Sax designs, however Selmer did end up purchasing both AS and Buescher, so that may be right. I have a Buescher 156 in the shop, and have always liked the Aristocrat design, because I can switch back and fourth so easily between my Selmer and any series of Aristocrat. Ergos are different, and there are a slew of changes brought on by venting choices, ergonomics, and tone hole sizes. Ultimately, what you have to put in is about the same, but what you get out is wildly different. It may be the same case with Buescher and the average Selmer. But here's the thing. What era of Selmer are we talking about? Modern production? Long Bow VI? Short Bow VI? Modified low note gurgling SBA and Mark VI with pieces of metal molded into the bodies? Low A VI altos? Selmer still modifies their horns as they see fit. Buescher did this too, but to a largely lesser extent. The necks on the TT changed rather drastically throughout the latter run of the series, but the body tubes and bells seem to be mostly the same. The biggest changes occurred whenever the Front F became standard equipment.

Do you have a link to M. Postma's charts? I came across a measurement chart on all major models years back, and the results were pretty fascinating. By in large, these horns certainly have more in common than not, but those little tweaks can change the playing experience. Ultimately, a sax is only as good as its condition and player. I'm mostly commenting on these being very ergonomically sophisticated for their time, and they're quite a bargain.

 

[turf3]

According to measurements by M. Postma, the Buescher TT alto is pretty much the same bore profile as Selmer and modern Japanese instruments.

- M. Postma :::: saxophones, mouthpieces & acoustics

sax.mpostma.nl

Yes, looking at those ACTUAL MEASUREMENTS is very interesting, especially when someone repeats some statement about "such and such a horn has a large bore" that they heard nineteenth hand from some tech who's never held a vernier caliper in his hand; and you look up the ACTUAL MEASUREMENTS and find the thing's actually SMALLER than average...

 

[Grumps]

The necks on the TT changed rather drastically throughout the latter run of the series...

I thought the neck options for True Tone altos didn't arrive until the New Aristocrat, Buescher's last split bell design. But if anyone has a late run True Tone alto with an original neck that has anything on it other than a single digit 1, I'd be all ears.

I have an Aristocrat 01 neck on mine, and yeah, I got lucky. Prior to that, my horn had the common quirk of playing sharp up top. For more on that, here's an old thread on the topic:

Buescher 1 01: Neck Trial w/ TT | Sax on the Web Forum