Sax on the Web Forum banner

1 - 19 of 19 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
36 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Good day everyone.

I was considering the first TAM model until I saw a lot of reviews online speaking about how poorly finished the mouthpieces were. It however appears that Gary took the feedback and has come up with an updated model.

Sirvalorsax just reviewed the new one on youtube. Here's the link.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HI1PgV-chB4&t=69s

What do you guys think?
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member
Joined
·
2,767 Posts
I mean, the finish work still looks pretty ugly.

That guy is a very good player who makes pretty much everything sound good, so I wouldn't count on sounding like him on that mouthpiece, though the fact that he really likes it does hopefully say something positive.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
36 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
True. I'm not trying to sound like him. Truth be told, his sound is a bit too thin for me. I'll probably try a slightly stiffer reed. I'm just looking for something that is really flexible, free blowing and will give me the platform to craft my own sound without getting in the way.
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member
Joined
·
4,579 Posts
True. I'm not trying to sound like him. Truth be told, his sound is a bit too thin for me. I'll probably try a slightly stiffer reed. I'm just looking for something that is really flexible, free blowing and will give me the platform to craft my own sound without getting in the way.
Why roll the dice on this when you don't like the way the guy sounds on it, and you admit that Sugal pieces have a poor track record of bad finishing, just in case that he's making them better now?

There are (literally) dozens of companies out there selling pieces, I'd think you could do better with one of them.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,207 Posts
There was a time when talk about Mr Sugal in this forum... ... ... ...
 

·
SOTW Columnist and Forum Contributor 2015-2016
Joined
·
3,832 Posts
Finish work on these is hit or miss in my experience. It usually doesn't look great, but there are a few he gets right and play really well.

However, there a TON of mouthpiece companies out there right now that are well-crafted. I would not pay the money for a Sugal and take the gamble on it playing well or not.

- Saxaholic
 

·
Registered
YTS 82Zii
Joined
·
415 Posts
I cringe thinking of the backlash from this post. The fact that Sugal responded and improved the product says something. I do appreciate his efforts to make a piece for $450. The video made me think twice. I have heard people sound incredible on a Sugal before. Seems like Saxaholic said, when you get a good one, it's great.
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member
Joined
·
4,579 Posts
But if wonder, did Sugal REALLY REALLY make sure these two were amazing, knowing this guy would make another video?
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member, Forum Contributor 2015-
Joined
·
32,933 Posts
But if wonder, did Sugal REALLY REALLY make sure these two were amazing, knowing this guy would make another video?
I wonder if he sent them out for facing by some mystery mouthpiece tech?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
976 Posts
All the rails had a cast look, unless the plating is so thick that it hides the sharp edges of a hand faced mpc. I agree with efsax about a harder reed, but he has no trouble with alt.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
289 Posts
I don't agree with the comments about Sirvalorsax's tone sounding a bit thin on his review of the new and improved KWIII. I think his tone is fantastic through that mouthpiece, and of course a great player is going to make any mouthpiece sound its best, but I don't love his tone on his review of the Otto Links (then again, I don't personally care for links, as the very low baffle produces a tone which is too dark for my ear). I also love the tone of this player on his Sugal KWIII comparison on youtube:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwJxIUrN9b8

I find his MBII to be too bright for my taste, but the KWIII is just right. True, Igor on this clip is playing the hand finished Sugal at almost twice the price, but for those of us that can't afford the hand finished model I am hoping the new and improved TAM will help me find the sound I am looking for within my budget. I ordered the KWIII 8 from wwbw last week, but they are out of stock and it is back ordered. Perhaps this is because Sugal recalled the older stock in order to make the improvements suggested by Sirvalorsax? Anyway wwbw is giving me an expected ship date of 10/19. I have been on the quest for the best mouthpiece for my tenor for a couple decades and I will continue on the quest until I find for me the best tone, versatility and ease of playability. After going through around 17 mouthpieces on alto, the first time I played my Theo Wanne Khali (a discontinued model similar to the Durga) I was in love. The sound is incredible and although it is metal, it feels like I am playing on a hard rubber piece in terms of ease of control and shaping the sound. I have been rocking the Theo Wanne for 5 years on alto and the search is over, I am in love with this piece. But I ordered the Theo Wanne Durga for tenor and I didn't love the tone, it was just OK. For that price I had better love it. So I returned it and I am currently playing a Berg Larson modern 110/1 and I like it, but I am still searching for a bigger sound and ease of shaping my tone. I have nothing to lose trying the Sugal from wwbw because they have a money back guarantee. It is worth it because it just might be the one I have been searching for, just like the Theo Wanne was for my alto. I also love my Dukoff D6 on soprano, but I didn't love the Dukoff I tried on the tenor. I think serious players will have to search until they find the best mouthpiece for the personal tone they are searching for. I can't wait to try the Sugal in hopes that my quest will soon be over for my ideal tenor mouthpiece, just as I finally finished my quest on the alto and soprano. Of course there is no mouthpiece that will be ideal for everyone, as everyone has their own concept of sound and mouthpiece response they are going for. But if I keep trying mouthpieces, eventually I will find the best choice for me and based on the description of the baffle, chamber and design of the Sugal MKIII along with reviews I found on Youtube, I can't pass up the opportunity to try what looks and sounds to me like an excellent contender for the right mouthpiece to suit my needs. I will post an update after I receive and try the Sugal.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
289 Posts
I ordered the Sugal KWIII TAM from WWBW and the back ordered #8 estimated ship date was pushed back to 10/27. I recently got hired to play in an R&B and Funk band, and I needed a mouthpiece that would cut through the mix for an upcoming gig. I saw that WWBW had a 7 star in stock, so I cancelled the back ordered 8 and ordered the 7 star so that I would have it in time for my next gig. The 7 star arrived this afternoon. I had a long work day and didn't get to fully play test it. However, after playing it with my usual Vandoren Java 2.5, my initial impression is that I just might have found the holy grail of tenor mouthpieces I have been searching for! With metal tenor mouthpieces, I usually like the tone and don't like the response, or vice versa. This piece was focused and bright (but not overly bright), it sub toned surprisingly well, I was able to play a full octave of altissimo with ease and the response almost seemed too good to be true. This piece reminds me of the Theo Wanne Khali that I love so much on my alto, in that it has the brightness and ease of altissimo of a metal mouthpiece but the response feels like I am playing a hard rubber piece. This piece is extremely versatile. The high baffle gives me the edge and projection I need, but the relatively large chamber produces a sound that is not thin or nasal. I don't think it's a "true large chamber," which Theo Wanne often boasts about, but it is a large enough chamber to produce the exact tone I am looking for. I think the design of the tip and rails helps this piece to respond like a hard rubber piece. What makes me think that? I suppose simply because the tip and rails look a lot like my hard rubber pieces in terms of shape and thickness. My only complaint is, as I suspected, the 7 star tip opening is not quite large enough to produce the response and buzz I am looking for, so I will probably end up exchanging it for the 8. But other than that, I love everything about this piece. Oh, except the ligature. I wasn't a fan of the ligature because it didn't hold the reed in the precise location where I wanted it (it was slightly off center). It also seemed a bit on the flimsy side. But most of us have a ligature we prefer using anyway, so swapping it out for my favorite Rovner was no big deal. The bottom line is, I would highly recommend this mouthpiece to anyone who wants to produce a smooth jazz/R and B/funk tone. It was well worth the $449 Woodwind and Brasswind sells it for. I am going to keep the 7 star for a week or 2 and play a couple of gigs on it, and if I am still finding myself craving a slightly larger tip opening, I will send it back to wwbw and wait for the 8 to come back in stock. I have waited for many years to find a piece that sounds and responds like this, so what's a few more weeks of waiting to find my holy grail? Of course no mouthpiece is going to be the perfect piece for everyone, but I think this is the perfect piece to suit my particular needs and preferences.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
289 Posts
As much as I am loving the mouthpiece, I think the ligature is worthless. It doesn't hold the reed as securely as I would like so I am just using my Rovner MKIII, which is pretty much my preferred ligature on just about any mouthpiece. I find the right size Rovner (the metal mouthpiece sized Rovner for the tenor) is holding the reed exactly where I want it and very tightly, just the way I like it.
 

·
Registered
YTS 82Zii
Joined
·
415 Posts
Not sure if anyone can help answer this question except Sugal himself. Listening to the review that Adrienne did after Sugal did improvements has me thinking $450 isn’t a bad price if it played really well (hard to imagine that $450 is considered “cheap” now). They are more expensive on Sugal site as he went up on the price. I’m wondering about the pieces on wwbw, reverb, music123, etc. that are still $450. Are those from before he made the changes? Does anyone know if there is any type of marking or physical feature that is on the newer pieces?
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member/Forum Contributor 2010
Joined
·
3,310 Posts
All the rails had a cast look, unless the plating is so thick that it hides the sharp edges of a hand faced mpc. I agree with efsax about a harder reed, but he has no trouble with alt.
Those are some fat rails for sure!
View attachment 245196

Also whats going on with the wall thickness here?
View attachment 245198

My old WWBW "laser trimmed" guardala studio looks better than that.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
289 Posts
@Barimelt I returned the 7 star because the tip opening was too small for my taste. I had to wait about a month for wwbw to get an 8 in stock because Gary recalled all the old mouthpieces and wwbw had to wait several weeks for Gary to manufacture and ship the new and improved KWIII’s according to SirValorSax’s suggestions. I just received the 8 a few days ago and it blows me away. There are a few minor cosmetic flaws, but they don’t affect the sound or playability. This truly has the best tone and playing characteristic of any tenor piece I have ever played, including the Theo Wanne Durga 3 and the Jody Jazz I used to play. Stepping up to an 8 extended my altissimo range a minor 3rd higher compared to the 7 star (I can play 4 octaves on the 8 just like SirValorSax). It’s also much easier to get multiphonics to speak on the 8 compared to the 7 star. This piece is versatile. I can really shape the sound by changing my embouchure and air speed. When I really push the air it goes the extra mile and really cuts through the mix in my funk band. It plays evenly throughout all registers. My 10 year quest for the holy grail of tenor mouthpieces is finally over.
 

·
Registered
YTS 82Zii
Joined
·
415 Posts
@ajarndontree. Thanks. I’m probably looking for an 8*. WWBW offers it at a lesser price than Mr. Sugal and he doesn’t compete against his distributors/retailers. Might wait to find one on here or wwbw. I’m happy with my current piece, but always have had an interest in Sugals. I’ve played a couple. One played just okay. The other played great but the sound wasn’t for me, it didn’t have enough cut. But we are talking 15 years ago probably, and they were both about 10 year old pieces at that time.
 
1 - 19 of 19 Posts
Top