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Discussion Starter #1
Any other The Martin Bari players have problems with tunning? I've got two mouthpieces; the first one, a Geo M Bundy piece that looks almost like this Piece's Twin with a differnt name on it, will play in tune when it is only about a half inch on to the neck. My other, a Selmer Soloist Style C* needs the neck to be a good half inch longer to play in tune as it is not in tune anywhere on the neck currently. Is there anything that can be done to help remedy how far out the moutpiece has to be, or is this just common for the horn?
 

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I have not found that to be an issue. Is the neck original? IF it doesn't have an octave key on the neck, you may want to pull the neck out at the body to give you some extra extension. Is it a Comm III? Easiest way to tell is they don't have the fork F# in the right hand. Those mouthpieces should work fine.
 

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My Comm III is picky about pieces.
I couldn’t get it to tune with a Soloist piece.
I use a Masterlink 4**** piece or a Woodwind Co piece mostly.
From what I have read, neck extensions don’t help with these horns, mouthpiece volume is what is needed to help with tuning.
Along with a good set up with attention to pad heights.
My Martin also has some crescents in the D and E tone holes from the previous owner.
These have likely made mine less troublesome than some.
Soloist pieces are not large chambered pieces regardless of what many believe.
 

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Any other The Martin Bari players have problems with tunning?
I had one for a couple years, no problem with intonation. Obviously there can be mouthpiece mismatches that can be problematical.
 

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Any other The Martin Bari players have problems with tunning? I've got two mouthpieces; the first one, a Geo M Bundy piece that looks almost like this Piece's Twin with a differnt name on it, will play in tune when it is only about a half inch on to the neck. My other, a Selmer Soloist Style C* needs the neck to be a good half inch longer to play in tune as it is not in tune anywhere on the neck currently. Is there anything that can be done to help remedy how far out the moutpiece has to be, or is this just common for the horn?
I have a 1954 Committee III baritone. Great sound, much lighter than my Buescher Model 139 Custom Built and good ergonomics...but with the wrong mouthpiece F2 and E2 play a quarter tone or more sharp. I found that using one of Erik Greiffenhagen's double chamber mouthpieces (mine is made from a Vandoren V5 B75) sufficiently mitigates the problem, but does not eliminate it.

I am intrigued, however, in a new offering by MusicMedic. In addition to their necks for Conn 12M baris (the regular and 12.5) they recently introduced The Wilmington- Martin Improved Bari Neck. Hopefully, Curt and team have developed modifications to the original design which correct the issue. I e-mailed yesterday to find out more and will add to this thread when I learn something.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
serial# of the saxophone is important.
205xxx makes it from 1959, Committee III

I have not found that to be an issue. Is the neck original? IF it doesn't have an octave key on the neck, you may want to pull the neck out at the body to give you some extra extension. Is it a Comm III? Easiest way to tell is they don't have the fork F# in the right hand. Those mouthpieces should work fine.
Yes original neck with matching serial number

My Comm III is picky about pieces.
I couldn’t get it to tune with a Soloist piece.
---
Soloist pieces are not large chambered pieces regardless of what many believe.
The other disparity between my two mouthpieces is that the Selmer (in origianl condition) is a good 1/2 - 3/4 of an inch shorter than the Bundy piece. I played on the soloist in college on a Yamaha 52 Bari with no issues so I know the mouthpiece is not having issues.


I may just need to take it in for an adjustment and see what the tech can find.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
I am intrigued, however, in a new offering by MusicMedic. In addition to their necks for Conn 12M baris (the regular and 12.5) they recently introduced The Wilmington- Martin Improved Bari Neck. Hopefully, Curt and team have developed modifications to the original design which correct the issue. I e-mailed yesterday to find out more and will add to this thread when I learn something.
This is an interesting development, looking forward to see what you find out!
 

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When I had one, mouthpiece choice was critical, one of the main reasons I sold it. It should be great once you get a good match. My best results were with a modern hard rubber Otto Link.
 

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When I had one, mouthpiece choice was critical, one of the main reasons I sold it. It should be great once you get a good match. My best results were with a modern hard rubber Otto Link.

OP - If you want to get an idea what this set up sounds like, check out Lisa Parrott, who posts on SOTW occasionally. I am particularly fond of her feature with DIVA on "Pennies from Heaven".
 

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Discussion Starter #11
When I had one, mouthpiece choice was critical, one of the main reasons I sold it. It should be great once you get a good match. My best results were with a modern hard rubber Otto Link.
OP - If you want to get an idea what this set up sounds like, check out Lisa Parrott, who posts on SOTW occasionally. I am particularly fond of her feature with DIVA on "Pennies from Heaven".
I've actually had a HR Otto Link sitting in my WWBW Cart for some time and pulled the trigger on it a few minutes ago. I had heard good things about these pieces and vintage horns, I will find out for sure later this week!
 

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Discussion Starter #12
So an update at last. The Otto Link arrived in the mail today, I put a fresh reed on it and played for about 30 minutes to get used to the mouthpiece and break the read in a little. I love the sound that I am getting from it, however, I am having the same issue that it is only in tune when the mouthpiece is on the neck about a half-inch. The other thing I noticed sitting in front of the tuner is the the lower I go, it goes a little flat, an the higher I go it goes very sharp. I tried the Bundy piece with the same results. When I play G2, it is about 20 cents sharp, I tried lipping it down, making sure I am playing with an open throat and didn't improve much, if at all for some notes.

What could be going on with this horn that it is so badly out-of-tune with itself? It's not like it's an ealy horn in the model run, the Comm III had been out well over a decade when mine was made. Do these like the key openings to be on the closer side? Was Martin still making a "high pitch" horn at the time and it is just not labled as such? Just trying to get some ideas for when I take it to the shop sometime this summer. I would take it in now, but both of my Buffets are in the shop for a tune-up and would like to build the sax repair budget back up before taking it in.

Outside of the tuning issue, the Bari has great keywork action and an awesome sound, very different from the Yamaha Bari I played in college in a good way. I like to go into my music room and noodle around on it, it's a blast!
 

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My keyheights are quite open, more so than my 1936 12m which is also Mouthpiece picky.
Unfortunately I don’t recall the Martin serial number at the moment but will pay more attention when I get it out next.
Also my horns body and neck serials are different, whether this has much or any impact, I don’t know.
 

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About 4 years ago I had the amazing fortune to pick a silver-plated Committee III with nickel-plated keys and a gold wash bell. I became the horn's 2nd owner in its nearly 60 year history. I bought it through my tech who had it in on consignment. The horn came with a Selmer D scroll shank MP. Why anyone would do that to a Martin I"m not sure, but that's beside the point. ;)

I have not had any problems with tuning it at all. My tech did a full restoration on it. (Before/after pics the link above.) The one critical thing to realize is that Martin Committee III baris do tune with their MP's at about 1/2" from the end of the neck. That is totally normal. That is where their sweet spot is. And the warmer the temp is, the more problematic that could become.

My main MP choices for all my baris go like this: Berg Larsen HR 100/2 SMS and a Berg Larsen Stainless Steel 110/2 M. I use both of those on the Martin with no intonation issues whatsoever.

Here's a fun fact: The scroll shank can produce a bassoon-like sound like no other bari I have heard before. I currently using the Martin as an ersatz bassoon in a pit orchestra b/c my bassoon skills are nearly 30 years in the rearview. I am trying to relearn the instrument, but didn't have near enough time to pull it off. With the Selmer MP however, I can get the "heady" bassoon sound. It's just a matter of attitude.

The Martin is a very flexible instrument... More so than any other bari I have ever played. I wouldn't trade or sell it for any amount of $.

BTW, the my tech was very careful about the key heights. He kept them the way they were. I suspect these are still factory settings... And yes, they are quite open.
 

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I have a 1954 Committee III baritone. Great sound, much lighter than my Buescher Model 139 Custom Built and good ergonomics...but with the wrong mouthpiece F2 and E2 play a quarter tone or more sharp. I found that using one of Erik Greiffenhagen's double chamber mouthpieces (mine is made from a Vandoren V5 B75) sufficiently mitigates the problem, but does not eliminate it.

I am intrigued, however, in a new offering by MusicMedic. In addition to their necks for Conn 12M baris (the regular and 12.5) they recently introduced The Wilmington- Martin Improved Bari Neck. Hopefully, Curt and team have developed modifications to the original design which correct the issue. I e-mailed yesterday to find out more and will add to this thread when I learn something.
Below is a copy of Musicmedic's Sara Sipes' response to my question about the Wilmington neck

Hi Bob,

Thank you for your interest in our bari necks. Our purpose for making a modified Martin neck is to fix the sharpness of the palm keys, but it may be different on each saxophone/mouthpiece combination. It certainly helped in our Martin we have in the shop! Curt was testing it with a Lawton mouthpiece.

We also offer a 10 day return policy, where we will offer a full refund if returned in New condition. This is helpful, if by chance the neck doesn't solve your issues, you are more than welcome to return it.

Please let me know if you have any other questions or concerns.

Sincerely,

Sara Sipes
 

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About 4 years ago I had the amazing fortune to pick a silver-plated Committee III with nickel-plated keys and a gold wash bell. I became the horn's 2nd owner in its nearly 60 year history. I bought it through my tech who had it in on consignment. The horn came with a Selmer D scroll shank MP. Why anyone would do that to a Martin I"m not sure, but that's beside the point.
Helen - Beautiful horn! I had seen some of these pictures on your website a few years ago but the "before-during-after" shots are great.

As of this past Saturday, my Committee III (s/n 180,xxx which actually seems to be 1953, not 1954 as I noted above) is with my tech for an overhaul. I've owned it for 14-15 years and it is generally in pretty poor shape, although it plays amazingly well as is. He is going to replace the "mutt-set" of pads with Chocolate "Roos from MusicMedic and flat brass Resotechs. I am also going to have him strip off all of the lacquer, which has become pretty gnarly, and leave it bare brass.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
I am also going to have him strip off all of the lacquer, which has become pretty gnarly and leave it bare brass.
I've been considering doing this on mine, it is a mix of original, touchup, and no lacquer.

It would be interesting to see how much that neck would help with intonation across the board, I will put it on my wish list of when I have extra money just sitting around :)


Here's a fun fact: The scroll shank can produce a bassoon-like sound like no other bari I have heard before. I currently using the Martin as an ersatz bassoon in a pit orchestra b/c my bassoon skills are nearly 30 years in the rearview. I am trying to relearn the instrument, but didn't have near enough time to pull it off. With the Selmer MP however, I can get the "heady" bassoon sound. It's just a matter of attitude.
I do like the woody, basson-like tone that I get when I put my scroll shank on. I like to play Back Cello Concertos with that piece, and I guess as long as I am playing solo work (in the case of the solo cello concertos) and no one has perfect pitch, no one will notice that that piece plays sharp when I use it!
 

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I do like the woody, basson-like tone that I get when I put my scroll shank on. I like to play Back Cello Concertos with that piece, and I guess as long as I am playing solo work (in the case of the solo cello concertos) and no one has perfect pitch, no one will notice that that piece plays sharp when I use it!
Yup, that's the kind of stuff I'm talking about. However, my palm keys are 100% in tune. (I'm actually in unison, up in those palm keys, with the singer in one of the numbers of the current musical I'm using the horn in, so I'm totally aware of its tuning all the time.) .. I wonder why yours would be off?
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Yup, that's the kind of stuff I'm talking about. However, my palm keys are 100% in tune. (I'm actually in unison, up in those palm keys, with the singer in one of the numbers of the current musical I'm using the horn in, so I'm totally aware of its tuning all the time.) .. I wonder why yours would be off?
I plan on taking it in to get looked at in the next few months, it could be that a tone hole or 2 need some solder work or some pads are not sealing enough or a combination of both.
 
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