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Which post should win the Topic of the month November, 2009 contest?

  • [post=902775]SOTW Blues recording[/post]

    Votes: 18 26.5%
  • [post=1276818]Blues in F Improvisation, Please help me out![/post]

    Votes: 10 14.7%
  • [post=1267641]Work Ethic and The Importance of having a great teacher![/post]

    Votes: 6 8.8%
  • [post=1272990]SOTW November 2009 Tune of the Month - Detour Ahead[/post]

    Votes: 8 11.8%
  • [post=1282872]Composers and their "Intentions"[/post]

    Votes: 8 11.8%
  • [post=87916]Rolled Tone Holes - Are They Better?[/post]

    Votes: 6 8.8%
  • [post=1276500]Sax-O-Thon 2009-2010..... IT's ON![/post]

    Votes: 8 11.8%
  • [post=1277106]Haynes Saxophone Manual[/post]

    Votes: 4 5.9%
  • [post=1283149]Selmer Scroll Shank Bari[/post]

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Remaining nominations cumulated

    Votes: 5 7.4%
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Distinguished SOTW Member, Forum Contributor 2011
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Of the 10 nominations, 4 are about gear in one way or another, but 1 of those is a manual for gear maintenance and another is about donating horns. The other 6 are about playing and teaching music.
 

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I just have one question for all of you: How many of you learned how to play the saxophone--or got better at doing it--from chatting about doing it on the Internet all day long (as opposed to actually doing it)?

Yes, as evidenced by the voting, it appears many are getting bored of asking and answering questions about gear and continuing to steer the forum in a different directions from what it originally started out to be, and that's fine. I just don't think it's the best medium for teaching and learning an instrument, and that there's still no substitute for a real teacher--who can listen and provide feedback--and time in the woodshed practicing and learning from your mistakes through trial and error.

And lastly, as far as my nomination of the Link-related threads, this information has far more value than a commercial one, as I hear folks still actually use the old things (in fact it seems like the older ones are the most $), as opposed to admiring them on a shelf like Hummels. So it's all very practical information that can be used in decision-making by players of all skill levels who opt to use Links (again--a lot of folks from what I hear--especially those who play tenor ;)).
 

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Hey, Swingtone! I am home alone today, wearing out my chops. Got to take a break now and then. Yea, I've benefitted from ALL aspects of SOTW. Including all the posts about gear. Got my self a Tenney refaced link and a Taiwan saxophone because of the SOTW. Discovered all sorts of fantastic music that I never knew existed (like the Gene Ammons that I am trying to figure out today), some workbooks that I actually use, became convinced that I should record myself, play with a metronome, and most recently, get a private instructor (first lesson last Thursday) all because of SOTW, in less than a year. SOTW is good for my imagination and my determination.
 

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Distinguished SOTW Columnist/Official SOTW Guru
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Swingtone,

Read one of Tim Price's posts, or his rico blogs. Better yet, take a Skype lesson with Tim and then come back and tell us that the internet isn't a good medium for learning.

Or, visit the homepage and have a look at the whole book worth of training material Tim has put there for free.

Or visit Matt Otto's page and read his articles. Download his lessons.

If you can't learn anything here other than the current market value of a slant sig Link, the froblem isn't the medium, it's you.
 

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You're really gunning for me, eh, Shaft? But nevermind, I saw you in a homemade youtube once (with some dreadful lounge singer if I recall), and you didn't look as tough as you do in your avatar.... ;)

But most of those things you mentioned are not true Web-based materials. They are materials that people download from the Internet for the purpose of printing--much like an article from the Wall Street Journal (a print source) can be downloaded from Lexis-Nexis. So really, learning from most of the materials you mentioned is no different from people reading Sigurd Rascher's book 30 years ago. In other words, even though I concede that the Internet may have made these kinds of materials available to more souls, the actual learning experience is not dependent on a computer. And aside from that, I had already recommended Web-based lessons in an earlier post--but here we're discussing the benefits of SOTW, which unfortunately doesn't offer such lessons.

And it's not really fair to twist my words in a thread in which we're nominating and discussing the value of different forum threads rather than talking about what goes on on the wider Internet. So yeah, I suppose when I said this medium, I should have said "this forum." What I was really talking about are those that sit on this forum for an hour or more a day reading and posting with the idea that that's a better use of their time from an educational standpoint than practicing their horn or consulting some in-depth, well-organized instructional materials composed by recognized experts.

And that brings me to something that I didn't mention earlier. Just like the ancient Greeks believed, I think that this forum or any other forum on any subject works best when it is used in moderation. And with that in mind, I still believe that the bread and butter of this forum are those that come on here looking for information about a mouthpiece or horn that they are thinking about purchasing and want additional information. And along those lines, the biggest draw of this place is undeniably the Marketplace, for I know several old timers who have told me they have mostly quit except for coming back for short bursts every week to scan the ads. Say what you want but that's always been the meat and potatoes of this place, as it will continue to be.

And theoretically with most forums once you get your information you leave until you have another question some time in the future. When folks get into trouble is when they stick around too long and get in that vicious cycle of addiction where they have to check to see if anybody responded to what they last wrote, and on and on.

And if you have any self-control, it should work this way for musical questions as well. You should get in, ask your musical question about the chord progression you're stuck on, check back for replies over the next several hours or day, and get out.

But with that in mind, any tidbits that you glean from those kinds of threads are not going to be as deep and meaningful as a thorough grounding in the fundamentals over a sustained period with a real live instructor. Sure maybe reading the answers to someone's esoteric question in a single thread may end up turning a light on for you in a wider way about music theory, but remember we're mostly talking about a skill here--mastering an instrument--so again, reading something on the Internet is not going to make you play any better than actually spending more time with the instrument you're trying to master.

So I still say if you use these forums in a responsible, non-addictive fashion that someone asking a question about gear can theoretically benefit more than someone asking a question about a specific musical question; because this place might lead them to discovering that Holy Grail piece that they might never have found otherwise--or even knew existed. And if the piece serves them well for the rest of their career, then that info could very well end up being far more advantageous over the long term than an answer someone gets to a specific question about a single chord progression in a tune.

Because if they are already versed in the fundamentals--or are working on becoming so with a real teacher--then I think hitting some time-trusted, thoughtfully organized print materials developed by recognized experts (like some of those you pointed to) would be a far better use of their time than sitting around here reading a bunch of eclectic threads with unconnected musical questions. If you happen to see such a thread in the short time that you're on--as Euge Groove did when he was on looking for information that would lead him to a replacement for this Guardala Studio--then fine, contribute if you have the time. But don't sit on here all day thinking that reading the latest posts on how to play the blues is going to help you more than spending a lot of time with some meaty sources by experts on the subject, along with working with a teacher in the pursuit of your goals.
 

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Distinguished SOTW Member, Forum Contributor 2009
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I just have one question for all of you: How many of you learned how to play the saxophone--or got better at doing it--from chatting about doing it on the Internet all day long (as opposed to actually doing it)?
Nobody.

Wait, you ask the wrong question. The correct question is : How many of you improved on some aspects of their playing, got valuable insights or corrected errors by chatting about it on the forum once in a while?

That would be me.

You have to use the correct arguments. Your question can be rephrased as : How many of you improved by sitting on their *ss instead of being busy with the horn? That has nothing to do with SOTW or the internet in general as a medium to learn.

I just don't think it's the best medium for teaching and learning an instrument, and that there's still no substitute for a real teacher
nobody said different. "Not the best" is not equal to "not at all" though.

And lastly, as far as my nomination of the Link-related threads...
Is about gear, and then a specific kind of gear, and then only for people obsessed with one type of the specific kind of gear. How about a topic on sharing the gift of music, and figuring out plans to do it, exchanging music sheets, get-together to play for Christmas, and all that stuff. Ain't that a bit more about music than about unnecessary gear chauvinism?

I can rephrase your original question :
How many of you have actually gotten better by talking about gear all day, buying new gear every other week and/or looking for that Holy Grail instead of actually using what you have? :twisted:

If argumenting becomes the goal rather than the way to come to a consensus, it might be time to hit the shed again. And now I'm off to the next performance.

Hasta la vista! ;)
 

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Admittedly a non-scientific study, but after doing a random check of the first page of "new posts" at approx. 11:30 am CST on Sunday, Nov. 15, 2009, 18 out of 25 threads were gear-related. And some of the rest dealing with music consisted of people looking for sheet music or transcriptions; so as I alluded to earlier, though the answers to these kinds of questions are very valuable to those asking them--not very deep from an instructional standpoint just the same.... But if the gear questions are the bread and butter of this forum that pay the bills, perhaps those rare less superficial musical questions that raise the pulses of the old bored hard heads above a comatose level are the frosting? But even so, IMO it's not worth sitting around here for hours a day waiting for one to scroll by when you could be spending that time mastering your instrument.
 

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Discussion Starter · #48 ·
Topic Of The Month November, 2009 Rules

Perhaps I did not install this forum product correctly? It can contain only ten (10) nominations. It should not accept more, but it will and at the same time will destroy the poll situation. I have to spend 30 minutes to reconstruct it and the votes will get lost.

I will try to do next month's vote better, but for now:

Please select from 10 nominations either by nominating them again or by voting them.
NO MORE NEW NOMINATIONS.

I will make sure that remaining November thread can be nominated in Dec. 2009 poll.

Secondly the discussion about the selection of topics, although interesting, is receiving unnecessary heat. It should be continued elsewhere.
 

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SOTW Blues recording

I found this post on "SOTW Blues recording" interesting and have nominated it accordingly for "Topic Of The Month November, 2009"
 

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Work Ethic and The Importance of having a great teacher!

I found this post on "Work Ethic and The Importance of having a great teacher!" interesting and have nominated it accordingly for "Topic Of The Month November, 2009"
 
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Hi !!
I like the Article about Composer and their "intention" veru much.
It is an interesting Post indeed, i enjoyed to read it.
There is some healthy discussion in this forum so as every one pull each others leg badly..
 

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Forum Contributor 2015, SOTW Better late than neve
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SOTW November 2009 Tune of the Month - Detour Ahead

I found this post on "SOTW November 2009 Tune of the Month - Detour Ahead" interesting and have nominated it accordingly for "Topic Of The Month November, 2009"
 

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Discussion Starter · #54 ·
No new nominations for this month

I found this post on "sliding tendon" interesting and have nominated it accordingly for "Topic Of The Month November, 2009"
Please read my message above: No new nominations for this month.
The number of nominations above 10 will break the poll, and I have to adjust it by hand.

I am sorry for this confusion. Will see how to implement it next month.
 

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Discussion Starter · #55 ·
No new nominations for this month

magical pig said:
I found this on "Jazz and money" interesting and have nominated it accordingly for "Topic Of The Month November, 2009"
Please read my message above: No new nominations for this month.
The number of nominations above 10 will break the poll, and I have to adjust it by hand.

I am sorry for this confusion. Will see how to implement it next month.
 

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SOTW Blues recording

I found this post on "SOTW Blues recording" interesting and have nominated it accordingly for "Topic Of The Month November, 2009"
 

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Re: No new nominations for this month

magical pig said:
I found this on "Jazz and money" interesting and have nominated it accordingly for "Topic Of The Month November, 2009"
Please read my message above: No new nominations for this month.
The number of nominations above 10 will break the poll, and I have to adjust it by hand.

I am sorry for this confusion. Will see how to implement it next month.
I've been silenced by this forum's authorities. This is an outrageous case of my voting rights being denied. :crybaby: I suspect it is race related. It is an anti-french conspiracy! :D

Sorry about this Harri, I didn't know there was a limited number of nominations.
 

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Discussion Starter · #58 ·
Re: No new nominations for this month

magical pig said:
I found this on "Jazz and money" interesting and have nominated it accordingly for "Topic Of The Month November, 2009"
Please read my message above: No new nominations for this month.
The number of nominations above 10 will break the poll, and I have to adjust it by hand.

I am sorry for this confusion. Will see how to implement it next month.
I've been silenced by this forum's authorities. This is an outrageous case of my voting rights being denied. :crybaby: I suspect it is race related. It is an anti-french conspiracy! :D

Sorry about this Harri, I didn't know there was a limited number of nominations.
I agree, had I known that this function had faults I would not have introduced it.
Be as it may, I am watching this thread now like a hawk. Mr. M. Pig, you'll get to to nominate next month, this month you are permitted to vote.
 

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Re: No new nominations for this month

Harri,

Thanks for your e-mail. I noticed that icon you speak of and remember thinking, "WTH was that?" after clicking it. LOL I intended a quick reply but it sure would be funny to me if that particular one wins. LOL
 

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Re: No new nominations for this month

I agree, had I known that this function had faults I would not have introduced it.
Be as it may, I am watching this thread now like a hawk. Mr. M. Pig, you'll get to to nominate next month, this month you are permitted to vote.
Hey no problem man! I understand the implementation of new features can't be flawless. :) And it's a nice and entertaining addition.
 
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