[Kontra]

Just saw the parts for our show next year. They downgraded me and another 1st to 2nd part. I guess what stinks about it is that I'm trying out for section leader, and the only people in my band who get respect are the 1sts. I guess I fear I'll be ignored when I try to help my section out. In my band, the students feel its about status, not how well you play. [rolleyes]

Oh well, better start practicing. At least I'll be able to play the piece. This ever happen to you guys? (The downgrading part.)

 

[bandmommy]

Typical high school drama...
In music there is no such thing as being 'downgraded'. Every part is equally important to the arrangement.
There should be a strong player on each part.
Not everyone can play first part ya know...

 

[paulwl]

the only people in my band who get respect are the 1sts. I guess I fear I'll be ignored when I try to help my section out. In my band, the students feel its about status, not how well you play.

Sounds like the director reinforces that.

 

[CooolJazzz]

The more you mature as a musician the more you will understand that no part in the music is any more or less important than any other part, and no chair designation carries any more or less real "status" than any other. The whole idea that you have to be sitting in the 1st chair to have any status as a musician is a childish misconception that hopefully everyone grows out of by the time they leave high school or college. When it comes to professional bands, every musician in the band is equally as capable of playing any of the parts, but if everyone had the attitude that they were "too good" to be relegated to 2nd or 3rd chair parts there would be no bands and there would be no music. Heck...when it comes to some of the best big band arrangements, the 2nd chair parts are often far more challenging to play and require every bit as much skill and musicianship as the 1st chair parts. Just remember...you'll rarely hear anyone beyond high school age bragging about their "status" as a 1st chair player or complaining about having to play 2nd chair parts. If you did...you'd have to question both their emotional and musical maturity.

 

[CiaranAudio]

You know if you just poison the 1st chairs then you're in by default.

Or join the color guard.

 

[Kontra]

We have two directors. One loves how I play and constantly praises my bass clarinet playing and my jazz clarinet playing. The other hates my clarinet tone, scolds me for playing a vintage sax, and tells me how useless bass clarinet it. Guess who's in charge?

Anyway, I see the points made here. I never really thought about it like that. Last year our marching band show was a grade 6 piece and all the clarinet parts were challenging. And most of it was very syncopated. My look at it now is, I can practice my part until it sounds its best, and if anyone else is still unsatisfied because it's a second part that's their problem.

Speaking of the snobbery I was talking about, our section leader from last year just informed us that if she doesn't get some kind of leadership position to where she has some type of authority, she's quitting. What a good influence.

 

[patmiller]

when it comes to some of the best big band arrangements, the 2nd chair parts are often far more challenging to play and require every bit as much skill and musicianship as the 1st chair parts.

Have to agree with that. When I (used to) arrange, I always gave myself the 1st part because it was easier. It was more melodic. I'm not a great reader but I have a pretty good memory for melody lines. And because I was "fronting" and organising the band as well I needed the easiest part. I was lucky to have great readers and players on the other parts. That's the musical reality but I suspect what you are describing has little to do with musical reality and more to do with high school competetiveness.

 

[CooolJazzz]

Speaking of the snobbery I was talking about, our section leader from last year just informed us that if she doesn't get some kind of leadership position to where she has some type of authority, she's quitting...

To echo bandmommy's excellent summary..."Typical high school drama". High school is what it is though. While I've heard that young females are maturing physically at a much earlier age than they were just 30 years ago, I think it's a safe bet to say that emotional immaturity always has and always will "come with the territory" for high school kids. Too bad there's not a pill for that. ;-)

Hopefully the young lady will do you all a favor and keep her promise about quitting.

 

[CooolJazzz]

When I (used to) arrange, I always gave myself the 1st part because it was easier. It was more melodic.

Precisely...Most 1st chair parts make more melodic sense, and are therefore much easier to play in most cases. I've been in many bands where the stronger players were deliberately given the 2nd chair parts because they were the most difficult to play. Almost anyone can play 1st chair parts if they have a decent enough sound, but it takes a really strong player to handle some of those inner voicing lines that aren't as easy to play as the simple melodic lines that show up in most 1st chair parts. I always considered it not only a challenge, but an HONOR to be asked to play 2nd chair parts in a really good big band. Some of those 2nd chair parts are brutally difficult...and therefore fun and rewarding to play.

 

[Jonathan C.]

Its a part of high school.
In high school, chairs mattered. But outside of high school no one cares. In a way the way outside bands are run is the way it is with a job. For instance I joined a band where I played 2nd Tenor, and I put in the time or I would of. But I was still called to play 2nd Alto in the same jazz band because the second had a conflicting appointment. We all put in our time at the crap level. At my old job I cleaned crappers, took out trash. The Boss walked up to me one day and said good job, and he said we all spend our time cleaning crappers at some point. It didn't make much sense to me then, but.

Look at it this way, Right now your playing 2nd whatever. Your putting in your time for a better gig. If you stick it out, don't complain about it. Then next time something comes up people remember that. People remember stuff like that, hold your head up not let it affect you. Also it is marching band, and as a woodwind you are not likely going to be heard anyway. Realistically the only people who are heard is the drum line and the brass, maybe the saxophones occasionally. In college their was a band that played the basketball gig, small band but you were paid to play. You think anyone cared bout what chair they were, nope 1st part and 2nd part got paid the same thing.

 

[maddenma]

The other alternative is to practice your butt off and beat out the first chair next year at auditions. Might work. It's seldom actually a personality contest.

 

[Caymen]

In my case, I learned that first chairs and section leaders may not always be the best players, but the people with a better ability to guide others musically.

 

[CooolJazzz]

We all put in our time at the crap level.

I wonder if the 2nd alto player in any of Woody Herman's "Thundering Herd" bands felt like they were putting in time at the crap level. I highly doubt it.
While I understand that high school kids will always tend to think that way, I personally don't believe it helps at all to compare sitting 2nd chair with cleaning crappers when all it does is reinforce the mistaken idea that 2nd chair parts and 2nd chair players are in any way less important either musically or socially within a band or orchestra. That's exactly the kind of thinking we should be discouraging rather than validating because it's total nonsense. Trust me...as long ago as it was, I DO remember being caught up in that same "1st chair superiority" mentality like every other high school band geek...but I admit that with a touch of embarrassment because it reminds me that none of us were as mature as we thought we were at that age. I didn't truly "get it" until I started playing in Army bands where I finally learned that neither rank nor chair position was a reflection of someone's talent or value to the team. Every player in the band was 1st chair quality, but there's only one 1st chair in each section. It's a matter of simple mathematics...and in military bands it's a matter of seniority, not superiority.

 

[Jonathan C.]

I also said that I have played in bands where it didn't matter what chair you were being part of the band is what mattered.

If the OP is a sophomore or about to be a Junior and the other players are seniors then in a way he is putting in the time. Or if the band director has a bunch of new people coming into the band, then he might still need that part played. He may have no idea the students coming in to play those parts, and may want a strong lead 2nd part.

 

[bandmommy]

I almost hate to admit it, but I sat first chair clarinet every year from 5th thru 12 grade.
Yup, I used to be a pretty damned good little clarinet player.
I'll tell you from experience that section leaders are the people that the band director appoints to listen to all of the petty bitching so they don't have to. Really, do you actually WANT to listen to all of the catty back biting and whining?
The only other job of our section leaders is to make sure everyone is wearing black socks at marching festivals, home foot ball games, and parades.
But oh yeah, every band members' dream is to one day be a section leader. A "Hall monitor with a horn".

 

[Grumps]

But oh yeah, every band members' dream is to one day be a section leader.

Mine was to have our band director finally committed...

 

[maddenma]

Unfortunately, I was every band kid's worst nightmare in HS. In my Jr and Sr years I auditioned on every instrument and was technically first chair on everything but clarinet, flute, bassoon, and trumpet in the concert band. I really only ever played tenor in CB, but would occasionally switch with the bari player just for fun.

Just took committed practice. You can do it too, although it does come at a cost to the social life.

 

[bruce bailey]

I would just keep silent about it, practice the parts and be a killer player no matter where you sit. Also, being section leader is about leadership and not playing. In many bands, the section leader is not the first chair player. Go with the flow but hold your own. Talking about it in band never helps....show them by your ability.
It could be worse, you could be in the flute section!
I conduct an adult city band and always have the drama of people who have been in the band for 30 years vs. newbies who play well. My solution is to rotate the players (with ability) for each concert (once a month). That way everyone gets a chance. I do see where in HS the challenge system does help make each player work harder to stay in a certain chair.
Don't show disappointment, just carry on.

 

[Kontra]

Well, our last section leader said we were gonna have sectionals and when we got there we talked. And then she talked behind our backs about how "bad" we were. She really has a superiority complex and it's always with me. This year, believe it or not, I'm gonna hold REAL sectionals.

 

[MarkVIstud]

You've got a corrupt section leader. It seems its not the music she's looking for, rather she's looking for power. I wouldn't be surprised if you told me now she's also the leader of some other student groups, and if she didn't get the spot, she quit.

Just play your part. As many people have said, and do it well. Playing in an ensemble is more about just your part. Your part adds to the collective whole. Take an orchestral bassists...They don't always have the most interesting parts... But mature leveled bassists know that their part is important cause without them, it just wouldn't sound the same. Same applies for tuba and bari sax parts.

Seeing as you are going to hold REAL sectionals, you'd better make clear that you're running the sectionals to the band director(s). This way you get the credit, and not this "section leader" who only wants power. Cause if you don't make it clear, then she'll get all the credit and love from the band director(s). That doesn't sound too good doesn't it.