Sax on the Web Forum banner

1 - 20 of 24 Posts

·
Forum Contributor 2012, SOTW Saxophone Whisperer,
Joined
·
3,209 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I for years have been playing professionally with a 1929 Conn Chu alto w/ a RPC 95 Mpc. I recently switched to a 1952 selmer SBA Alto.

I found the conn was less resistant of a horn and I made up for it in a resistant MPC - now the Selmer is more Resistance - and I am feeling like I may just be on another mouthpiece hunt soon - maybe for something less resistant.

I have my ideas what i want to go hunting for - but i was wondering if many of you have had similar thoughts in choosing a setup?

C
 

·
Distinguished Member and Forum Contributor 2008
Joined
·
6,395 Posts
Jody Espina (Jody Jazz) makes some of the least resistant pieces I've ever played.
 

·
Forum Contributor 2012, SOTW Saxophone Whisperer,
Joined
·
3,209 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
again - I am not looking for mpc suggestions - but other people with feelings about matching restance between mpc and horn
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member/Logician
Joined
·
26,005 Posts
I can only add that I had an SBA alto for many years and never really knew why I stopped playing alto until I picked up an old True Tone alto on Ebay. Prior to that I had been through dozens of mouthpieces trying to make that SBA a pleasure to play, but it really wasn't until I picked up a different horn that I realized it just wasn't for me. Having tried in the past to make an alto work for me simply because it was a Selmer... if you want my advice, I'd go back to the Chu.
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member/Technician
Joined
·
21,034 Posts
I have had a Mark VI since 1964 but for the past 7 years I have been using a 1923 Conn. I do find the Conn a bit less resistant but the Selmer is close. Have you had the horn checked for leaks? If one palm pad is only covering 90% the whole horn will be blocked up. Try a Selmer Super Session on it too but I really think there is a hidden leak.
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member and Champion of the C-Me
Joined
·
2,057 Posts
It's an interesting (and novel) concept, selecting a mouthpiece for it's level of resistance - normally it's tone or playability....
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member
Joined
·
2,487 Posts
don't put down SBAs just cos of a few experiences, just out of curiosity, grumps, was yours silver plate?
i have a feeling that silver plate SBAs aren't nearly as good as lacquered ones,
my lacquered SBA blew away all the 26ms, 6ms, chus, series 1 wonders, super 20s and mk vis that i have played.
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member/Logician
Joined
·
26,005 Posts
SearjeantSax said:
don't put down SBAs just cos of a few experiences, just out of curiosity, grumps, was yours silver plate?
No, it was lacquered. I generally love silverplated horns, but there's something about silverplated Selmers that I do no like as well. I don't want to get into the science, but silver Selmers just seem dead to me. Before the latest price explosion, the silverplated ones always sold for less; however now I believe they're coveted solely due to the fact that they're more easily qualified as having their original finish. I put a lot of time and effort into that SBA. It had a problematic low B which gurgled when played softly which was solved only by installing a baffle in the bow to reduce its internal diameter. Now I'm not a Conn alto fan (though their tenors and baris are tops), but when I bought that TT alto on a whim, I never in my life imagined it would lead me to sell that SBA. But I did, and now I play about as much alto as tenor... and I hadn't done that in over 25 years.
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member
Joined
·
2,487 Posts
Conn? dont you mean Buescher??

i don't mean to boast, but my SBA is just perfect, i don't like silverplate Selmers either, apparently factory silverplate mk vis had poor intonation aswell, but i'm not sure about SBAs, the few silver plate 6ms ive played i also didn't like, im not really much of a silver plate person, if it's got a goldwash bell then i usually like it, so far, at least,
i suppose you were just very very unlucky
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member/Logician
Joined
·
26,005 Posts
SearjeantSax said:
Conn? dont you mean Buescher??
No, I had just mentioned my Conn preferences as the original poster has a Chu. As for my SBA, much of my displeasure was with the low B issue, and even after I sorted it out, I just found a horn I liked more. That's not to say I hate the SBA. Before I sold it, I took it to USA horn and compared it to all the modern offerings (Selmer, Yani, Yami, Keilwerth), and I'd have taken the SBA over all of them (though the II alto came close). In fact, I'd gone there thinking I was going to replace it, but left with a new appreciation for it. But then came the TT and I had to be honest with myself.
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member
Joined
·
2,487 Posts
TTs are getting so cheap now in the UK, £500 for a good condition fully serviced alto, original silver plate and case and mouthpiece,
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member/Logician
Joined
·
26,005 Posts
SearjeantSax said:
TTs are getting so cheap now in the UK, £500 for a good condition fully serviced alto, original silver plate and case and mouthpiece,
I believe they're cheap because of intonation issues. There's quite a few notes you'll have to get used to blowing with a looser lip to keep them from going sharp. Or you could do what I did and get an Aristocrat neck to fix it. (and sorry Graysax for the hijacking).
 

·
Forum Contributor 2011, SOTW's pedantic pet rodent
Joined
·
8,322 Posts
Grumps said:
I believe they're cheap because of intonation issues. There's quite a few notes you'll have to get used to blowing with a looser lip to keep them from going sharp. Or you could do what I did and get an Aristocrat neck to fix it. (and sorry Graysax for the hijacking).
I'm not sure that's true of all TTs. I had a alto and wish i never got rid. Easiest thing to play in tune i ever had. On topic: Graysax: it sounds like you may be trying to replicate the feel of your Conn set up on the Selmer. The more important issue (IMVHO) would be "How do I get the best sound possible out of this new instument?" Which might (or might not) mean something with greater resistance than before. That's my tuppence.
 

·
Distinguished Member and Forum Contributor 2008
Joined
·
6,395 Posts
Graysax said:
again - I am not looking for mpc suggestions - but other people with feelings about matching restance between mpc and horn
Sorry, I misunderstood the post.

I know when I moved from a Yani A901 to an Selmer Rerence 54 I, too, began the search for a different mouthpiece match.

I also have a 1931 Conn transitional alto. Tim Glessman did some slight neck work that really opened/free'd up the resistance even more. So, perhaps a neck change or slightly opening up the internal diameter of the neck at the curve may provide less resistance too.
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member
Joined
·
1,404 Posts
If you switch to a horn with more resistance you don't necessarilly need to change mouthpieces, you can just try a softer reed.
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member/Technician
Joined
·
21,034 Posts
Buescher TTs are cheap because there are so may of them. Very popular in their day. I sell a few altos and C melodies but tenors are pretty rare. The intonation is as good as any Conn or Selmer of the period.
 

·
Forum Contributor 2010 / RIP
Joined
·
1,363 Posts
I've been playing with a lot of different players this summer. I carry mouthpieces so I can try their horns. I've tried all Yamaha's, Selmers and most Kielwerths and Yani's in the last year. With respect to this subject, I've decided I like the sound of the Selmer horns so much that I'm willing to put up with some resistance. It seems like a player has to be willing to compromise between sound, intonation, resistance, ergonomics, look and response to get a sax that fits the bill.

My sig doesn't show my horns anymore, but I've settled on the following selection:

Alto - Ref 54 (lacquered)/RPC 90
Tenor - Ref 36/RPC 105
Bari - SA80II/Otto Link Tone Edge 6*

Many of you remember my enthusiasm for the PM saxes...I still have my 66R, but I found the extremely low resistance on that horn didn't seem to make for the absolutely best sound. All of us have 'that sound' in our head, and it seems that I've found something closer in these Selmer saxes.
 

·
Forum Contributor 2012, SOTW Saxophone Whisperer,
Joined
·
3,209 Posts
Discussion Starter #18
It is funny reading all of your input(s) so far - and somewhat was humored by your tangents - I think I still have not explained the idea of my original post clearly - thus the many tangents.

As I tell my students - let’s separate facts from opinions and re-explore the question. I have 2 Altos. One is real free blowing and one is not. I have a Resistant Mouthpiece. My combination in the past was free blowing horn with a resistant Mpc. I am exploring the opposite combination. Anything for the sake of this thread about lacquer, silver-plate, brand, etc – is all irrelevant. I want to know if people have shared this problem of matching resistance between mpc and horn - and what you did in the process of exploring.

Now - I think it will be very interesting to see what is further posted on this thread because - my new question has no Brand Names of anything. Yes you know what I am talking about – buts lets pretend we don’t know.

Now to add information that on my part was dumb to not include.... For the Resistant saxophone - I purchased a new neck and was very happy with the results. It is freer blowing. I have borrowed the same Brand MPC - except with a 75 tip opening instead of the 95 I was using. I think there is some merit to the comment that i want one to play like the other - and that’s my struggle trying to learn a different path and change my concept - I do slip with my expectations back into the rut - trying hard to fix that.

I have been around the block one or 50 times and I know what I have for opinions of different horns. I am not interested in hearing that somebody has an opinion that one is better than the other. I never have accepted anybody's opinion before without exploring its merit myself. I never say one horn is better than another – they are just different. We all have our idea of what we like – and why we like it. We are not all forced to play the same thing – and that’s very cool. Just don’t ask me to generally accept your opinion if it is not going to be backed up with some facts.

Please excuse if this seems like an angry rant - (after proof reading - I think - you would think - I was pissed) - I am quite the opposite. I am just trying to narrow down exactly the topic I set out to discuss - looking for people that have shared this problem of matching resistance between mpc and horn and hear what they have to say. (To learn and explore the paths on my journey).

And to those that had useful information – and even those on the tangent – I found entertaining.

Thanks
C.
 

·
Distinguished Member and Forum Contributor 2008
Joined
·
6,395 Posts
I appreciate your comment on one horn not being the best but they are just different.

I think as we age or progress that many times our internal sound concept may change. I know I've gone from liking the brighter purer alto sound I was getting from my Yani/ESP Jody Jazz setup to a darker more spread sound using my current Ref 54/HR LeBayle setup. Is it better? NO, but it is different.
 

·
Forum Contributor 2010 / RIP
Joined
·
1,363 Posts
Rant withdrawn...
My freeblowing horn enjoys a resistant mouthpiece. I'm used to a certain amount of resitance when playing.

My Resistant horns enjoy anything from freeblowing to resitant in a mouthpiece. I just have to decide if I want to sacrifice response to play a resistant mouthpiece. Lately I choose resistant horn and non-resistant mpc. It's worked for me this summer.
 
1 - 20 of 24 Posts
Top