[tomcov]

Been playing soprano 25 years (jazz/smooth jazz/pop etc). Shifted from Selmer Super 80 to a Yani 981 10 years ago but have never found my mouthpiece set up, which all worked well on the selmer, felt right on the Yani. I'd like some advice from a soprano player on some options to consider. Here's what I'm thinking about:

* I play Lavoz medium reeds and I'm not planning on switching.
* On the yani, my runyon 8 is ok for sure but a bit stuffy and I hate the feel in my mouth. The Dukoff D6 sounds nice low end but flat and thin top end - done with it. The Bari 70 is way too open for me to handle...stuffy, hard to keep in tune.
* I have a Selmer S80 D that I haven't played for 20 years and put it on. It is easy to blow, in tune, but feels like it lacks power for me...but what I like about it is that unlike my other pieces, it feels most controlled and in tune.
* One final thing...my yani is more bright than the Selmer...so I don't want a mouthpiece that brightens it further...I want full and rich.

QUESTIONS
1. If I was to get a more open Selmer, but not interested in losing the control I get in my D; would you recommend an E, F or G...at what point is it just becoming like my runyon 8, bari 70 etc. How much will I have to increase from my D to feel like I can notice a change step up?
2. When you compare a Selmer s80 vs super session on soprano, what would the actual sound difference be.
3. Should I consider a MEYER soprano? I used to play Meyer 7M alto and it was great for jazz band...any reason this would be better than the Selmer?

Thanks for any and all input.

 

[DaveR]

Contact Joe at Sopranoplanet.com. Joe will sort you out for sure and you will never look back!

 

[Metalflake]

Super Sessions are much bigger, fuller sounding, more free-blowing pieces than the S80, IMO. I own one of the latter, and it has always felt "pinched" to me, whereas the SS accepted pretty much all the air I could put through it. I don't know if I'd describe the sound I got out of it as warm - full & loud, but not necessarily warm (though that term is highly subjective I know).

I came very close to buying a Meyer 7 - it could definitely get you where you want to be, soundwise. I found it to be very sweet & warm, with plenty of projection and good intonation. In the end I decided to stick with my Vandoren S25, as the Meyer sound didn't seem quite as maleable as I'd like. Still a very good piece IMO.

 

[Dave Dolson]

I play soprano as a first-horn (55+ years now). I have a large range of soprano S-80 mouthpieces (C* through J). I have three Super Sessions J and one Super Session E, plus many others of various brands materials, etc.

I agree that the SS line is a huge improvement over the S-80 line, but mouthpieces are a personal thing.

I've found the SS-J to be good choice albeit a bit bright for me on some sopranos. The SS-E (an improvement over the S-80 E) is lacking when played against the SS-J, mainly because I've always favored open mouthpieces and the E requires too hard of a reed for me to play with expressiveness.

I have a Runyon Custom (forgot the tip-opening) and while it plays okay for me, it is not up to my favorite pieces. I've owned and sold a Dukoff long ago. Miserable for me.

My current favorite is the Morgan Vintage line - I have them in 6 and 7 tips (the 6 = .065). I've discovered that if someone else likes what I like, then they MAY make a recommendation that works for me, too. Someone else who liked the SS-J recommended the Morgan Vintages and I bought two of them. They were MY answer. The #6 works best for me (on all of my sops from vintage to modern, straight to curved). They give me acoustic (non-amplified) power, warmth, intonation, and response.

I also second the recommendation to contact Joe at sopranoplanet. I have not used his services - yet - but everyone here raves about his work and his pieces.

As far as refusing to budge from a reed selection - that seems a bit narrow-minded. Most mouthpieces play better with the proper reed selection. I find that my MV 6 piece requires a slightly harder reed than do the MV 7 (.070) and the SS-J (.069). I'd be working too hard if i insisted on sticking with one reed, one cut, and one strength. DAVE

 

[betelsax]

"It (Selmer S80 D) is easy to blow, in tune, but feels like it lacks power for me...but what I like about it is that unlike my other pieces, it feels most controlled and in tune.

Hey, that's pretty darned good in a world in which nothing is perfect (except in our imaginations). Stick with the S80 D until it becomes part of you. Then, after a month or two, if you are still dissatisfied, buy an S80 E (it may give you more "power"). Play that for a while. Then A/B them and see which one sings more readily for you.

 

[Grumps]

If you feel a Super Session will be too bright, try a Selmer Metal Classic instead. They go up to at least a G tip opening.

 

[Joe Jazz]

D=.51, E=.53, F=.57, G=.61, H=.63, I=.65, and J=.69......so at a J you are about where your Bari mpc is. Maybe try a G or an H?

 

[Dave Dolson]

Joe Jazz: Interesting to see those tip-openings lined up like that. I agree that if a Bari 70 is the same opening as (or close to) the SS-J at .069, then maybe something smaller would be reasonable. But my experience has shown me that it is more than merely the tip-opening that may be in play. What those additional factors may be (consistency of the tip rails, chamber size, chamber design, baffle design, etc.) remain a mystery to me, and I suspect many others.

Why a certain mouthpiece plays well for me and another doesn't, or why they vary among different players, even of the same design, I don't understand. I just know that some open pieces play better than other open pieces. And the same throughout mouthpiece-dom.

For instance, while both my Morgan Vintage 7 and a Super Session J are about the same (.069 vs. .070), there is a huge difference when I play them. I once had an SS-I (your post shows it at .065) that I thought was surely not for me. Yet, the Morgan Vintage 6 (at .065) is wonderful for me.

Back to the OP's questions, about Meyers - I haven't found a Meyer soprano that I like, but I have Meyer alto pieces that play very nicely. These issues are VERY subjective and personal. DAVE

 

[cvsimson]

Contact Joe at Sopranoplanet.com. Joe will sort you out for sure and you will never look back!

+1.

Joe helped me in getting my C-Soprano mouthpiece just right. He is a great person to communicate with an provides good advice about what will work for you.

 

[tomcov]

These are great responses guys...appreciate them.

Dave-you are probably right about the problems I will have if I don't adjust reeds to fit the piece. If I move up slightly to a Selmer F or G, I'll probably have to move my La Voz medium up to Medium hard to give it more umpf. Just trying to minimize the variables. You definitely have me thinking hard about the MORGAN. It sounds like it would be a great option to a Selmer in terms of full tone, easy blow, etc. Since I'm moving away from the larger tip sizes I'm thinking a .60 opening (MORGAN 5) might be a good option to consider...

 

[tomcov]

I just sent an email to Joe at soprano planet. I shared my post here today for background and my question was what he thought he could do with my SELMER D S80 in terms of helping me get to the tone/feel I'm looking for. I told him that if Im tempted by any stock piece right now its probably a MORGAN 5 or just upping my SELMER S80 to an F or G opening. In general I remain a bit nervous about the SS piece since I hear enough posts about it having a stuffy or edgy feel unless you go to a J opening which I don't think I'll do.

 

[tomcov]

I've exchanged many emails today with Joe at Sopranoplanet. After getting a sense of my set up, mouthpieces, horn, sound concept and current frustrations, he suggested that instead of buying a new Selmer SS or any other piece that I send him my BARI .70. He is convinced that with his resurfacing work it can be the piece that gives me the sound and feel I want. My main complaint is that despite the sound I can get out of it, it is stuffy and he is convinced that is not a tip opening issue but alot of other things. So, I'm sending it out tomorrow and very excited about finally getting a match between soprano mouthpiece, horn, reed and my desired sound. I'll keep you posted on progress. Very excited about a new phase in my soprano playing...which funny enough was my first love on the sax even pre Alto. Thanks for all the great input here - this forum helped me land on buying 2 yanagisawa horns back in 2000; helped me get onto Runyon Custom as the best Alto piece I ever played and now to a hopefully fantastic soprano piece.

 

[DaveR]

Good for you, you will get a fabulous mouthpiece from Joe, and he's more than willing to keep adjusting until you are happy. Please do let us know how it goes.

 

[Joe Jazz]

:cheers:

 

[Jazzaferri]

The wonderful thing about dealing with Joe is he will keep working with you in the unlikely event it isn't quite what you want the first time

I have 4 of his mpces and with the last made from a Buescher 868 blank I have found my sound. IiMO you have made a good decision

 

[Joe Giardullo]

D=.51, E=.53, F=.57, G=.61, H=.63, I=.65, and J=.69......so at a J you are about where your Bari mpc is. Maybe try a G or an H?

I've had 3 stock Bari 70 pieces here this week. Here are the actual tip openings: .066, .072 and .0725.

 

[Dave Dolson]

Joe: FUNNY!! A SOTW Classic! We all put so much faith in marketing hype and manufactures' claims . . . DAVE

 

[Joe Jazz]

I've had 3 stock Bari 70 pieces here this week. Here are the actual tip openings: .066, .072 and .0725.

consistency is the mark of champions.....

 

[Joe Giardullo]

You know, the tip opening is stamped on the piece before a piece is faced, not afterward.

 

[tomcov]

Well...I started this thread 3 weeks ago. Here's a quick update. I contacted Joe at SopranoPlanet to discuss my posting here and my frustrations with my 4 existing mouthpieces and my desire for a much better mouthpiece for my YANI. He helped me think through the "sound concept" I was going for. Was a bit concerned about sounding naive in saying "I want to sound like this guy or that guy" but he wanted some examples of sound that I'm listening too that Im drawn to and feel I play. For me, two players capture the best of the soprano sound I want and gravitate to in playing: Kenny Garrett and Brandford Marsalis. Sent him sound clips and he listened to Kenny playing songs I was after. I think this helped us cut through the fuzziness of simply saying "dark" or "warm" or "freeblowing"...so subjective. He encouraged me to send the BARI .70 piece saying that after his work on it it would be as good for sure as a resurfaced Super Session piece.

After he got it he identified the issues and let me know what he'd do. Just got the piece back. He worked on all aspects of the piece: tip, chamber, rails, and other mouthpiece anatomy I don't understand. The piece is fantastic. I have a true .70 piece that is definitely not too open as some might worry about...feels so natural and easy to blow. First thing that struck me: the lower register fully opened up - easier to blow, full, rich...but not fully devoid of a touch of resistance to make it fun. Second thing that struck me was how consistent the sound quality/tone now was across the range of the horn - had felt that the piece was easy in spots and rough in other spots on the horn. I like knowing that I can connect with Joe at any time on this piece if there was ever an issue - and he told me that if I wasn't satisfied he'd buy it himself since it is now an original JG mouthpiece. So, nice to have a BARI mpc the way it was supposed to play. Just for fun, after playing it for 1 hour, I put on my SELMER D - felt so bad...square sounding, limited, expressionless comparably. Then my RUNYON 8...which can be a nice piece in spots (especially low end, but thin up top), but comparably harder to control even though the tip is slightly less...then the DUKOFF D6 which is pretty nice down low and, for me, terrible up top.

I told Joe that as an ALTO, SOPRANO player for 25 years who once was stronger on Soprano than Alto but let that slip over the last decade due to my dissatisfaction of the tone/feel I've been getting with the Yani-Mpc combos I had...and really let it go. Now I can feel the soprano "feel" coming back man - so fired up about that.

Sidenote: regarding my comment on the Yani-mpc dissatisfaction I had...when I had a Selmer Super 80 soprano, it actually seemed to work nice with the Dukoff but when I switched to Yani the Dukoff was awful. My Bari never really gave me something I could flourish with.