Sax on the Web Forum banner

1 - 20 of 22 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
40 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I'm seeking for CONN curved soprano but I found that there are so many different choice , such as "CG Conn" or "Conn Stencil " or "Conn Selmer New York" or "Conn Selmer American" .... Could any master tell me the differences and the way to choose a good one , I would like to find one as my long-term instrument .
Thanks so much !! :)
 

·
Moderator
Grafton alto | Martin Comm III tenor
Joined
·
28,936 Posts
I may be wrong, but I don't think any of the Conn Selmer are vintage.

A Conn stencil is made by Conn but with some other brand name, ie it came from the Conn factory and made for another company. Some stencils are supposedly not so good as the Conn brand production models, best to try before buying but you may get one that is as good as the actual Conns for a bargain price.

So that leaves the actual Conn vintage sopranos. Presumably you've played one, hence the reason you want one, very nice little horns, I had one for a while.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
40 Posts
Discussion Starter #3

·
Moderator
Grafton alto | Martin Comm III tenor
Joined
·
28,936 Posts
That appears to be older than the one I had, it's a Wonder as opposed to later New Wonder, which is what I had and I believe may be more desirable (I'm sure someone who is more of a Conn expert will come along and correct me if I'm wrong). It's certainly a Pro model but may need some work doing to it.

The pictures are poor so it's hard to tell the condition. I'd be a bit wary, the seller mentions repairs carried out, but doesn't show them in the photos.
 

·
Forum Contributor 2013-2017
Joined
·
688 Posts
Ah, seduced by the Conn sound, eh? If it's any consolation, there are quite a few of us here who love our Conn curved sopranos, I myself play a vintage stencil from 1921-22 and there's nothing like it, even if it's not the most in tune horn in the world.

To help you out: any vintage Conn soprano labeled as such, whether straight or vintage, will NOT be a "beginner" model. In reality, neither are the "second line" or "stencil" Conn sopranos beginner horns -- in that era, these may have simpler mechanics, perhaps straight instead of rolled tone holes on all or most of the holes, but the bore of the horn and everything else are the same as any Conn.

The particular horn you're looking at is a "real" vintage Conn curved soprano with the works -- it looks pretty nice, from the rather small photos the silver plate looks like it's held up quite well although the seller does mention minor work done, and the price is actually quite good. For now. It might, and should, go higher, but you never know in this depressed market. As others will tell you, without being able to play the horn before buying, it's a risk -- I'm sure you know how Ebay works. I guess you've also noticed another Conn stencil for sale in Ebay for a much higher starting price.

To end, I have no idea what Conn-Selmer horns are like, but I do know that they are NOT on par, and that's putting it mildly, with the great vintage Conns.

Hope the above helps.

BTW, you didn't become interested in a Conn curvy because of Dave Koz, did you? I know he plays one from the early 1920s and has a huge following in Asia.

Good luck,
Kenneth
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member/Technician
Joined
·
21,033 Posts
That ebay horn seems to be pretty good. Conn curvies come in a few varieties:
Wonder and other models before the late teens with the slightly curved necks - OK horns but watch out for high pitched models marked H.
New Wonder series one - Like that ebay horn with a normal thumbrest up to about 1922 and a ring after that.
New Wonder series two (Chu Berry) - Thumb ring, nailfile G#, about the same as the previous model but command more money.
Pan-American and stencils - No rolled tone holes. Great horns for the money. Common as Wurlitzer, Selmer NY and other brands. Compare photos to be sure.
Modern Conn and Selmer ones made in China.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
40 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
Oh , thanks master ! really helps a lot ! I want find a CONN only because I've tried my friend's before , but for your information , Dave Koz is really HOT in Asia especially Japan and Korea . Many Thanks !
(Bad news , the seller do not sell it internationally :()
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
40 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
Oh , thanks master ! really helps a lot ! I want find a CONN only because I've tried my friend's before , but for your information , Dave Koz is really HOT in Asia especially Japan and Korea . Many Thanks !
(Bad news , the seller do not sell it internationally )
Ah, seduced by the Conn sound, eh? If it's any consolation, there are quite a few of us here who love our Conn curved sopranos, I myself play a vintage stencil from 1921-22 and there's nothing like it, even if it's not the most in tune horn in the world.

To help you out: any vintage Conn soprano labeled as such, whether straight or vintage, will NOT be a "beginner" model. In reality, neither are the "second line" or "stencil" Conn sopranos beginner horns -- in that era, these may have simpler mechanics, perhaps straight instead of rolled tone holes on all or most of the holes, but the bore of the horn and everything else are the same as any Conn.

The particular horn you're looking at is a "real" vintage Conn curved soprano with the works -- it looks pretty nice, from the rather small photos the silver plate looks like it's held up quite well although the seller does mention minor work done, and the price is actually quite good. For now. It might, and should, go higher, but you never know in this depressed market. As others will tell you, without being able to play the horn before buying, it's a risk -- I'm sure you know how Ebay works. I guess you've also noticed another Conn stencil for sale in Ebay for a much higher starting price.

To end, I have no idea what Conn-Selmer horns are like, but I do know that they are NOT on par, and that's putting it mildly, with the great vintage Conns.

Hope the above helps.

BTW, you didn't become interested in a Conn curvy because of Dave Koz, did you? I know he plays one from the early 1920s and has a huge following in Asia.

Good luck,
Kenneth
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
40 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
IC , may I know what Low Pitch means ? is it at Tenor's range ?
Many Thanks !!
That ebay horn seems to be pretty good. Conn curvies come in a few varieties:
Wonder and other models before the late teens with the slightly curved necks - OK horns but watch out for high pitched models marked H.
New Wonder series one - Like that ebay horn with a normal thumbrest up to about 1922 and a ring after that.
New Wonder series two (Chu Berry) - Thumb ring, nailfile G#, about the same as the previous model but command more money.
Pan-American and stencils - No rolled tone holes. Great horns for the money. Common as Wurlitzer, Selmer NY and other brands. Compare photos to be sure.
Modern Conn and Selmer ones made in China.
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member
Joined
·
2,319 Posts
IC , may I know what Low Pitch means ? is it at Tenor's range ?
Many Thanks !!
Low pitch means A is measured at 440hz on a tuner as opposed to high pitch (465hz) where the A as well as all the other notes would play considerably sharper, and not be able to match other modern instruments and won't play in tune. You'd always be sharp. It has nothing to do with the size of the horn or sounding like an alto or tenor. Low pitch (L) is good!!! A tenor and an alto can also have an L for low pitch engraved on them as well.
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member
Joined
·
743 Posts
This is a genuine vintage Conn with rolled tone holes. I have a stencil of this horn (with straight tone holes), and it plays great after a fresh repad and adjustment. These are very flexible horns for pitch, so you will need to develop a precise embouchure as you learn with your ear what each note needs. Soon you will respond automatically to what the instrument needs to play in tune, but that flexibility will enable you to work with tonal changes (what your tone sounds like at any given moment) and pitch variability (jazzy bends, and minor adjustments to keep a melodic passage in tune from note to note). This is a very well made original case; most curved sopranos from the 1920's have cases with no padding and very little support for the instrument.
My stencil says "Bruno Perfection, New York". Bruno was a local music store that purchased horns from Conn with their own name engraved upon them.
Mine is brass and lacquer, but the silver plate looks very good on this one. You are lucky so far that no one has bid upon it with only 2 days to go in the auction.
Good luck!
Sax Magic
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member/Technician
Joined
·
21,033 Posts
For reference, the curved Conn I have similar to the ebay horn cost me $500 (I have connections from other shops) and I did a redo (about $700 if I charged it out) which is still pretty cheap. I think that ebay one will top $1,500. Great horns and equal to the Martins except the Conn will go to high F. The ebay one has the odd palm keys which many don't like and is similar to the Selmer style. Mine has the ones like an alto.
I would say to buy any New Wonder curvie and buy by condition and price. There aren't a lot out there so find a nice one. It costs the same to redo a nice original that it costs to redo a dog.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
40 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
Low pitch means A is measured at 440hz on a tuner as opposed to high pitch (465hz) where the A as well as all the other notes would play considerably sharper, and not be able to match other modern instruments and won't play in tune. You'd always be sharp. It has nothing to do with the size of the horn or sounding like an alto or tenor. Low pitch (L) is good!!! A tenor and an alto can also have an L for low pitch engraved on them as well.
ic , that means the Low pitch is match to the modern horn ! Good , thank you !
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
40 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
This is a genuine vintage Conn with rolled tone holes. I have a stencil of this horn (with straight tone holes), and it plays great after a fresh repad and adjustment. These are very flexible horns for pitch, so you will need to develop a precise embouchure as you learn with your ear what each note needs. Soon you will respond automatically to what the instrument needs to play in tune, but that flexibility will enable you to work with tonal changes (what your tone sounds like at any given moment) and pitch variability (jazzy bends, and minor adjustments to keep a melodic passage in tune from note to note). This is a very well made original case; most curved sopranos from the 1920's have cases with no padding and very little support for the instrument.
My stencil says "Bruno Perfection, New York". Bruno was a local music store that purchased horns from Conn with their own name engraved upon them.
Mine is brass and lacquer, but the silver plate looks very good on this one. You are lucky so far that no one has bid upon it with only 2 days to go in the auction.
Good luck!
Sax Magic
Thanks for your reply , but the bad news is the owner didn't ship it internationally as I'm from HK , I tried to contact him directly but it fail ...:cry:
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member
Joined
·
743 Posts
kevin5b,
Sorry to hear that you were unable to bid on it due to the shipping issue. My Bruno stencil is like Bruce's, in that it has the alto-style left hand palm keys instead of the Selmer style. Keep an eye out, as these show up on eBay more than they used to do. Heed Bruce's advice, and buy one chosen by condition, because you will likely require a repad anyway. Good luck on the hunt!
Sax Magic
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member/Logician
Joined
·
25,985 Posts

·
Distinguished SOTW Member
Joined
·
6,831 Posts
1 - 20 of 22 Posts
Top