[DryMartini]

So there is this director who thinks he is Benny Goodman or a light version of the guy from whiplash. The problem is three fold:
1. He gives you dirtly looks when you are out of tune or playing incorrectly, which is frequent in this band as most are just starting out. I'm talking about the "You wanna fight" kinda looks. Like if you where on the street you would punch him in the nose or at least threaten to.
2. He does the bare minimum. Punches the clock. He can't wait to get home. There is never a complete big band. Usually only 2 saxes, never a piano player, short in every section. He drives people away.
3. He does not have a passion for jazz and can't / doesn't know how to improvise. (He does play classical brass well though.)

For someone who is passionate about this music if hurts to see this guy in charge or teaching jazz at all. What would be the best way to deal with character like this? He has been the director of the music program at this small rural JC college for like 10 yrs. The sad thing is there are many hundreds of kids in marching band in the high schools who could probably be good musicans but he does zero recruiting and when someone good comes in they can't stand him and play worse or leave.

 

[A Greene]

I can't really help you out with this situation. We see the same this in public school band directing. Once someone has the gig, it's difficult to get them gone. What I can say is that when I was in 10th grade I started playing with the local community college jazz ensemble. It was a challenge but also and a chance for me to play with older more advanced players. At every level, the attitude of the director can change the trajectory of a musicians life.

Maybe write a letter to the college president. Ultimately, anything you do will get back to the director and might make things worse. Tough situation.

 

[Grumps]

What would be the best way to deal with character like this?

Play in tune.

 

[HeavyWeather77]

This is a sad and frustrating situation, for sure, and unfortunately I think it's pretty common. It's especially frustrating since there are brilliant, passionate, capable, and kind-hearted folks graduating with master's degrees in jazz every year who struggle to find any kind of decent employment. My guess is that this director is an unhappy and frustrated person, that he's not very qualified for this gig and knows it, that he's profoundly insecure, that his sense of self-worth is somehow tied to this job he doesn't enjoy, and that he also somehow thinks he's entitled to a bigger and more glorious position. Maybe he got turned down for a job at the University of Indiana and he's taking it out on his students, who knows.

At the college where I teach (which is fortunate to be full of highly qualified, passionate professors who genuinely care about student development), there are faculty evaluations every semester. They're anonymous, and they factor heavily into administrators' decisions to renew faculty contracts. If enough students in the jazz band feel the way you do, and if they actually participate in the evaluations, then it would be worth bringing up with the head of the music department.

 

[JoAnnPeeler]

My high school band director was definitely a mixed bag and looking back he really reminded me of a lite version of Terence Fletcher from Whiplash. He was a former member of the Marine Corp band as well as a studio musician who played in Nashville. Every instrument I ever heard him play he played masterfully, but he was a really, REALLY good jazz trumpet player. BUT.... unless you were a dedicated student he would run you off. It was embarrassing to see all the antics students had to endure with him -- both extreme verbal and sometimes physical abuse. It was the early 70s and someone like that would probably be in jail. On the other hand, if you were a dedicated student he was a wealth of knowledge and encouragement. To the ones who excelled he invited us to play in local gigs with other professional musicians which was in itself an incredible experience. He ended up dying of a heart attack at the end of my junior year in high school (go figure, huh?) As bad as he could be, I still miss his mentorship, but he nearly destroyed our high school band program. Eventually it recovered, but only after I was a few years into college.

I'm not sure what I would do about a Junior College Napoleon, but why not try to have a Frank discussion with him. Unless you have some grade you depend on him for, I would just level with him.

 

[JoAnnPeeler]

Play in tune.

LMAO... That's probably how I would handle it.

 

[saxoclese]

In many Junior and Community Colleges in the U.S. they hire part time or "adjunct" professors and pay only a meager salary which seldom attracts experienced and effective teachers. Sometimes an individual is hired as a "place filler" while they search for a qualified full time teacher. Unfortunately it takes 3 to 4 years to build a quality music program, but just a few months to destroy one. In defense of the use of the "dirty look". I taught school bands for 32 years, and found that to be an effective rehearsal "tool" right from the start. In the middle of a piece when you hear Johnny play a wrong note or play in a rest, you can either stop the band and communicate verbally to the student, or you can give him the look over your glasses to let him know you heard what he played. If little Johnny is a timid soul, the look can be followed with a smile. Non-verbal communication is usually much more effective and certainly less boring than hearing the director ramble on and on. I was guilty of that sometimes as well.

 

[Tranechaser]

Sounds like he sucks. Find another band to play in.

 

[jgreiner]

I'd kindly tell him to go F himself.

 

[MLucky]

I've played in a number of community college and university bands over the years, and most of the directors have been good, some excellent, but I've had a bad one, too. Realistically, if someone is tenured, there's not much you can do. You can give negative feedback at the end of the semester, assuming they do instructor evaluations as most community colleges do. You could even go so far as to request a meeting with the dean. and let him/her know your concerns. Unfortunately, the most that would happen is that this guy would get a talking to, which probably wouldn't change him much.

Honestly? You will probably want to find another place to play. Maybe talk to some of the other players in class and talk about what you could do together?

 

[Sacks Of Phones]

Geez, does everyone have to be a victim in every thing they do?

 

[Dr G]

So there is this director who thinks he is Benny Goodman or a light version of the guy from whiplash. The problem is three fold:
1. He gives you dirtly looks when you are out of tune or playing incorrectly, which is frequent in this band as most are just starting out. I'm talking about the "You wanna fight" kinda looks. Like if you where on the street you would punch him in the nose or at least threaten to.

Don't be part of the problem. Adding resentment or antagonism isn't going to make things better.

2. He does the bare minimum. Punches the clock. He can't wait to get home. There is never a complete big band. Usually only 2 saxes, never a piano player, short in every section. He drives people away.
3. He does not have a passion for jazz and can't / doesn't know how to improvise. (He does play classical brass well though.)

For someone who is passionate about this music if hurts to see this guy in charge or teaching jazz at all. What would be the best way to deal with character like this? He has been the director of the music program at this small rural JC college for like 10 yrs. The sad thing is there are many hundreds of kids in marching band in the high schools who could probably be good musicans but he does zero recruiting and when someone good comes in they can't stand him and play worse or leave.

I agree that it is a sad situation - likely for him as well as the students. It sounds like he is not a good match for a jazz program, but at least you have an opportunity for a band.

I suggest you take advantage of what he has to offer: intonation, section playing, rehearsal... Lead with a positive example where you can - it can really turn around a band. I've been there.

In sum, helping him be the best that he can starts with you being the best that you can. If it becomes too much of a struggle, find another playing opportunity. I've been there too - I had to leave one band whose drummer was so bad that I came home in a bad mood after every rehearsal. I could help the section, I could help the band, but I couldn't cure a bad drummer with decades of seniority.

 

[saxoclese]

Excellent response Dr G. Thanks for being the "adult in the room".

 

[andre251]

Like someone else pointed out, I think of the dozens of recent graduates of masters and doctoral programs who have day office gigs and do lessons and perform at night who would kill for that gig right now even if it were adjunct.
Most likely he either has tenure on his trumpet teaching and just does Jazz for an extra tiny additional paycheck, or he is good friends with other professors and they keep him at the job because they like him. I have seen a lot of these cases around the country and all levels of ability from the professor. Simply stated, people aren’t retiring because they need the gig and all they need to is the bare minimum of show up. Some excel and grow great programs and have a strong passion for it, and others do like you described.
So what can you do? If you stay in the group, get to the evaluation at the end and write what you feel. Make sure others who feel the same do the same. Then have others who have records of being in the band that quit write letters to a dean of arts or comparable job.
A lot of times administration had no idea what is happening. But more often they know, but not enough people come forward.
Good luck!

 

[BH9]

In music you are going to run into all kinds of people, good and bad. There are people in music education with genius credentials and no love for or aptitude for the music at all, and vice versa, and everything in between. It’s just random, and sometimes you are the victim. Not much you can do in your situation except do your best and look for a better situation.

 

[Sacks Of Phones]

In music you are going to run into all kinds of people, good and bad. There are people in music education with genius credentials and no love for or aptitude for the music at all, and vice versa, and everything in between. It's just random, and sometimes you are the victim. Not much you can do in your situation except do your best and look for a better situation.

This is true of everyday life. I haven't always liked every manager at my jobs I have had over the years but when I was younger, one good manager told me in a not so subtle way, "Hey, you just have to learn how to deal with these (difficult) people". If it's abusive, get out. If not, how bad does one want to play? And don't suck.

 

[Dr G]

So what can you do? If you stay in the group, get to the evaluation at the end and write what you feel. Make sure others who feel the same do the same. Then have others who have records of being in the band that quit write letters to a dean of arts or comparable job.
A lot of times administration had no idea what is happening. But more often they know, but not enough people come forward.

He may have tenure because of his classical skills and other administrative obligations, and takes on the jazz class because no one else will. Be careful what you wish for, because you might just get the course cancelled.

 

[Heath Watts]

So there is this director who thinks he is Benny Goodman or a light version of the guy from whiplash. The problem is three fold:
1. He gives you dirtly looks when you are out of tune or playing incorrectly, which is frequent in this band as most are just starting out. I'm talking about the "You wanna fight" kinda looks. Like if you where on the street you would punch him in the nose or at least threaten to.
2. He does the bare minimum. Punches the clock. He can't wait to get home. There is never a complete big band. Usually only 2 saxes, never a piano player, short in every section. He drives people away.
3. He does not have a passion for jazz and can't / doesn't know how to improvise. (He does play classical brass well though.)

For someone who is passionate about this music if hurts to see this guy in charge or teaching jazz at all. What would be the best way to deal with character like this? He has been the director of the music program at this small rural JC college for like 10 yrs. The sad thing is there are many hundreds of kids in marching band in the high schools who could probably be good musicans but he does zero recruiting and when someone good comes in they can't stand him and play worse or leave.

The whiplash character was nust and the movie was garbage, but a lot of people need tough love and strict guidance. On the first day of my differential equations class in college in the early 1990s, my professor said look to your left and look to your right, that person will fail this course. He was not exaggerating! He would also lock the door when the bell rang, so if students arrived late, they missed the class, and the daily quiz, which they could not retake.

It could be that the instructor that you're discussing once had a passion for teaching big band, but as the quality of students diminished over the years, and it likely did, he lost his desire to teach. It's unfortunate for those who want to learn and can play in tune, but this is happening throughout academia. For the past 20+ years, kids have been awarded ribbons and trophies for just showing up; however, college should be about more than showing up and giving good "customer service".

 

[SaxTon]

I had one college band teacher who could be hyper critical and liked to embarrass me and others but it only inspired me to practice more and my playing significantly improved at that time

 

[nvilletele]

The director of the community college continuing education (i.e., old fogies) jazz band and concert band that I played in was fantastic. He’s the only band director I’ve ever had, so small sample size, but he is really terrific. I was lucky.

I got an A+ in my college differential equations class. I went every day. My friend never went to class, and he got an A+ too. Must have been some other guy that flunked out.

Oh, by the way, my friend’s name is Charlie Parker. The TA who graded the tests would draw a sax on Charlie’s blue book along with his grade.