[spaceaje]

Hi all,

I've been playing Vandoren's my whole life and am wanting to try some Rigottis after hearing good things about them in terms of strength/quality consistency. The Vandoren's have been wildly inconsistent and frankly don't have time to be messing around with them. What would be an equivalent strength comparison for Vandoren Blue Box 2 to the Rigotti reed strength?

 

[skeller047]

Two things.

If you are taking a lot of time to adjust reeds, you’re doing it wrong. It’s not difficult, I and many others have posted our procedures many times here.

Rigotti reeds will require adjustment too. As will any other brand. Inconsistency is a fact of life. Since reeds are derived from living things, they are subject to the same facts…

To answer your question directly, add 1/2 strength. So a Vandoren 2 will be equivalent to a Rigotti Jazz 2.5, probably a medium or hard sub-strength.

I don’t know about Rigotti Classic reeds.

 

[Sacks Of Phones]

You could try looking up comparison charts on this internet thing yourself.

 

[FisherSax]

What Steve said. Also, see for yourself here:

https://www.vanguardorchestral.co.nz/reed-comparison-charts/

 

[swperry1]

The 2.5M or S (strong) is probably a good start. It’s a really different blow and will take a bit to get used to. Weiner Music sells 5-packs for tenor, which is nice for sampling.

I played all the Rigotti and Vandoren reeds in 2022 and play Rigotti Red 3.5M as my go to. I prefer maybe one sub-grade stiffer (3.5S) in the Blue Rigotti, but they’re close in playing feel (free blowing and super responsive) despite playing and sounding slightly different.
When I was going through the Vandoren Classical cuts I actually liked the blue/ traditional 2.5 better than the 3 (that the comp chart says I should pick). That said…if you’re just frustrated with the blue box Vandos and want to stay in the family, try the V21. I found them more responsive and colorful/ lively than the blues. They’re actually my second favorite Vando reed behind the Java Red.

 

[spaceaje]

The 2.5M or S (strong) is probably a good start. It’s a really different blow and will take a bit to get used to. Weiner Music sells 5-packs for tenor, which is nice for sampling.

I played all the Rigotti and Vandoren reeds in 2022 and play Rigotti Red 3.5M as my go to. I prefer maybe one sub-grade stiffer (3.5S) in the Blue Rigotti, but they’re close in playing feel (free blowing and super responsive) despite playing and sounding slightly different.
When I was going through the Vandoren Classical cuts I actually liked the blue/ traditional 2.5 better than the 3 (that the comp chart says I should pick). That said…if you’re just frustrated with the blue box Vandos and want to stay in the family, try the V21. I found them more responsive and colorful/ lively than the blues. They’re actually my second favorite Vando reed behind the Java Red.

Thanks for the info! Good to know Weiner has them in boxes of 5. I've really never left the Vandoren family since I've studied with Vandoren endorsed artists (so I followed suit). Might check out the V21s too.

 

[spaceaje]

You could try looking up comparison charts on this internet thing yourself.

I did. Couldn't find one that compared blue box 2s to rigottis. Thought it would be easier to consult the forum.

 

[swperry1]

Thanks for the info! Good to know Weiner has them in boxes of 5. I've really never left the Vandoren family since I've studied with Vandoren endorsed artists (so I followed suit). Might check out the V21s too.

Have you tried the green and red Java reeds? If you like the greens, try the Rigotti blue; their sizes are an even swap.

 

[spaceaje]

Two things.

If you are taking a lot of time to adjust reeds, you’re doing it wrong. It’s not difficult, I and many others have posted our procedures many times here.

Rigotti reeds will require adjustment too. As will any other brand. Inconsistency is a fact of life. Since reeds are derived from living things, they are subject to the same facts…

To answer your question directly, add 1/2 strength. So a Vandoren 2 will be equivalent to a Rigotti Jazz 2.5, probably a medium or hard sub-strength.

I don’t know about Rigotti Classic reeds.

It's not that I'm taking a lot of time to adjust my reeds, or don't know how to, it's just that I'd rather not have to as often. If another kind of reed is significantly more consistent, I'm all for it! That's at least what I've heard about the Rigottis.

 

[Mgmarcus]

Hi all,

I've been playing Vandoren's my whole life and am wanting to try some Rigottis after hearing good things about them in terms of strength/quality consistency. The Vandoren's have been wildly inconsistent and frankly don't have time to be messing around with them. What would be an equivalent strength comparison for Vandoren Blue Box 2 to the Rigotti reed strength?

I have been playing Rigotti Gold for about the past year and generally like them, but I don't find them any more consistent than other brand. Reeds gonna reed. I wouldn't say they're better than other reeds I've tried, but different in a rewarding way. Anyway, here is a post on Rigotti reed strengths from Steve Neff's excellent sax gear blog:

Rigotti Gold Reed Strength Comparison

Steve Neff's review of 6 Rigotti Reed strengths on a Phil-Tone Mosaic tenor saxophone mouthpiece.

www.neffmusic.com

 

[swperry1]

It's not that I'm taking a lot of time to adjust my reeds, or don't know how to, it's just that I'd rather not have to as often. If another kind of reed is significantly more consistent, I'm all for it! That's at least what I've heard about the Rigottis.

If it’s that you find too many are too hard or soft, going to a more precise grading should help.
If you’re consistently finding them unbalanced or not quality enough, I suppose that would definitely warrant a brand change.
If you find you’re consistently working the same spots to bring out certain things, moving the heart, cutting the bark(filing), or otherwise making “structural changes; you’re playing the wrong cut for sure. Have fun…also…how long has this been going on? Were you good on the blues and now they all just suck? Have you had your horn serviced lately? A few leaks in key places can change how everything feels.

 

[spaceaje]

Have you tried the green and red Java reeds? If you like the greens, try the Rigotti blue; their sizes are an even swap.

I have. They respond very well but are a bit too buzzy for me.

If it’s that you find too many are too hard or soft, going to a more precise grading should help.
If you’re consistently finding them unbalanced or not quality enough, I suppose that would definitely warrant a brand change.
If you find you’re consistently working the same spots to bring out certain things, moving the heart, cutting the bark(filing), or otherwise making “structural changes; you’re playing the wrong cut for sure. Have fun…also…how long has this been going on? Were you good on the blues and now they all just suck? Have you had your horn serviced lately? A few leaks in key places can change how everything feels.

Yeah I had the horn overhauled in December and went back a couple times for adjustments so I'm good on that front. I switched back to the blues recently so not too long. I had played them for years in the past. Maybe just running into a bad bunch. The ones that play are great!

 

[Sacks Of Phones]

I did. Couldn't find one that compared blue box 2s to rigottis. Thought it would be easier to consult the forum.

Very well. Carry on and good luck.

 

[swperry1]

I have. They respond very well but are a bit too buzzy for me.

Yeah I had the horn overhauled in December and went back a couple times for adjustments so I'm good on that front. I switched back to the blues recently so not too long. I had played them for years in the past. Maybe just running into a bad bunch. The ones that play are great!

You might like the red better in the Rigotti then…less buzz/ edge, but they play and sound way closer to the green java and Rigotti blue than they are to the Vandorens you’re playing. There are other reeds that come graded more precisely than 1/2 strengths, maybe they’re worth looking into.

 

[OLIVIERMOJOSAX]

• 
  

• Otto link super tone master 7*. That's my go-to classic tenor sound. From John Coltrane to dexter gordon and everything in between

  "To answer your question directly, add 1/2 strength. So a Vandoren 2 will be equivalent to a Rigotti Jazz 2.5, probably a medium or hard sub-strength.
  
  I don’t know about Rigotti Classic reeds".

• 
  I agree with you that BLUE Rigotti are 1/2 force softer than BLUE VANDOREN.
• 
  
• But RED RIGOTTI are 1/2 Force stronger than the Blue GOLD Rigotti so = equal to Blue Vandoren.
• 
  
• And the Red one is a lot similar to blue Vandoren in qualities and sound but they offer a better calibration with their 3 sizes (S/M/H).

 

[swperry1]

• 
  
• 
  
• 
  I agree with you that BLUE Rigotti are 1/2 force softer than BLUE VANDOREN.
• 
  
• But RED RIGOTTI are 1/2 Force stronger than the Blue GOLD Rigotti so = equal to Blue Vandoren.
• 
  
• And the Red one is a lot similar to blue Vandoren in qualities and sound but they offer a better calibration with their 3 sizes (S/M/H).

I suppose individual results vary, but I disagree with everything you say about the Rigotti reds. They really don’t feel or respond much like the Vandoren blues at all. I’ve played the 3.5M on tenor for about three years. A Vandoren Blue box 3.5 is almost unplayable. Some 3’s are too stiff while some 2.5’s are too soft. A 2.75 Blue Vando would be even with my familiar 3.5M Rigotti red for me. When I play Rigotti Blue I choose a 3.5 Strong…just one sub-grade different. I realize the Rigotti strength chart supports what you say about being a 1/2 strength stiffer than their other Rigotti …it also ends halfway through the range of their most popular reed, so it’s not more reliable than what I’ve learned playing their reeds almost exclusively for ten years. It’s important to try everything you’re interested in if you can. I played through about 30 boxes of Rigotti and Vandoren reeds last year seeing what I might like better and ended up changing nothing.

 

[OLIVIERMOJOSAX]

This is what I say in my message: The Rigotti are much more regular in their calibration and their qualities. But as far as the timbre is concerned, they seem to me quite close to the blue Vandorens which are indeed very irregular. For my part, I play blue Rigotti 3 L, 3M and rarely 3S for over twenty years. I haven't tested the 3.5 much.

Each time I wanted to retest the blue Vandoren, I was not comfortable. Only green Java 3 seem vaguely interesting to me.