Reference 36 vs. Yamaha 82Z Tenors

10112 Views 31 Replies 21 Participants Last post by Iddo, Nov 9, 2008

speyman

Discussion Starter · May 20, 2007

Which one do you like the best? Please don't vote if you haven't played both.

1 - 20 of 32 Posts

rispoli

· #2 · May 20, 2007 (Edited)

I played both but the Ref.36 was with me just for a weekend (supposedly well setup by the store that wanted to sell it to me for nearly 6000 Canadian dollars...) while the 82Z was with me for a couple of months.

The Ref. 36 had better, luxurious tone but way too much resistance both down low and up high. I definitely felt the back pressure when blowing. Maybe just a setup issue, maybe not.
The 82Z had less appealing, more "metallic" tone but was marvellously easy to play. Any long interval was a breeze to jump and all the highest range was impressively easy. I wish I had started to learn on that sax! I also did not experience intonation issues on mine.

In short, I am a happy owner of a serie III which mixes very well the qualities of those 2. It's only a bit brighter than that Ref 36 while retaining all the characteristic Selmer sound, and a joy to play like the 82Z (maybe a hair more resistant). It's also louder than both (I thought the 82Z would have been the champ in this department but... no).
I recently acquired a Yani T901 which much to my surprise sounds a lot like a Selmer and with the same ease of the 82Z. Great buy!

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Hurling Frootmig

· #3 · May 20, 2007

I've played nice examples of both. Not nice enough to put away my VI but nice enough that I could live with either of them if something really bad happened to the VI. Overall, I have found a higher percentage of good 82Z's over good Reference 36's. For me, I have found maybe 1 out of 5 Reference horns that really sing. The 82Z's have a much better hit ratio. I also have found that there's a lot more variation between Reference 36's compared to Z's. I've played some real dogs in the 36 but haven't played anything worse than average with the Z. I've probably played over a dozen 82Z tenors now and about 20 Reference 36's since they were both released.

Dr G

· #4 · May 21, 2007

So, of the ones that were firin' - Zs and 36s - which were best? It's the potential that counts for me. I've played lots of dog Mk VIs too - would that put you off buying one?

Hurling Frootmig

· #5 · May 21, 2007

I found them to be pretty much equal on the good ones. I think both horns offer slightly different strengths and weaknesses.

Tryptykon

· #6 · May 21, 2007

rispoli said:
I recently acquired a Yani T901 which much to my surprise sounds a lot like a Selmer and with the same ease of the 82Z. Great buy!

Andrea, if you ever try a T902 you'll really be surprised.
I've had mine for about 5 months and it continues to amaze me.

speyman

Discussion Starter · #7 · May 21, 2007

Vote

Dr G said:
So, of the ones that were firin' - Zs and 36s - which were best? It's the potential that counts for me. I've played lots of dog Mk VIs too - would that put you off buying one?

DrG........I don't see your vote in the pole.:?

Dr G

· #8 · May 21, 2007

Thanks for asking but I didn't vote because I haven't played a Z. I don't care for the sound I hear out front so I've little interest in playing one. Sorry if I've lost that "gotta play every horn I can" compulsion. I've played enough great horns that I've satisfied that urge.

gary

· #9 · Mar 23, 2008

Dr G said:
Thanks for asking but I didn't vote because I haven't played a Z. I don't care for the sound I hear out front so I've little interest in playing one. Sorry if I've lost that "gotta play every horn I can" compulsion. I've played enough great horns that I've satisfied that urge.

(George. psssst. [he whispers] Inderbinen - Inderbinen, Inderbenen.)

Dr G

· #10 · Mar 23, 2008

You know, I was communicating with Thomas for some time but I could just never pull the trigger on buying a horn with ergos untested and tone unheard. Ever since my first Borg', I was looking for another one. I won't make the mistake of selling this one.

:borg:

:borg:

:borg:

Saxebob

· #11 · Mar 24, 2008

I played both at a music store and I liked the 82Z tenor much more than the Reference 36 because the the ergonomics of the "Z". I have small hands and the "Z" felt like my MK6 a lot and the action was great....so much I bought a new YTS-82Z unlacqered horn 2 weeks ago.

twowheels

· #12 · Mar 26, 2008

Accompanied a friend who is in the market for a new tenor to a local music store. Among other horns he tried (Keilwerth Shadow, Ref 54, Yani T992), we tried out a couple each YTS-82Z's and Ref 36's. The Yamaha's were consistent and had a nice tone, brighter and more "contemporary" to my ears and the Ref 36's seemed "fatter" sounding. The Yamaha's were almost identical in tone and timbre, and intonation was EXCELLENT. But I preferred the tone of the 36's (tend to be a Selmer guy so I'm biased) although they were not identical in tone...definitely preferred one over the other, and they had good intonation. I like the ergo's of the Yamaha better, with higher palm keys, but preferred Ref 36 for the tone (even over the Ref 54). He, on the other hand, preferred the YTS-82Z for the more compact tone. Frankly, I'd be happy with either the Yamaha or Ref 36...even over the Keilwerth, bronze Yani and Ref 54.

(I bought the Ref 36 and sold my Mark VI.)

TELESFORO

· #13 · Mar 27, 2008

THE YAMAHA 82Z IS THE BEST SAXOPHONE IN THE WORLD!!!!!!!!When you find a good one ha ha ha....

Dr G

· #14 · Mar 27, 2008

<yawn>

:borg:

Al Stevens

· #15 · Mar 27, 2008

I can't vote because I haven't played a 36. I owned a Z for a while. I'd vote for almost any tenor over the Z.

Lairmon

· #16 · Mar 28, 2008

I've owned and played a Yamaha 62 tenor for well over 20 years and then went on to buy/own a Yamaha Custom Z tenor and Alto. The particular Z tenor I owned was very nice in many respects, ergos, tuning, altissimo, etc. but it lacked in terms of its tone. It did not have a big, fat, rich sound; it came across as weak, lacking power, and thin sounding. I have tried others that seemed better, but only have tried them in stores.
I've tried 4 different 36s, though I have not owned one. I had one in my music studio for 5 days that I put through the ringer. The 36's strength for me was definitely its tone. When I A/B ed it to my MKVI tenor (late '69) it had a little thicker, richer sound. Not a huge difference, but I could notice it.

From the horns I've tried I would rate the Ref 36 the better choice. I think it has a longer learning curve, but it would probably be worth it in the long run.

Lairmon

· #17 · Mar 28, 2008

Rispoli has some good points about the differences between the horns. The Ref does have more resistance. You have to work harder to get it going. I also was never sure that the horns had been set up to their best advantage, though the last couple I've tried seemed reasonable in that regard.
The one I had at my studio for 5 days needed some help with its set up.

dmcneill

· #18 · Mar 28, 2008

This choice is like comparing chalk and cheese. The Yamaha is fundamentally a bright sounding modern horn whereas the Ref 36 has a rich dark core to the sound and has that big fat sound more associated to older horns. Why not ask who prefers a modern bright sound to a dark big more traditional sound?

Lairmon

· #19 · Mar 30, 2008

I agree with your assessment regarding the Yamaha Z vs the Ref 36.

Fundamentally different goals with these horns. My MKVI seems to fit in nicely in doing both things.

I've also got a Barone Gold Plate tenor that tonally is some where in between the old school sound and a modern horn. Leaning towards modern though I suppose, but not bright like most Yamahas.

Uri Ben

· #20 · Oct 21, 2008

I am not a very old player on the tenor nor one of the stars - but sure I can play any time on any tenor - dark, traditional , fat, slim , bright, old or new or whatsoever sound - I just change the MP...

A good ref. 36 is hard to find, even for me - living just few staps from SELMER HQ in Paris ,
The 82 is sure better of the 2, better then both is YANI 902 and much better-is the TREVOR J signature (hand made England).

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