[Bubba06]

Hey guys, got this Series III recently, have been trying to decide whether or not to keep it or the Mark VI I've been playing for almost ten years. Not expecting this video to make or break anything, but it was enjoyable to make.
I'd recommend headphones, and closing your eyes if you really want to play along-- I switch tenors every 8 measures. It's the same etude, same mpc/reed, and roughly same position of the microphone. No effects.

-Bubba-

Btw, anybody know the tune?

 

[Sacks Of Phones]

You sound like you on either horn.

 

[mrpeebee]

You sound very close on both, but in my ears the III is brighter and thinner. I prefer the VI and don't know the tune.

 

[Alex Nyman]

Hey guys, got this Series III recently, have been trying to decide whether or not to keep it or the Mark VI I've been playing for almost ten years. Not expecting this video to make or break anything, but it was enjoyable to make.
I'd recommend headphones, and closing your eyes if you really want to play along-- I switch tenors every 8 measures. It's the same etude, same mpc/reed, and roughly same position of the microphone. No effects.

-Bubba-

Btw, anybody know the tune?

Man that's a close call. But to my ears there is a bit more depth in the mid range and more brilliance in the upper range on the VI. Overall it's a better sound but it's a close call and one of those situations where if you were to spend more time with the new one you'd end up with the same sound as the VI. Regardless of the horn it's a really nice sound considering there are no FX to enhance the track. Nice playing Jake.

 

[Guto]

You sound very close on both, but in my ears the III is brighter and thinner. I prefer the VI and don't know the tune.

I've got the exact same impression. I like your Mark VI sound quite better to my taste. It sounds richer and fully to me.

 

[Dr G]

Now try a Ref 36. :twisted:

More importantly, what do you want to hear from your horn?

FWIW, I played a BA 'til it was worn out, then a III for several years, followed by a Ref 36. The III is certainly up to any task - unless phat is where it's at. But the VI doesn't do that either.

Your current mouthpiece suits the VI well, the III less so. If you stick with the III, you could get its sound closer to your current setup on the VI by tweaking mouthpieces.

Enjoy the quest.

P.S. I eventually moved on from the Ref 36 as well, but that's another story. :bluewink:

 

[Tranechaser]

Keep them both!

 

[skeller047]

I agree that the III is a little thinner sounding. Whatever you decide, keep the VI. Just my opinion...

I think the tune is Poinciana. Or based on it.

/Steve


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Bubba06]

...
I think the tune is Poinciana. Or based on it.

/Steve

Ding ding ding!

-Bubba-

 

[Bubba06]

You sound like you on either horn.

You sound very close on both, but in my ears the III is brighter and thinner. I prefer the VI and don't know the tune.

Man that's a close call. But to my ears there is a bit more depth in the mid range and more brilliance in the upper range on the VI. Overall it's a better sound but it's a close call and one of those situations where if you were to spend more time with the new one you'd end up with the same sound as the VI. Regardless of the horn it's a really nice sound considering there are no FX to enhance the track. Nice playing Jake.

I've got the exact same impression. I like your Mark VI sound quite better to my taste. It sounds richer and fully to me.

I agree that the III is a little thinner sounding. Whatever you decide, keep the VI. Just my opinion...

Keep them both!

I'm glad to see the feedback was consistent, and reinforced my belief, as well. The III does have it's upsides, but I agree, it lacks some of the depth of the VI. I do find the response really nice, and I find it a little more agile, despite the ergonomics. Thanks for participating! Maybe I can find something else to post on these two...

-Bubba-

 

[Bubba06]

...More importantly, what do you want to hear from your horn?
...
Your current mouthpiece suits the VI well, the III less so. If you stick with the III, you could get its sound closer to your current setup on the VI by tweaking mouthpieces...

Yeah, that's a good question. I'm not too picky about a lot of the gear-- I try to focus on having good gear, so I can focus on me, but I haven't been able to break into the altissimo register on both Selmers, and I was looking for something a little brighter/louder. I could make Guardala dark, so it's a balancing act.

I'd love to give a Borgani or a Ref. 36 a good test ride, but there's not much around here. Tried a HOT Custom Z this week, but it's priced very high for a used horn.

-Bubba-

 

[TSax80]

Could you try to change the necks only? Would be interessant to hear how much of the difference comes from the neck vs the body.

 

[Maddcow]

For the style of music you're playing in the video, I think the VI is a better option. HOWEVER, I prefer the sound of the Serie III overall as I'm more into contemporary genres. The III is brighter, a little thinner and has more sizzle to the sound whereas the VI is rounder with more mids. Your choice will partly depend on what sound you're going for and which genres you intend to play predominantly.

 

[mrpeebee]

I try to focus on having good gear, so I can focus on me, but I haven't been able to break into the altissimo register on both Selmers, and I was looking for something a little brighter/louder. I could make Guardala dark, so it's a balancing act.

Jake, that's for me a surprising statement.

I know the interpretation of bright and dark is not written in stone, but for me you sound very bright on both horns. So I'm surprised that you even want to go brighter, but that's indeed a personal thing. For what I've read Yamaha tenors are often seen as bright sounding, so you might want to go into that direction.

But normally the horn is seen as less important for getting a bright sound, your mouthpiece and reed choice and the way you blow are far more important. A high baffle mouthpiece (like a Guardala) doesn't have to sound bright per definition, a piece with a well developed rollover baffle could sometimes sound much brighter. Don't know what reeds you use, but for me the difference between Rico Royal (dark) and La Voz (medium bright) is already good to hear. Going to Rigotti reeds (seen as very bright) could help you.

Not getting altissimo notes on a III or VI also surprises me and could have something to do with the setup (high F venting) for instance) of those horns. The same goes for the volume thing (can have to do with how far your key's open). I played a Selmer SA80 and since 1995 a Selmer SBA from 1953 with a big tip Florida Otto Link and altissimo has never been an issue. I found my SBA a bit mellow and shy in the first years after I bought it, but setting the key heights higher solved that issue. I know you are a very good player, but also you play a huge role in getting altissimo to work.

 

[Tzadik]

The comparison is reliable.

I would say...if you could, keep both.
The Series III just requires some more resistance...from the mouthpiece/reed combo.

Soundwise: I would have placed the mic upside down, 8/10 inches farther and with a different direction (towards the horn)... avoiding the mic screen.

 

[Bubba06]

Could you try to change the necks only? Would be interessant to hear how much of the difference comes from the neck vs the body.

Ask and you shall receive... (Some video editing quirk caused me to have 19 seconds of "blank clip" at the beginning)

Couldn't get the Mark VI neck on the Series III neck-- too tight. BUT, the Series III went on the Mark VI very loosely. You can see me fighting with it moving around on me a little bit.
I did two choruses this time, so you can hear all of them on different parts of the etude. The Tenor Madness neck has some potential, I haven't touched it in a few years.

-Bubba-

 

[Bubba06]

For the style of music you're playing in the video, I think the VI is a better option. HOWEVER, I prefer the sound of the Serie III overall as I'm more into contemporary genres. The III is brighter, a little thinner and has more sizzle to the sound whereas the VI is rounder with more mids. Your choice will partly depend on what sound you're going for and which genres you intend to play predominantly.

I'm glad somebody else appreciates a little sizzle!

I would say...if you could, keep both.
The Series III just requires some more resistance...from the mouthpiece/reed combo.

You may be right about that-- I seem to "overblow" a lot of notes. Might be overcome with more overtones and playing around with the size of my neck/oral cavity.

-Bubba-

 

[Bubba06]

Jake, that's for me a surprising statement.
I know the interpretation of bright and dark is not written in stone, but for me you sound very bright on both horns.

Mr. PB, actually you may be on to something here... The last 4 or 5 years I've been consciously pushing my sound brighter. I may be at the point that I don't need to keep pushing. In college someone actually said that to me (about the Guardala) when we were testing some gear. I had also heard a recording where I sounded reallllly tubby. Since then I've been doing cruise ship pop gigs, and listening to a lot of bright players (Brecker/Potter). I've made a reed/mouthpiece change since then, as well.

Not getting altissimo notes on a III or VI also surprises me and could have something to do with the setup (high F venting) for instance) of those horns. The same goes for the volume thing (can have to do with how far your key's open)...
I know you are a very good player, but also you play a huge role in getting altissimo to work.

I spent a lot of time during University working on trying to get altissimo to break through (overtones/mouthpiece flexibility), and it never really did. Eventually I thought it would just start working by trying to do it more and more. Four professors and I couldn't get there playing on this Mark VI. I say that, because there were two periods where I had to borrow tenors for long periods. Once with an 875, and another with an SBA. During those times, my altissimo was popping out. I've always had really sloppy/squeaky altissimo, and my University professors (4 of them) and I didn't make much progress there.

I'd like to give the High F vent a look. Is that something I can do without really knowing what I'm doing?

-Bubba-

 

[Maddcow]

I'd like to give the High F vent a look. Is that something I can do without really knowing what I'm doing?

Sort of. I'm not sure about the Mark VI but on the Serie III, there's an adjusting screw for the Front F mechanism. Adjust this until the side F opens just a tiny bit when you play Front F. You should find that any altissimo note using Front F (and in particular, G3) should be MUCH easier to play when side F is less open. Just bear in mind that this adjustment will affect the sound and intonation of Front F AND E, so you might need to make a compromise with certain notes.

 

[ZenBen]

What this shows me is the the Serie III is a very viable modern instrument. Yes, to my ears, the VI has more depth, and given the option would be my preferred horn. But if getting a VI isn't an option, a III should satisfy.