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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi All

I currently use a Theo Wanne Gai 2 Metal mouthpiece but yesterday decided to get out the Hard Rubber equivalent which I haven't used in a while.

Personally I prefer to use the metal version pure and simply because it has a built in ligature which is useable and feels more comfortable in my mouth whilst the HR version has that dreadful metal ring ligature that never keeps the reed in place when you try and tighten it so its always a real hassle putting a reed on and keeping it in the right place.

The HR seems to create a better sound when playing some songs whilst the metal one seems to be able to generate more power and has a punchier aspect to it but that just may be because I havent used the HR one in a while but the biggest difference imo is that the HR seems to handle saliva build up inside the chamber better than the metal one with the latter always generating that saliva moving around the mouthpiece swirling noise.

Anyway this is not a post about HR v Metal but an enquiry as to what people think about the ligature approach by Theo Wanne?

I cant understand why they have a built in one for the metal and a very unpractical more or less unuseable one for the HR mouthpiece.

In fact I use a Rovner on the HR as it seems to hold a reed much better and tbh am thinking of doing the same for the metal one too as even that built in one isnt ideal.

Just be interested to hear everyone elses thoughts on this aspect of ligatures for Theo Wanne mouthpieces and whether anyone else has done similar or tried to substitute the original ones with alternatives

Although I am no expert on sax or on mouthpieces and/or ligatures I cant help but feel that the ligature approach on Theo Wanne mouthpieces are more for show and a gimmick rather than some kind of superior design for ligatures. and superior and/or optimal performance
 

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For me, radial screws are mostly a pain, and a geometrical nonsense. Furthermore, TW’s stuff makes it an additional pain to cover your reed during breaks. On their HR pieces, you can use other ligs and caps, dunno about their current metal pieces. The older metal models I played (Brahma and Datta) could also take any lig & cap.
 

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Although I am no expert on sax or on mouthpieces and/or ligatures I cant help but feel that the ligature approach on Theo Wanne mouthpieces are more for show and a gimmick rather than some kind of superior design for ligatures. and superior and/or optimal performance
[/QUOTE]

I agree with the OP and don't use the TW ligature for HR.
Although I like TW's built-on lig for metal, Dexdex makes a good point about the difficulty of capping the reed.
Certainly a lot of room for improvement by TW.
 

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I have a TW Gaia, the hard rubber version. While it's a very good mp imo, the ligature was obviously designed to be obnoxious. Yes, it works well, if you're ever able to actually get it attached successfully to the mouthpiece (try doing that in a dark nightclub). The idea of the lig may be good, but the execution is a nightmare. If I was going to use the piece, I'd put a Silverstein on it, a lig that not only sounds better imo but is functionally superior and utterly simple to use (it takes about 3 seconds to get it secured).

Theo Wanna needs to toss that lig in the dustbin and redesign it, if they don't want this kind of feedback constantly. I don't usually rail against gear, but that thing deserves it.


Turtle
 

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Yeah I kind of agree. I have a Shiva with the built in and the Datta with a Silverstein and prefer the latter. I was also having a problem with y tone (9 facing) and went from a Fibracell 3 to a 2) What a difference! much fuller. Low B still need to get my breath right on the 2 but otherwise a revelation.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Well have to be honest and say that I really like both mouthpieces but its just a tremendous shame about the ligature(s) problems

Its obviously something that they must be aware of so it begs the question as to why they haven't done anything about it.

I recall someone from TW who works for him/them used to post on here.....any chance of an explanation as to what plans there are to change things if any such plans exist at all?
 

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Theo's ligs are just okay, not great but better than the lousy ring ligs that Jody Jazz and Drake send with their pieces. I suspect the difference between the lig setup on the metal and HR pieces is due partially to cost but also because I don't think hard rubber is structurally strong enough to handle the load created by the configuration used on the metal pieces.
 

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Correct Keith. Hard rubber would not tolerate a built on lig very well. It certainly would warp easier with the least bit of over tightening. Ive seen metal pieces with the mounting holes screwed up fro crsnking down on the liberty lig. Some guys seem to think a lig is a vise.
 

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I want to give Theo the benefit of the doubt and assume that he's marketed his ligatures because he thinks they work and sound great, not simply as a gimmick.

And, IMO, the attached ligatures on the metal mouthpieces work really well and are very convenient. OTOH I have experienced the same drawbacks others report about the Enlightened ligatures: they're difficult to position, and it can be hard to adjust the mouthpiece on the neck without knocking the lig off kilter.

Fortunately, there are any number of other ligatures that will fit Theo's mouthpieces, so it's not as if you're required to use an Enlightened if you want use a HR Gaia. (And, for that matter, you also just detach TW's ligature from the metal Gaia and use any one of several alternatives.)

My only issue with TW's gear is the price: to me, there are other mouthpieces out there for half the price that are at least equally good, but then that is largely a matter of personal taste. I tried a couple different models of the Gaia, and I thought it was an excellent piece, but a little too free blowing for me: I wanted a little more resistance. Your results may vary.
 

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I wouldn't want a lig included with my mpc. I would rather pay less and use a lig of my own choice. What are the odds everyone that plays the same model mpc prefers the same lig as well?

I suppose there could be some pieces where it comes with the only lig that fits them. Sort of like thousand dollar phones that are only compatible with products made by the same company... better yet, your mpc is outdated and is no longer compatible with music! Trade in your latest model and receive $10 off your next $500 mpc!
 

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jazz, rock, funk, fusion and gospel on tenor, alto and soprano
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I love the ligature included with Theo’s metal pieces. It was a pain to modify the mouthpiece cap to fit, but it was worth it. I bought Theo’s mouthpiece cap and melted notches in it with a soldering iron in order to better fit around the ligature screws. Theo should really improve the design of the mouthpiece cap to be a good fit for the mouthpiece without modification. For all hard rubber pieces, including SYOS, I think the included ligatures are ridiculous but I love my Rovner MK3 on every hard rubber mouthpiece I have ever played. No need to reinvent the hard rubber mouthpiece ligature.
 

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I have a TW Shiva 2 metal with the built in ligature and think it works great! The positioning of the reed becomes very consistent, and it´s especially convenient when you need to change reed in a hurry. I don´t like the TW caps though, so I use a Francois Louis Smart Cap instead. Not sure exactly which size it is, but it fits very well.

/Saxray
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
So I guess the answer is to get TW to give us all a discount and sell the mouthpieces for less and without a ligature and/or to include a Rovner ;-)
 

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I like the integrated ligatures on the metal pieces, but agree that the cap is abysmal. I always used an FL cap with mine. You can buy them at WWBW or Weinermusic for like $12 and they fit perfectly.
 

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I like the integrated ligatures on the metal pieces, but agree that the cap is abysmal. I always used an FL cap with mine. You can buy them at WWBW or Weinermusic for like $12 and they fit perfectly.
What do you mean by an FL cap?
 
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