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Discussion Starter #1
There is a straight soprano on Ebay for a way too low price if this is a real thing.

surly Conn never made a straight Naked Lady?? Did they??
 

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I would never say never (I have seen a Buescher soprano labeled "Aristocrat", for example) but two things: 1) If it did exist it would be pretty rare; 2) If Conn did complete a few sopranos after the M series were introduced, they would surely be new-old-stock New Wonder sopranos with a different engraving.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
The number would date to 1926. But the pics sure look like rolled tone holes.
 

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OK, I took a look at it; it appears to be a New Wonder with M series engraving. The SN indicates 1929 or 1930 build date from popular serial number charts, which also indicate maybe this date slightly pre-dates the introduction of the 6M 10M and 12M. If this is factory engraving, then this has to be surely one of the very last Conn sopranos ever sold. The flow through the factory that would have resulted in this instrument being stamped with a 1929 serial number (stamping the SN must be almost the very last operation) yet engraved with a 1932-on engraving (which is done before plating on Conn plated instruments, thus well before final assembly) is something I can't quite parse out.
 

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As far as that goes, I don't think "Naked Lady" is really apropos; I have three of these and on none of them is the lady shown far enough down to tell what she's wearing. Back in the day we always called them the "Pink Lady".
 

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Interesting horn. So it has a Chu-style table with the Lady engraving.

Mind you, there are Transitional Tenors and Altos with a Chu-stlye table and a Lady engraving...but NOT as early in serial sequence as this Soprano.

Now I guess if you wanted to determine whether the engraving is original and not a replica....you could search for other Trannies which had a 235,XXX or lower serial and see if any of them have the Lady engraving. If you find a couple, then it's bona-fide.


The argument here becomes: non-Lady engravings still appear to have been typical up to 247,XXX (perusing saxpics.com)....taking a look at Tranny examples there, it appears a Lady engraving shows up on horns starting at around 249,XXX....

....so ....would a Lady have appeared at 235,XXX ????


(Turf...you are correct..."Naked Lady" is the moniker folks use, but really "Lady in the Window" is a less-used but more appropriate one. The 'Naked Lady' really should refer to the engravings with the full woman, head to toe, which appeared on certain vintages - and sometimes you see those referred to with that moniker. But the name sorta got misplaced onto the 'window' Lady....to the degree where it'd be impossible to correct that course at this point, IMHO).
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Interesting horn. So it has a Chu-style table with the Lady engraving.

Mind you, there are Transitional Tenors with a Chu-stlye table and a Lady engraving, from circa the same period as that 235,XXX serial would be.

Now I guess if you wanted to determine whether the engraving is original and not a replica....you could search for other Trannies which had a 235,XXX or lower serial and see if any of them have the Lady engraving. If you find a couple, then it's bona-fide.


The argument here becomes: non-Lady engravings still appear to have been typical up to 239,XXX (perusing saxpics.com)....so would a Lady have appeared at 235,XXX ????

(Turf...you are correct..."Naked Lady" is the moniker folks use, but really "Lady in the Window" is a less-used but more appropriate one. The 'Naked Lady' really should refer to the engravings with the full woman, head to toe, which appeared on certain vintages - and sometimes you see those referred to with that moniker. But the name sorta got misplaced onto the 'window' Lady....to the degree where it'd be impossible to correct that course at this point, IMHO).
Great info thx. I'll never call her a naked lady again (much to my wife's happiness).
 

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Great info thx. I'll never call her a naked lady again (much to my wife's happiness).
Pandora's box was opened long ago....as I said, it's unlikely common usage can ever be changed at this point :bluewink:. I tend to just say "the Lady engraving" myself...
 

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Oh, also keep in mind...IF something is fishy with that engraving (and again, it may or may not be - per my quick saxpics perusal, the only reference source I have checked out - I'd say there may be something sorta odd here)....it may well be the owner/seller really has no idea....
 

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So here is the reason for the question....My first horn was a 6M, then a great Reynolds tenor with a wonderfully rich dark sound, and finally a Conn curved silver soprano circa 1917. This last recession hit us so bad I sold all but my soprano.

With work being much much better I have started replacing my horns. First the 6M, then I found a great 10M, the soprano is getting a repad and some rods straightened (grandson). Being somewhat OCD I would love to have the soprano be an M (Lady) horn.

I know it's just vanity but....
 

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Often makers have left over bodies with lower serial numbers that are assembled and engraved later on. I have a gold plated C Melody that has a lower number around 1923 but it is pure Chu as to keywork. They probably had a gold plated body (with the low number) that was assembled a few years later. My guess is that this soprano was ordered after sopranos were discontinued. I have a Martin curvy that has a 1937 serial number and engraving but is clearly an earlier model. In this case the serial number was put on at the time of assembly. My Mark VI alto was ordered in Dec of 1963 and delivered in Feb 1964 but the serial number is from 1962 as it has the rear Eb and probably had the body sitting around for a while.
 

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It's a silverplate finish, BTW....(states in description)...but yeah, Bruce....your explanation is quite plausible.
 

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It's one of the stretch horns which indeed were the last sopranos and ran into the 235xxx S/N range (about 220xxx to 235xxx). It has the funny bis key that I'm pretty sure indicates a stretch model.
It will require its original mouthpiece or one specially made to play it in tune. It needs a special chamber configuration.
 

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Mind you, there are Transitional Tenors and Altos with a Chu-stlye table and a Lady engraving...but NOT as early in serial sequence as this Soprano.
I have seen a 234,xxx silver alto with the lady engraving. Was about 8 or 9 years ago. Very cool horn; Chu style pinky table, nice shape. I didn't get a chance to play the horn, but the guy who owned it said it played just like a late Chu.

- Saxaholic
 

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My main soprano is a 1929 Conn Stretchy.

This eBay horn has the right keywork, anyway. However the seller hasn't told us the length of the soprano — if it's a Stretchy it measures 67cm. The serial number is not enclosed in an engraved shield. As far as I know, all Strtchies had this feature.

The engraving on my own Stretchy is the standard leaves and curlicues they were using in 1929. The Ladyface engraving wasn't invented yet, and didn't appear for another few years. Yet this instrument on eBay has the Ladyface engraved on it, so obviously the engraving was done at least three years after manufacture. I've never seen a Conn straight soprano with the Ladyface. That doesn't mean they weren't made, but it does suggest there weren't very many of them.

Maybe in the late 1930s, a customer asked for a straight soprano with engraving to match his new 10M ? They'd stopped making the straight sopranos by then, so they took one out of the stockpile and engraved a Ladyface on it to order.

Or perhaps the engraving is after-market. Who knows ?

For anyone who's interested in buying this horn, the important thing to ascertain is whether it's a Stretchy or not: if it is, and there's no original mouthpiece with it, you're in trouble.
 

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There is a straight soprano on Ebay for a way too low price if this is a real thing.

surly Conn never made a straight Naked Lady?? Did they??
Very interesting, a slightly different lady to the M series (flatter chested) so obviously someone has started to experiment with that engraving of naked lady in the pentagon (or whatever the shape is called)

I'm not sure how you can say the price is too low when it's an auction - the bidders set the price so generally an auction sells for the market value. Plus the pads seem to be shot to pieces so factor in an overhaul
 

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Discussion Starter #19
It is a stretch 26 1/2 inches
 

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In that case, it'll need its own original mouthpiece to play in tune.
 
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