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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I posted before that I was having issues with sticking pads on my Buescher after a total overhaul with new pads and decided to post an audio file with the noise it makes. The pads are "My Pads".

Followed all advices, tried everything from, smoking paper, euro notes, lighter fluid, clean the tone holes with lighter fluid... Lighter fluid helps for about a day but then it´s back to the way it was. The pads sticking the worst are bottom D, E, F & F#, they all make the same sticky sound tough!

The tech says it will go away after a while, but it was done last december and I play everyday for like 2hours so it should of been gone by now...

I had my Selmer SA80II done last year by another tech and it plays great no sticky noise what so ever.

Any thoughts please???

Regards!
 

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Since it sounds as if all else has failed. You might want to try the suggestions I made in this thread: Sticky Pads

If you can find a local piano tuner or technician, that person is likely to have some teflon powder and he/she may sell or give you a small amount. If the seats in those "offending" pads are quite deep, then that is certainly contributing to the sticking problem.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Hello Stephen, I will post a picture tonight. Spring tension is softer/ nicer than my Selmer.
As I´ve been struggeling since the begining, I went back with it to the tech a few times already, a couple of weeks ago he adjusted the tension a little and the pad opening to almost max (It improved soundwise, spring tension I could not feel the difference)

On my Selmer the pads hardly make any sound when opening, u just hear the mechanism and the note when open/ closing.
 

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I actually bought the Haynes Manual and followed the steps, but without any luck...
Did you go over the pads in particular with a Q-Tip dipped in lighter fluid? And I mean the entire pad, as well as the rim of the tone hole. Whatever the sticky substance was on the new pads installed (Selmer type) on my horn, the lighter fluid counteracted. The only pad that seemed not to respond for me was for my bis key. The spring was set pretty weak though from the overhaul, so I reset it with a bit more strength and haven't had the problem since with this horn; and it's been years now.
 

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I actually bought the Haynes Manual and followed the steps, but without any luck...
As I wrote in my first response "when all else has failed" you might want to try the 1000 grit sandpaper with ultra fine teflon powder using the technique described in the post I provided a link to. Find a piano technician to "borrow" or buy a small amount of the powder, and pick up a sheet of the 1000 grit wet or dry paper at a paint store or auto store with automotive paint supplies.

Do it on just the low D pad using 2 or 3 pulls of the paper with the powder on it and then check the stickiness compared to the other pads. Then you can submit another recording to show the difference between that pad and the ones next to it. You have nothing to lose.

It will not harm your instrument in any fashion whatsoever. The amount of metal removed from the tonehole is in microns, and the ultrafine teflon powder particles do not stick to each other and clump up. You can always blow and/or wipe the powder off the pad afterward if it doesn't work or you don't like it.
 

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Did you make sure you also cleaned the tone holes with the lighter fluid and not just the pads? I would try to make sure the pad is thouroughly cleaned with the lighter fluid and then the tone hole rim and also the sides of its top, to really double make sure there isn't some sticky stuff there getting back on the pads after you clean it. Unless of oucrse you already tried all that, then...

Most of the time the solutions Grumps suggested above work. Sometimes even going over the pad and tone hole with lighter fluid and making sure the spring is not too weak doesn't stop stickiness, or helps very temporarily (like in the OP's case, it seems). Then you have to resort to other options to solve it, if you don't want to replace the pad.

Still curious what model pads you have you have on your Selmer which don't stick...?
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Thanks for the replies!

Grumps: I did use a pipe cleaner fully soaked in lighter fluid, cleaned the entire pad and also the in/ outside of the tonehole. Works for a day or two...

JBTSAX: The tech did use ultra fine grit paper on the toneholes last time I was there a couple of weeks ago, not the teflon powder tough, I will try and get hold of some Teflon Powder and follow up ur advice and see if it works.

Clarnibass: The Pads used by the other tech on my Selmer are Rigotti´s, I mean the usual G# happends sometimes when starting to play but after that no problems what so ever... I´m actually considering having new pads installed by someone else, but I just payed a lot of money for the total service...

It doesn´t seem right that I have been back with it to the shop 4 times in 3 months for the same matter, after it works for a little while (Sticky sound remains) and then they start sticking again. I mean I take care of it, wipe it through everytime after playing, let it dry on it´s stand then store it in it´s case... I actually enjoy playing on the Buescher more than the Selmer, but lately I get annoyed and just play on the Selmer.

Tonight I will post a picture of the Buescher´s pads and a sound recording of the Selmer pads to hear the difference, the Selmer pads you can hardly hear when opening and the Buescher is like if it´s glued to the tonehole.
 

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I did use a pipe cleaner fully soaked in lighter fluid, cleaned the entire pad and also the in/ outside of the tonehole. Works for a day or two...
A pipe cleaner isn't going to hold as much lighter fluid as a Q-Tip, so you still might want to give that a go for a more thorough cleaning. That sticky pad sound you posted certainly brought back memories. I remember how upset I was with the tech that installed the sticky pads on my horn, but thankfully the lighter fluid worked to remove whatever it was on the pads that had that adhesive quality before I ever let my displeasure be known.
 

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Tonight I will post a picture of the Buescher´s pads and a sound recording of the Selmer pads to hear the difference, the Selmer pads you can hardly hear when opening and the Buescher is like if it´s glued to the tonehole.
If possible it would help to see a close up photo of the toneholes as well, if you are comfortable with taking the lower stack off the sax. Also I would suggest that you run your finger around both the inside and outside of each tonehole to check for burrs.

Your sticking is caused either by something on the surface of the pad and/or tonehole, or a mechanical "gripping" of the leather inside or aroung the pad seat by the edges of the tonehole, or both.

If cleaning with Naptha (lighter fluid) remedies the problem for only a short time and then the problem returns:

1. The Naptha is not dissolving whatever is on the pad and/or tonehole causing it to stick. If that substance is water based, Naptha will not dissolve it!
2. Rubbing the surface of the pad's leather during the cleaning may soften the leather in and around the pad seat temporarily minimizing the mechanical grab.
3. The Naptha is dissolving the cause of the stickiness (original pad waterproofing?), but it is not actually removed and when it dries completely goes back to the same sticky texture.
4. The problem has to do with deep seats in the pads, and/or burrs on the edges of the toneholes.

My best guess at this point would be #3 with perhaps a bit of #4. Solution: Use the teflon & 1000 grit sandpaper, and if there are burrs around the toneholes have your tech remove them or do it yourself using 1) a small ball of aluminum foil, 2) a fine fingernail polishing board on the outside, and a piece of 1000 grit sandpaper over your finger on the inside.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Here are some picture of bottom F, and bottom C & Eb´s pads, i wasnt to sure about taking the bottom stack pads off, but bottom C & Eb yes. Couldnt get a better close up of the tone hole, came out blurr all the time...
 

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Well, I don't know what the other techs will think but it look to me like they're a bit on the thick side.
It also looks like they have quite deep impressions...so that's not going to help.
Also, the leather looks to be a bit loose - that pad on the right in the second shot looks like it has a crease in it and the pad in the fourth shot has a bit of a bulge at the front.

It's had to really say without being able to see the thing in person, but my gut feeling is that you could have done with tighter, firmer pads...probably what you've got fitted to the Selmer.
Mypads don't generally tend to be excessively sticky though.

Regards,
 

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I concur with Stephen. The first photo tells the story. Thick, soft, pads with deep seats are problematic in several ways---one of which is tending to "adhere" to the tonehole. In my experience Bueschers need to have the .160" - .165" thickness pads. The amount of pad protrusion in the photo looks like thicker pads to me, along with the depth of the snap in resonator.
 

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Those pads are crap. The skin is wrinkled there to thick and it looks like the skin is actually loose, you can actually see the skin hangining, Id almost bet something on the fact there not leather pads but synthetic leather, horrible stuff, add into that the impression marks and you will never stop that thing from click clicking
 

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If they are really Mypads made by Music Center as the OP said then they have real leather, not synthetic. It's the most basic model so other pads by them have higher quality leather etc. I agree with Steve that Myapds don't tend to be especially sticky. It looks like they are cramped into the pad cup causing them to distort and making the leather loose.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Well it sounds like I payed for something that is no good, I payed $590 for the service 3 months ago.
I guess the best thing to do would be demand a repad!
 

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Well, there is one technique that might help - shrinking the pads.
What's needed here, I think, is to reduce the looseness of the leather (which has been caused by removing the original reflector and replacing it with a snap in...there's less surface area pulling down on the pad).

Part of the technique (mine anyway) of setting pads involves the use of a pad setting plate to level the pad in its cup and smooth off the leather. This plate is a thin, flat metal disc with a hole in its centre to accomodate the reflector. The plate is heated so that it grips the leather and acts like an iron.
It's very important that this plate isn't overheated, as that would sear the leather and cause it to shrink. Under normal circumstances with would mean having to throw the pad away and start again - but it's a technique that might be used to advantage in your situation.

I think it has to be said though that it's a bit of a bodge, but if done carefully it might resolve the problem you're having.

Regards,
 
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