[simso]

So what does 1300 dollars and 8 weeks wait, get you where you live???

Option 1 - A beautiful overhauled Saxophone
Option 2 - A very nicely repadded instrument, playing nice with tight keywork
Option 3 - A nicely playing instrument with some loose keywork
Option 4 - A poorly playing instrument with tight keywork
Option 5 - A poorly playing instrument with loose keywork
Option 6 - A bad pad job and bad loose keywork
Option 7 - A return of your instrument and money kept by the repairer
Option 8 - A bag of parts and money kept by repairer

 

[Benny]

A can of worms by the sounds of things.......

 

[milandro]

I think that you refer to this.......

So this is like (common word used by the newer generation), so this is like part 2 of some people should never repair.

Apparently one can have two costed rates, professional and student. A local business gives you an option when you have your instrument repaired ???

So back to the ethic's thing, if you quote someone and tell them 4 weeks, what do you do if you cannot honour that quote.

I, if for some reason cannot meet the deadline ring the customer and let them know why I cannot meet the agreed deadline and offer them a loaner or renegotiate. After all we are self employed and accidents can happen and we all get sick, which can affect time schedules in shops.

Apparently the local business that offers two rates professional and student, does something differently. An example, an instrument is quoted 4 weeks to be repadded (cost in excess of 1000 dollars), at the 6 week mark customer has enquired what is happening, the persons apparent reply, yeh... The customer hears bad news that this repairer, has a reputation for handing instruments back to customers after a couple of years in a box uncompleted / stuffed up.

Customer asks what is required to cancel the job and get his instrument back, the cost just a humble 540 dollars for 4 hrs work required to pull the instrument apart and remove the pads.

Mmm.......

In my part of the world , 921€ (AUS $1300) will give me 3 overhauls ( and 21€ to spare) by Tim Brennan from Haarlem ( which includes Rigotti pads with metal or plastic resonators and ANY necessary work : soldering, straightening, undenting, leveling)

or

+/- 2 overhauls by more expensive technicians (all performing all the necessary re-pad and metal work) including Nico Bodewes from Amsterdam or Jeffrey from Harry Bakker in Muiderberg

Normally, I would have my horn back in 2 weeks tops, If I am really unlucky 4 weeks, Harry Bakker also comes to pick it up or deliver it if necessary.

 

[Jazz Is All]

For that thousand euros I can get number one on two horns.

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[Aldevis]

Option 1, I can choose among great repairers and I have money left for an expensive new mouthpiece and a dinner out.

 

[simso]

Option 8 is the closest, I thought writing down to option 15 was a bit ridiculous

Apparently its okay to give someone a saxophone complete in its case and have the above returned to you,

A returned stripped sax / damaged crook / split seam / burnt lacquer/ broken case / keys dumped into a paper bag and they keep all your money

No names, because I am only going by what the customer has said.

 

[milandro]

Option 8 is the closest, I thought writing down to option 15 was a bit ridiculous

Apparently its okay to give someone a saxophone complete in its case and have the above returned to you and they keep all your money, and yes split and damage the crook when trying to take the dent out.

I suggest to refer this shop to the local version of BBC Rogue Traders

 

[simso]

All I can say folks, is please ask around before handing over your pride and joy to someone, I have had a to type an inspection report on this one, as the customer just wants his money back

 

[milandro]

The BBC program above (they have a couple of these BTW, all exposing, naming and shaming the culprits) is just an example of the kind of rogue traders out there.

They are everywhere on the prowl for ordinary people who have no suspicions about them and who most of the times, genuinely believe that if someone runs a business they would be providing honest and capable work.

This is not the case in all walks of life.

Fortunately some of this scum can be prosecuted but they need being exposed.

Although I can appreciate your attempt to do so without being prosecuted in retaliation, for slander o libel, by means of this and the other threads that you've started on the matter, I truly believe that if the situation is the one you describe you should make some attempts to get in touch with the local Australian agency for trading standards.

After all there is a responsibility under many legislation for a citizen who is aware of a scam to denounce it.

I appreciate what you are doing but this needs being brought to the attention of the authorities.

The likely victims of the people that you are hinting about are not even people who would be on this forum and most probably could be just members of the general public who have no idea of what this scum is doing to them.

http://australia.gov.au/topics/business-and-industry/consumer-rights
http://www.fairtrading.qld.gov.au/marketplace/make-a-complaint
https://www.commerce.wa.gov.au/consumer-protection

 

[simso]

After all there is a responsibility under many legislation for a citizen who is aware of a scam to denounce it.
I appreciate what you are doing but this needs being brought to the attention of the authorities.

The problem milandro, it this is hearsay. Albeit a flood of customers one after the other with the same story, but still hearsay on my account. So hence why I do not name names.

If the said repairer was game enough to post on this or any other forum, and explain there side of the many many stories and acknowledge it was them, then I could happily discuss there repair process or ethics openly.

 

[milandro]

I understand.


Actually even if you had harder evidence you will be better advised not to expose the culprits with their names on a forum but to report this to the authorities and let them do the investigative work which this most certainly needs.

Naming and shaming someone publicly would almost certainly provoke them into a libel and slander accusation making YOU the person who all of a suddend has to defend himself.

 

[Jazz Is All]

I understand.

Actually even if you had harder evidence you will be better advised not to expose the culprits with their names on a forum but to report this to the authorities and let them do the investigative work which this most certainly needs.

Naming and shaming someone publicly would almost certainly provoke them into a libel and slander accusation making YOU the person who all of a suddend has to defend himself.

Nobody on SOTW seems to have been concerned about that with all the accusations against L.B. a few years ago or now with D.J. And of course Mr. NOLA Snakeoil is a perennial target.

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[Jazz Is All]

Nobody on SOTW seems to have been concerned about that with all the accusations against L.B. a few years ago or now with D.J. And of course Mr. NOLA Snakeoil is a perennial target. So I doubt what you warn against is a real threat. For one thing, in which jurisiction could they sue? Too complex without a ton of money for an team of International lawyers.

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[Jazz Is All]

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This was supposed to be an edit, not a quote.

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[milandro]

Jazz is all, I wasn't referring to anybody taking exception at anything happening on this forum or on fora per se or in general.
Hypothetically.

I was referring to the possibility that if anyone should name and shame someone in clear letters, this person might take the person who named and shamed to court, hypothetically, in, for example, Australia.

In that case.

Although it is unlikely that an Australian court might have jurisdiction on a Finnish site or on people residing outside of Australia for something like this, ( which I think, but I am not sure, SOTW is) , if both the namer and shamer and the named and shamed were in the same country, say, for example, Australia, the namer and shamer would have THEN to defend himself from becoming the accused of a libel and slander court case being brought up in a court of the country where both reside.

Any or all of this, is of course, highly hypothetical!

 

[Jazz Is All]

Well in the cases of L.B., D.J. and a few others none of those guys sued anyone for anything, so I think the chance of it happening in this case is nil.

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[milandro]

we are talking of two competing business one of which would openly attack another, different kettle of fish

Better let things be dealt with from the authorities

 

[JayeLID]

OK, back to the initial question:

It gets you Option 1 in the Bay Area....

and maybe in 4-6 weeks, although some of the most reputed techs will most certainly take 8 weeks...but the two best ones will do it in 2 weeks for $1000.

In Portland.....Option 9 (an overhaul on one of your horns, and a full repad on another.....and if you choose the right couple of techs, they'd both be done in 2-3 weeks)

But yeah, heck....these long, delayed waits for high costs, and not getting the horn back in tip- top shape.....all of this sadly isn't that uncommon.....

 

[milandro]

maybe I should start an international intermediation overhaul service

 

[hornfixer]

So what does 1300 dollars and 8 weeks wait, get you where you live???

Option 1
I work at home.