[dowvid]

Hi
I have an old 1911 Buescher True Tone alto, silver body.
I guess it is silver plated ? I am a french speaking guy, and I don't understand all the particularities of english language.
I've read many discussions about that point, and read about lacquer, electroplating, etc.
My concern is about the maintenance of my alto.
It was a very tarnished silver sax. I could say it was a n almost black sax
Yesterday, I stripped it off and polish it with Brazo compound. It is now a resplendishing silver white saxo.
How do I do to keep it without tarnishing ? I don't care about loss of silver on the thumb key, just want to keep it silver looking.
My questions :
Is that sax lacquered ? What is a lacquer ? Is it a clear varnish ?
Is it possible to spray a clear varnish on my alto to protect tarnishing ?
Or is it possible to use car wax on it to protect ? I guess car wax will run over fast ? And I will have to do it again ?
I don't put my sax in its case, mines are always on a stand ready to play. Anti tarnish strips won't be effective on it that way.
My flute is beginning to show some tarnishing too...
Tanks

 

[Pete Thomas]

Technically you could get it overlacquered, some modern silver plated saxophones are silver with lacquer protection but that is done from new. The prep require to lacquer this would involve buffing out scratches, you'd probably lose some silver plate in the process along with sharpness of engraving. Plus the best lacquer shops seems to be the manufacturers these days (Chinese and Taiwanese lacquering is usually excellent BTW)

DIY spray job? maybe, but I've never seen it done successfully to be honest.

Best IMO is to keep it in the case as much as possible with same tarnish inhibiting cloth and give it a polishing once a year. This involves only a partial dismantling and a lot of swearing due to being stabbed by the springs.

If you do really want to keep it on the stand, just get to love then tarnishing as I do with my "shades of grey" Naked lady.

I'd advise silver polish, not Brasso.

 

[Guto]

The other downside of lacquering over silver is that every little scratch or worn lacquer areas will tarnish and show even more in contrast with the shinny lacquered silver. Look up some pictures of King Super 20 Silversonic bells on the web and you'll see what to expect.

If you want to leave it out at all times, I recommend you make peace with fact that it will tarnish. Just wipe it clean periodically, and watch it naturally tarnish. Once every several years, do what you just did to polish it back to shinny. I agree with Pete, avoid Brasso, too abrasive.

 

[dowvid]

Technically you could get it overlacquered, some modern silver plated saxophones are silver with lacquer protection but that is done from new. The prep require to lacquer this would involve buffing out scratches, you'd probably lose some silver plate in the process along with sharpness of engraving. Plus the best lacquer shops seems to be the manufacturers these days (Chinese and Taiwanese lacquering is usually excellent BTW)

DIY spray job? maybe, but I've never seen it done successfully to be honest.

Best IMO is to keep it in the case as much as possible with same tarnish inhibiting cloth and give it a polishing once a year. This involves only a partial dismantling and a lot of swearing due to being stabbed by the springs.

If you do really want to keep it on the stand, just get to love then tarnishing as I do with my "shades of grey" Naked lady.

I'd advise silver polish, not Brasso.

Thanks
About spraying, I have an old The Indiana that was so full of red dots.
I sandblasted it with soft powder and not to agressively to get rid of red dots.
Then I let it for a while, getting the metal tarnishing. The I took it back, did some polishing and Ispayed it with clear lacquer varnish I bought in a Home Depot store.
Since that time, it didn't show any new tarnishing, and have a look.
For sure, it doesn't look like my Selmer or my Yamaha, but I love its look. It is not a perfect job of varnishing, but it does the job.

 

[Dr G]

Please don’t again use Brasso - it is abrasive, and will remove silver plate.

Instead, use a silver polish such as Hagerties Silversmith. In spray form, it leaves the brightest finish; in creme form, it leaves an inhibiting film.

I agree that silver tarnishes faster when left out on a stand. My tenors are stored in cases, but my sop is more often on a stand - all are Borgani Jubilee series with heavy silver plate on the mechanism (one tenor is all silver plate). Treated with the same Hagerties, the only difference is in storage - the sop tarnishes much more quickly.

 

[mmichel]

Please don't again use Brasso - it is abrasive, and will remove silver plate.

+1

I strongly agree with this. Do not use Brasso on silver!

In addition, if you want to keep your sax out on its stand without tarnishing too much, a good solution that I've used is to make a slipcover (like a pillowcase) out of anti-tarnish cloth to keep your sax covered when you're not playing it.

 

[dowvid]

OK, I won't use Brasso anymore. I got Weiman Siver Wipes. Shouls it be OK ?

 

[Pete Thomas]

a good solution that I've used is to make a slipcover (like a pillowcase) out of anti-tarnish cloth to keep your sax covered when you're not playing it.

This sounds like a great idea. I'm sure it will slow down tarnishing and also keep dust off, which is also an issue if you leave your horn out.

 

[saxoclese]

Doctor's Products used to sell "anti-tarnish sachets" that were supposed to have 75 times the amount of anti-tarnish chemical as contained in 3M strips. I have used these in my saxophone cases for several years and they do an excellent job. Since the company changed hands unfortunately these are no longer available. They contain sulphur dioxide absorbing pellets made by Purafil which only supplies large quantities to commercial markets. The next best thing is to keep silver plated instruments in their cases when not being played with along with several 3M strips---especially if you live in a more humid environment.

 

[Dr G]

Doctor's Products used to sell "anti-tarnish sachets" that were supposed to have 75 times the amount of anti-tarnish chemical as contained in 3M strips. I have used these in my saxophone cases for several years and they do an excellent job. Since the company changed hands unfortunately these are no longer available. They contain sulphur dioxide absorbing pellets made by Purafil which only supplies large quantities to commercial markets. The next best thing is to keep silver plated instruments in their cases when not being played with along with several 3M strips---especially if you live in a more humid environment.

Maybe you missed the OP's comment:

I don't put my sax in its case, mines are always on a stand ready to play. Anti tarnish strips won't be effective on it that way.

 

[RobSc]

Get some pacific silvercloth and wrap the sax in it on its stand.

 

[motteatoj]

Technically you could get it overlacquered, some modern silver plated saxophones are silver with lacquer protection but that is done from new. The prep require to lacquer this would involve buffing out scratches, you'd probably lose some silver plate in the process along with sharpness of engraving. Plus the best lacquer shops seems to be the manufacturers these days (Chinese and Taiwanese lacquering is usually excellent BTW)

DIY spray job? maybe, but I've never seen it done successfully to be honest.

Best IMO is to keep it in the case as much as possible with same tarnish inhibiting cloth and give it a polishing once a year. This involves only a partial dismantling and a lot of swearing due to being stabbed by the springs.

If you do really want to keep it on the stand, just get to love then tarnishing as I do with my "shades of grey" Naked lady.

I'd advise silver polish, not Brasso.

I just got done swearing over an old C Mel and its 'unfreindly' springs!

I keep my silver saxes on the stands, in Hagerty bags, with a few anti tarnish strips in the bags to boot, necks same in smaller bags in a drawer. Seems to work quite well so far. I'm fairly anal about swabbing and wiping down after each play too though.

 

[dowvid]

Hi everybody.
I've finally finished with my silver True Tone maintenance.
I spread a thin layer of clear all over. It's fun because no finger prints as soon as I touch it. Sure, I'm not a technician, so it is not perfect, but I'm glad with the result.
What a puzzle to put all the stuff on it, it was only the second sax I did.
Some pics here.
Notice the key cup on the left bottom of the sax. I didn't find that same key cup on any other alto. It`s articulated with the low F key.
Before I did the job, that cup was maintained closed with a cork stopper.
And there is no high E and F alternate key.
Still have to work on it , some leaks but no big ones...
2 first pics, my sax was not cleaned...

 

[Pete Thomas]

Notice the key cup on the left bottom of the sax. I didn't find that same key cup on any other alto. It`s articulated with the low F key.

I'd have assumed that key was the Eb trill

 

[turf3]

That's the fork Eb.

Not much use as a "trill key" in my opinion, as you can trill just dandy with your RH little finger, but very handy for going from low C#, C, B, or Bb to Eb.

 

[dowvid]

Seems to be opened only when I play bottom F. No trill at all but for E-F. No other articulation than with F key. That cup is opened when I play bottom F and higher, and closed as soon as I hit lower keys Bb,B C etc... I would guess it is for intonation only...

 

[turf3]

NO. It's the fork Eb.

The RH middle finger closes the fork Eb pad; the pad under the RH middle finger is closed either by the RH middle finger or by the RH ring finger.

If you finger a D and then you lift the RH middle finger, the pad under that finger remains closed, as it's held by the pad below it; but the fork Eb pad opens and the horn sounds an Eb. Trust me on this. The fork Eb was standard on almost all saxophones until some time in the early or mid 1930s.

 

[milandro]

it is certainly the Eb trill and no, it isn't for intonation purposes, lots of brands had them and were abandoned in some cases just about at the end of the '40

read about it here (the usual fountain of knowledge of the archives) this an many other threads

Eb trill key on vintage Bueschers and Conns

I just completed a True Tone alto and spent a lot of time getting the Eb trill to work as it should. I won't go into all of the detail, but there were many inherent design problems that had to be overcome that made it a real challenge and very time consuming. I now understand why many techs...

www.saxontheweb.net

 

[dowvid]

NO. It's the fork Eb.

The RH middle finger closes the fork Eb pad; the pad under the RH middle finger is closed either by the RH middle finger or by the RH ring finger.

If you finger a D and then you lift the RH middle finger, the pad under that finger remains closed, as it's held by the pad below it; but the fork Eb pad opens and the horn sounds an Eb. Trust me on this. The fork Eb was standard on almost all saxophones until some time in the early or mid 1930s.

Yes, you are right. Just tried it. Thanks

 

[saxoclese]

Apparently when these saxophones were designed and built, trills were a common part of popular literature for the saxophone. Not only mechanisms that made Eb trills easier, but G# trills as well. This Apogee Evette-Shaeffer Buffet Crampon soprano incorporated a "piggy back" D key that allowed the D to be closed with the 2nd finger allowing the 3rd finger to trill to Eb using the small key cup above. In addition the 3 "levers" are alternate RH keys that enable a player to trill between low B and low B, and from low C to low C#.