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Forum Contributor 2015, seeker of the knowing of t
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Discussion Starter #1
I've had Steve's book for a couple of years and was prompted to get it out again this week after a 251 lesson with my teacher. Now that I "get" this stuff a lot better I played through a heap of the exercises which are great not only for themselves but for reading, time and tone as well.

Now they are all in one key which is C. I'm keen to run them in all keys, what do you guys recommend? Take one and do that in all keys trying to transpose, or maybe think of the tone numbers, or should i just write a heap out and play them robot style without thinking about it?

Cheers
 

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Start with the simplest one, take it at a comfortable tempo where you could sing it as well and then run it through all the keys, without writing them out.

Each time you attack a new key sing it first from the new starting note, until you can hear/sing the new 2-5-1 roots as well. Then play it on your horn and try to match it with what you hear. Again take it slow but do as much "ear" work as you can.

I do this with my own lines or lines I get from solos. I try to get as much "ear" into the process, that I start to vary and explore it.
 

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Absolutely, find an easy pattern and transpose it into all 12 keys. Do it in time, with various progressions (half step, whole step, min 3rds, circle of 4ths). In time the process gets much easier, but the language will become automatic.

Good to hear his book is in C, I'll have to check it out again. I think I asked him once about that, but it wasn't at the time, and it seemed like a lot of extra wasted space, at least how I learned ii-V patterns.
 

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Forum Contributor 2015, seeker of the knowing of t
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Discussion Starter #5
Start with the simplest one, take it at a comfortable tempo where you could sing it as well and then run it through all the keys, without writing them out.

Each time you attack a new key sing it first from the new starting note, until you can hear/sing the new 2-5-1 roots as well. Then play it on your horn and try to match it with what you hear. Again take it slow but do as much "ear" work as you can.

I do this with my own lines or lines I get from solos. I try to get as much "ear" into the process, that I start to vary and explore it.
I'm trying to resist writing them out as youve described, I just think it will add an unecessary step to the process, starting simple is a good idea.

think of bach
?

Absolutely, find an easy pattern and transpose it into all 12 keys. Do it in time, with various progressions (half step, whole step, min 3rds, circle of 4ths). In time the process gets much easier, but the language will become automatic.

Good to hear his book is in C, I'll have to check it out again. I think I asked him once about that, but it wasn't at the time, and it seemed like a lot of extra wasted space, at least how I learned ii-V patterns.
Yep my teacher had me running patterns in different progressions this week, it exposed a habit that I didnt know I had which was running everything around the circle.
 

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I went through them all and put them in BIAB when I first got them. Then I learned a few of the ones that really sounded good to me and transposed them to the other keys.
 

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Yep my teacher had me running patterns in different progressions this week, it exposed a habit that I didnt know I had which was running everything around the circle.
I use a sheet with random keys, one of my teachers gave me. PM me with your email if you want me to scan it for you.

Just get the stuff in your ears and approach it creatively. There are to may jazz robots out there IMO...
 

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I wouldn't write them out in all the keys. That's fine if you are working on reading skills, but not if you want to get more facile when improvising over ii-V-I changes and learning to play in all 12 keys. For that, you're far better off transposing by ear. It will take a bit longer, but you'll really get it to where you can use those phrases, and equally important, start altering them or embellishing them or simplifying them etc. to come up with your own interpretation.

Once I get a certain ii-V-I line down really well in one key, I find it's not too hard to transpose it by ear, but it does take some time to get the finger-memory down in a new key. But that's just a matter of practice. I guess for me at least, getting the sound in my ear (mind) happens much better when I don't just read by rote, but rather transpose by ear.
 

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I'm working on this book for a few months now. I spend a month on each page. I play all the exercises on that page in a key, then transpose mentally to all the other keys. Over the month I gradually increase the speed. This is a great resource for getting solid basics and it's also great to work on your sound if you start by playing the patterns very slowly.
 

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Distinguished SOTW Member, Forum Contributor 2014
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Steve's book it part of my morning routine; however, I realized at a late age that if something isn't memorized COLD - I can't use it in an improvised solo. So I've started the process of learning each one in all 12 keys by ear. Sometimes I use intervals and other times I use scale degree numbers. It is incredibly SLOW. I mean FOREVER slow - BUT after 25 years of messing around with transcription books - I feel like I really making TRUE improvisation progress. I rarely use a complete passage in a solo but the materials opens up the next change beautifully. Put this together with the Steve's Brecker Licks page and you'll have a lifetime of work with lots of humbling experiences to look forward to. :(

Good Luck
 

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Forum Contributor 2015, seeker of the knowing of t
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Discussion Starter #12
Is there an edition of Steve's ii-V-I book(s) available where each pattern is written in just one key (several patterns on one page)?
The one I have does
 

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Forum Contributor 2015, seeker of the knowing of t
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Discussion Starter #13

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Forum Contributor 2016, Distinguished SOTW Member
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I have students use the II-V-I primer patterns on stuff like Vol. 21 Aebersold or Vol 3 II-V-I. I also have them work them into their tunes they are working on. I always stress that the patterns are a means to an end. Not the end itself. They have to lead to improvisation. The goal is for them to be so effortless that you can play whatever you want and start on any note you want. You'll also be able to hear the ideas. They also give you a ton of melodic material to work with.
 
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