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training techniques

6187 Views 46 Replies 12 Participants Last post by  marton
i've been tootling along on my tenor for about a month to six weeks now.

at first, i was just really amazed at how easy it was to just whip up and down a scale and how great it sounded. but then, i started playing along to cd's - about a week ago - and my technique has taken a quantum leap! it's rather amazing at how quickly i progressed just from that.

now, i'm going to go to a jam session i set up. two bass players, a drummer and me. i'm a huge, massive ornette coleman fan, and by that i don't mean i'm obese.
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also going to jam with some guys that have played the wangaratta jazz festival here - lotsa big names have appeared there - and i don't mind telling you i'm nervous. i figure i'll sink or swim so what the hell. what doesn't kill me etc etc yada yada

i've been playing tenor for four months.
hakukani said:
I suggest letting them know that Ornette is one of your influences--before you play.
hahah.........they know. i was invited to play with these guys full-time in another *musical* lifetime, back when i played amplified violin.

i'm just gonna have fun with it.
besides, ornette should be given the pulitzer. oh you mean he was given the pulitzer? how about that.
yeah yeah

my point being that i'm there to learn. you guys are just so supportive. love ya.
i'm sure you'll get over it.
yeah whatever

look, fact is i've never said i've got it all covered. just because i'm enthusiastic and or confident doesn't mean a lot in terms of technique grasped.

fact is í haven't got it all covered and after thirty years of violin playing i'm well aware of how long it takes to just get proficient let alone claim mastery.

i'm excited about placing myself in situations that are going to stretch me. if you don't think that's a good idea then stiff, because i do.
impressed? no you weren't supposed to be impressed. i'm posting a sort of journal of sorts here. thanks for the well wishes.
hakukani said:
No offense meant, but this ain't psych on the web.;)

Sax players don't generally take kindly to cats who think they have the instrument mastered in a couple of months. Sorry.
maybe you and other "cats" like you need to make sure about what's being said before you say anything.
hey i'll tell ya. i don't care to conform to your grumpy old standards. if you don't like what i'm saying in a thread i started then that's like you know .. stiff.

i'm sure you have lots of friends you can go complain to.
Dog Pants said:
Whoa the f*** up there horsey!!!


Fist things first, G'day and welcome and all that.


just to clear the air here, Hak wasn't really having a go at you [sounded like it to me]....until you got stroppy and started carrying on like a big girl's blouse. <- that's nonsense. he didn't have to say a word about it but insisted on telling me how full of it i am because i'm enthusiastic about what i'm up to.] He's not a Richardhead, he's a nice bloke, and even after you've had a go at him,he'll still offer you all the help in the world. Pull your head in.[ditto to what i said prior]

Just a few tips, from one Aussie to another.

1. We are outnumbered on this forum by a zillion to one.

2. Most of the other people around here don't understand 50% of what we write. So it often happens, that people read things into a post that were not intended. Next thing you know, it's handbags at 10 paces.

3. Of the remaining 50% that do understand our language and colloquialisms, 45% of these find our humour incredibly offensive. The other 5% think were mad as a cut snake.

4. As an Aussie you are statistically 13.275 times more likely to be banned from this forum as omembers of other nationalities. [my life doesn't depend on whether or not i'm banned from this forum so whatever]
5. Most of the good horns and parts to keep them running, come from overseas. Many overseas sellers will only sell and ship locally. That's where having friends and contacts in the worldwide sax community pays a huge dividend. Making friendly with the Seppos and the Poms and the Krauts and the Frogs and the Dagoes, and the ***** and the Micks, etc, is just plain helpful. So try not to insult everyone, you never know when you'll need a friend. I'm proud to say I have friends in all the 3rd world countries I listed above. :D

6. The guys that play the Wangaratta Jazz festival are probably pretty decent players. Unless you spend big $$$ and get them all "smashed as a crab on a rock", you're gonna be in over your head. Big bollocks to you for having a go, but don't be upset at someone trying to offer a friendly warning. Just do the Aussie thing and have a laugh. [i have every intention of going to this jam, and i have every intention of learning as much as i can. whether or not i fall on my ****? meh. whatever, it's all education]

7. Don't listen to a word I've said. I'm probably not the best source of wisdom around here, on matters concerning forum behaviour.

Anyhow, welcome mate and do the right thing and drop Hak a PM.[you're kidding right? not a chance. he owes me an apology, not the other way round]
thanks for being reasonable anyway

i'll post an update on how i went when the jam's over. win lose or draw.
hakukani said:
First off, let me say that I am a HUGE fan of free jazz--from ornette, through Dolphy, Ayler, Brown, Sam Rivers etc. etc. other names you can think of.

I will apologize to you Marton, not for what I've said, but the fact that I believed you understood that guys that haven't played sax very long aren't going to play at the level of Ornette Coleman, plus I don't really think it's quite the place to start learning the horn--or about music.

I remember being a lot younger and thinking that 'free' meant 'unstructured' and doing my own 'thing'. I thought that I was misunderstood in my playing, and that all the mouldy figs just couldn't hear the naturalness in my improvisations.

After I stunk up a few bandstands, and scared a few old drunks at art 'happenings', I wised up and realized it was just that I really didn't really know what I was doing---this after I had been playing and studying for almost 20 years! It's now been 41 years, and I finally feel like I'm starting to get a handle on this music thing.

By all means have fun with your playing--I said that before. But why start a thread like this in a discussion forum as if it's your own blog---especially when we don't really know a thing about you--or you me, other than the fact that you had enough shekels to plonk down on a saxophone, and know some blokes to play with?
okay, thanks for this.

let's just clear things up here okay? i never once said i play like mr. coleman.

also, i defer to your - and all others - technical grasp of the sax is much better than mine.

BUT ...... i am going to do everything i can to get to where i can express myself through sax as clearly as is possible and as fast as is possible. if that includes "stinking up the bandstand" then i will stink up the bandstand.

i know you don't like to hear me refer to my past violin playing, but the fact that i've played in bands before on violin and on cd recordings which i can point you to on the web if you like, means that i have a little bit of understanding of musical morés. you'd give me that much wouldn't you? not that it matters to me whether you do or don't.

i'm head over heels in love with my tenor and i'm going to parade my relationship around town as much as i can and hope to deepen that relationship as time goes by. "as time goes by?" that reminds me.....i think i'll learn how to play it.

this isn't a blog i realise that, but it is a thread that i started and if i get attacked whether for real or perceptually, then i think you'd forgive me for responding.

anyway, i don't want bad blood if i can avoid it, so how about we just forget this incident and call it a misunderstanding?
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this thread passed into "purple monkey typewriter" territory on the first page so don't expect me to respond to any more posts.
Dog Pants said:
Aye, but reply you will. And sooner rather than later methinks. ;)

Despite your teenage protestations of "whatever," you do care, otherwise you wouldn't have blogged. Just because you didn't get the response you wanted, is no reason to carry on like a pork chop. You're Australian fer chrissakes. Get over it and get on with it. Nobody here is out to get you. You asked the question and got an honest answer. What did you expect? There's guys here that have been playing professionally since before you and I were born. Did you really think they were gonna blow their load over some newbie who's been playing for 4 months?

Put it behind you and get on with the game before you give the rest of us Aussies a bad reputation. :D
don't be silly. badly thought out responses by blithely oblivious people like yourself, are what gives you aussies a bad name.

want a cookie?
hmm, so far so good. jam went swimmingly....went so well we formed a band. sort of a funk jazz thing.

and i've booked a couple more informal jams with some other bands whose members are friends of mine

i suppose the point of this is that if you want a quick education in playing there's nothing better than playing with others.

feel free to jump on me yet again. *shrugs*
so i've been playing since september this year.

so far; playing in two bands. one is called faith in the distance, and i joined a couple weeks ago; they have a myspace.

yesterday i was asked to play on an upcoming recording for a duo called black and white mary; also have a myspace.

am i a freak?
hakukani said:
How much are they paying you?
it's the big time baby. they're paying me in vodka
hakukani said:
In that case, no, you're not a freak.
well that's a relief then.
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