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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi guys.

I've always been a bit traditional, so I always used cane reeds.
I recently ventured into the world of synthetic reeds, and bought a FIBRACELL.
I've read and heard dozens of people that say FIBRACELL was better in the past, and after the change was not good stuff.

And then I have these questions:
#1 - How were the old FIBRACELL reeds? Why were they good?
#2 - What change was made​​? Why was it bad?


I don't know if the change was the new grade in 10 strengths, but I asked by email and they said:
["Standard" Fibracell reeds and the "Fibracell Premier" reeds are manufactured on the same way and from the same material.]

Regards
 

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Indistinguishable Resident Buescher Bigot and Foru
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Let me ask you a question. If you can't get the old Fibracell reeds, what difference does it make?
 

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maddenma nailed it, but to give MY answer . . . the older ones were graded in strength using words . . . SOFT, MED-SOFT, MEDIUM, etc. The new Premieres are graded in strength using numerical values like 1 1/2, 2, 2 1/2, etc.

In actual playing characteristics, I've found no significant difference, meaning that they all vary just like cane (inconsistent) so it is difficult to differentiate among them. I can buy three 1 1/2 Fibracell Premieres and I'm lucky to find one that plays well. But I have the same experience with cane.

When I DO find a good Fibracell, it is superb and I especially like them on alto and clarinet, two instruments that tend to sit on my rack while I play soprano. The Fibracells make it easy to pick up a dry, cold horn and play without dealing with a dried out warped reed. DAVE
 

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Simply finer strength grading in my view.
In my experience there is very little variation or inconsistency between Fibracells....nothing remotely like the inconsistency found in a typical box of cane reeds.
Between Fibracells there may be slight differences in tone between reeds....a replacement may be slightly more buzzy than the last, but very little overall difference; half an hour's playing on the "new" reed & any initial perceived difference has gone.
Of course, if you use a singularly "reed picky" mouthpiece more difference may be found.
In the main they are as consistent as one can expect.
Just fit one & forget it...no fuss or bother.
Personally I would prefer to play my horn rather than spend time farting about with pieces of inconsistent twig.
I will never revert to cane...except perhaps if they were to make them as consistent as Fibracell.
On reflection, my last statement is untrue....I had forgotten all that ritual about wetting the reed...I prefer to just pick up the horn & blow it....secure in the belief that it will work instantly.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Hi guys.

To explore the question:

In this thread, 'Mick Stuppguy" suggests that old and new Fibracell are different not by the numbering:
http://forum.saxontheweb.net/showthread.php?118248-fibracell-reeds

He got two Medium FIBRACELL reeds, an old and new, and noted they act different.
So, possibly the new one was manufactured in different proportions or processes.


In this other thread, "Brian" noted the differences between old and new reeds and talked with their tech people at M.I.R.I., and came to the conclusion that the current fibracells are not the Fibracells of old and never will be:
http://forum.saxontheweb.net/showthread.php?99887-Faulty-Fibracell-Reed

Brian creates a theory that they were forced into a reformulation (government regulation, maybe) of their material.


What you guys think about this?

Regards.
 

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Distinguished SOTW Member, Forum Contributor 2007-
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In my experience there is very little variation or inconsistency between Fibracells…
That is the opposite of my experience. They have been inconsistent, perhaps not as much as a box of real cane reeds but quite different in terms of sound and feel. I do use them all the time.
 

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Brian creates a theory that they were forced into a reformulation (government regulation, maybe) of their material.
Yes, I have heard that story too. The government was restriction the use of Kevlar.
 

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maddenma,

Who questions the importance of a question is usually that who don't know the answer.

Regards.
Or doesn't care about something they can't affect, can't buy, can't even currently compare, can only try to remember something that hasn't been seen in awhile, and is intensely curious why someone else would find something so innane so interesting to discuss without at least first offering up their experience.

I asked a question back, you decided an insult was the best response. Not a particularly useful thing from someone that so rarely contributes knowledge back to the forum.

However, to better answer your question, I've used both. To me, these and their kind are a necessary evil. They don't sound as good as cane reeds, but clearly work better when dry -- essential to doubling.

I don't recall noticing a significant tonal or playing difference between the old and new versions of Fibracells that can't be accounted for as a result of manufacturing inconsistencies. The extra grading helps, but they essentially sound the same to me -- unlike, say the difference between a FC or a Legere -- which are clearly a different animals in terms of tone and response but are similarly of non-natural materials.

So, what has been your experience with them, or do you have no personal experience to actually share?
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Or doesn't care about something they can't affect, can't buy, can't even currently compare, can only try to remember something that hasn't been seen in awhile, and is intensely curious why someone else would find something so innane so interesting to discuss without at least first offering up their experience.

I asked a question back, you decided an insult was the best response. Not a particularly useful thing from someone that so rarely contributes knowledge back to the forum.
The problem is that you're still asking why I want to know. I want to know simply because I want to, because the curiosity is part of being human, because the desire to knowing don't need justification. Just this.

However, to better answer your question, I've used both. To me, these and their kind are a necessary evil. They don't sound as good as cane reeds, but clearly work better when dry -- essential to doubling.

I don't recall noticing a significant tonal or playing difference between the old and new versions of Fibracells that can't be accounted for as a result of manufacturing inconsistencies. The extra grading helps, but they essentially sound the same to me -- unlike, say the difference between a FC or a Legere -- which are clearly a different animals in terms of tone and response but are similarly of non-natural materials.
Ok. Thank you very much for your answer.

So, what has been your experience with them, or do you have no personal experience to actually share?
I think there are three types of posts.
Those who one asks, 'cause don't know or have experience.
And that the person answers because he knows and has experience.
And there is also the third category, who the person doesn't asks or even help, but rather disturbing.

I'm convinced that you read my first post and saw some question marks.
Other information was shared in my third post.

I apologize for any insult, but I would ask everyone that if can't help, not disturb too.
Thereby you waste your time and mine as well, and nobody wins.

One more else, I'm so sorry.


Regards
 

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No worries. Glad you thought it was useful.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Yes, I have heard that story too. The government was restriction the use of Kevlar.
It seems to be something a bit obscure, because the government has not announced anything publicly, FIBRACELL people don't admit any changes and several players noticed sudden differences.
Awkward!!!

I'm using a Fibracell and until now, not liking. A premier number 2 is like a vandoren java number 1.
It sounds bodiless (little resistance) and flat, compared to cane reeds.

It's sad knowing that Fibracell was much better in the past.
Some of the most conservative players here used Fibracell (before alleged modifications), including classical players.

Regards.
 

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We are in danger here of descending into conspiracy territory.
The only difference between the Original & the Premium is, in my experience, that the latter tend to be softer than indicated.
Whereas I used to play the equivalent of a 2.5 with the originals, I use a 3.5 in the Premium variety to obtain the same results.
I maintain that, although absolute consistency is an unlikely goal in any area where Human Beings are involved, the Fibracells are a damned sight more consistent than cane.
 

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ive played both the old and new (still do) for at least 10 years.both are inconsistant but when you get a good one your set for a long time.i really liked the old softs and wish they were still available but now I try the 1s because they play like most cane 2s that ive used .when I get one thats too hard it bums me out after 10.00 a pop they are really hard to work.Ive tried!thats my 2 cents. a good one plays good and it doesnt matter if they are the old or new premiers.
 

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this is the whole reason I'm not interested in history; I mean, Lincoln's gone, the Civil War is over, Hitler's dead, that war is over, Nixon's dead, Watergate is over; and so's your mama; so why go back and even ask about them? Maddenma is right.
 

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Prez is dead; Bird is dead; Duke and Basie or dead. I cannot get them back. So I listen only to Kenny g; he's always there when I need him.
 

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The only change that I am aware of is an improvement to the way that the bottom film that helps keep the fibers from fraying is applied to the reed, and that is a good thing. This had a slight dampening effect on the reads which is more noticeable in the softer strengths, but otherwise the only other things I have noticed about the premier series is better quality control and finer grading.

I still prefer them over the solid slab type of synthetic reed, but that is obviously a personal opinion. They are still a doubler's best friend and perform consistently in conditions of extremely high or low humidity.

The only natural reeds that come close to that stability are the Rico plasti-cover, which seem to have returned to the consistent quality they had in the 1960s, but neither of these will ever have the same tonal characteristics of densely fine-grained cane such as Vandoren or Glotin.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 · (Edited)
We are in danger here of descending into conspiracy territory.
The only difference between the Original & the Premium is, in my experience, that the latter tend to be softer than indicated.
Whereas I used to play the equivalent of a 2.5 with the originals, I use a 3.5 in the Premium variety to obtain the same results.
I maintain that, although absolute consistency is an unlikely goal in any area where Human Beings are involved, the Fibracells are a damned sight more consistent than cane.
I noticed this strenght inconsistency too.
I'll try a Premium 3 to see what happens.
If I don't like, I will try a Legère or Forestone or Fiberreed.

I've been tired of being a conservative player.

Regards
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
ive played both the old and new (still do) for at least 10 years.both are inconsistant but when you get a good one your set for a long time.i really liked the old softs and wish they were still available but now I try the 1s because they play like most cane 2s that ive used .when I get one thats too hard it bums me out after 10.00 a pop they are really hard to work.Ive tried!thats my 2 cents. a good one plays good and it doesnt matter if they are the old or new premiers.
That is exactly the opposite of my experience.
You tried a Premium 1 that is similar to a cane 2.
I tried a Premium 2 feeling as a cane 1.

Funny
 
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