[renegade]

Whenever I play along with a recorded song, I noticed that I have to play a half note higher from the notes I hear from the recorded song. Using C from my alto sax as the reference note, I checked its intonation with a digital tuner and it appeared in my tuner as E flat which means that the note C in my sax is in tune. Would it be possible that in the recording process, there is an alteration (notes becoming a step higher). Btw, I play by ear.

 

[Pete Thomas]

If your instrument is in tune it would seem the tracks are a semitones higher than you thought

How do you know what key they were recorded in?

But it is always also possible they are raised But that is not likely for every single tune.

 

[lesacks]

Tape and vanyl decks tend to have a means of fine tuning speed... Maybe your playback kit needs adjusting? Cassette decks are more complicated.

But, out of interest; this sax?

I too think that shortening any neck is by and large a wrong strategy.

It may have worked for one case but more often than not is a dead alley.

I tried this approach, shortening the neck of my Conn 24M alto and my LC 601 curved soprano and it worked. For many years, I have been struggling with the problem of my two saxes about a half note flat in the low registers (Bb, B, C, C#) yet almost in tune from D up but when I had the necks of my saxes shortened, I was able to solve the problem of being flat on the low notes. Yes, this is not the conventional solution and even my tech was reluctant to do the job but when you hit a dead end, I think you should not be afraid to take a drastic step to solve the problem.

 

[milandro]

I can’t really understand OP’s predicament nor the “ explanation” (and from the answers above, I am not alone).

Apparently this happens with every recorded song, but as Pete correctly commented , how do you know that recorded song is played FOR CERTAIN in any given key ?

Yes, the recorded pitch can be altered by speed or digital means , but that is hardly ever common to the point that it would affect EVERY recorded song?

I am supposing here also that OP is aware that the saxophone is a transposing instrument.

Having said this , it is also possible that he is indeed playing a HP instrument ( but the pitch shift gets progressively higher as you go up or down through the horn’s range), or, that he manages to tune the entire horn too low or high .


Another possibility is that OP has been tampering with the setting of say IrealPRO and that now everything is set to play half a tone differently. In that case go back to factory settings.

 

[nigeld]

Are you sure your digital tuner is set to A=440?
Have you checked other notes than C with the tuner?

 

[Mope]

I think we're talking about having to transpose. Much popular music is recorded in guitar friendly keys like E, G, A, C, and D. Songs recorded in those keys mean you would be a half step away on your E flat horn.

 

[Pete Thomas]

So we still need an answer from Renegade (please)

• How they know what key it should be in (given that any recording artist is allowed to play a tune in whatever key they like.
• Is the saxophone as in tune as it should be across both registers.
• Is the saxophone low pitch
• Is the tuner calibrated correctly (I believe some tuners may have a transposing feature?)

Changing speed of tunes used to be quite common in the days of vinyl, when mastering was done via tape and lathe - bot of which could be altered and it was common to do this if they felt at the mastering process a bit of speeding up made the track more exciting. With digital recording it can still be done of course but maybe is more of a less spontaneous step. Instead of turning a knob it involves a plugin or process of some kind. or maybe just getting it wrong and setting the wrong sampling rate.

 

[turf3]

OP states "When I play a C on my alto it shows on the tuner as Eb" which implies the understanding of transposing instrument as well as implying that the horn is in good condition.

The other statement ("I have to play a half note higher from the notes I hear from the recorded song") doesn't make any sense to me. Can you explain what you mean here? Tunes are played and recorded in all kinds of keys. Unless you are comparing a recording to the sheet music of the song, you play along with it in the key in which it's recorded.

Now if you're talking about old recordings, especially without a piano, pitch on those can vary considerably, there are any number of old recordings where a song was recorded in "G 1/2" - everyone tuned to SOMEONE - if the piano was way off pitch, then everyone tuned to it - if no piano, then everyone probably tuned to a lead guitar player.

But we need more information to be able to help you.

 

[JayeLID]

If your instrument is in tune it would seem the tracks are a semitones higher than you thought

How do you know what key they were recorded in?

But it is always also possible they are raised But that is not likely for every single tune.

This is what puzzles me as well.

You (OP) say you 'play by ear' ...suggesting you do not play to sheet music.

If you have no sheet music - thus no reference as to what the key of the tune is 'supposed to be'....and are playing by ear...and you can match the pitches of the recording while you play....there is no problem, is there ?

(Not being a wiseguy, but everything sounds OK here to me....)

Now..if the situation were:

'I have the sheet music and it is supposedly IN the original recording key....but when I play to the sheet music it sounds a half-step down from the recording"...

....then it would probably be a sax tuning issue or a miscalibration of your tuner (if you use one).

 

[lydian]

Whenever I play along with a recorded song, I noticed that I have to play a half note higher from the notes I hear from the recorded song. Using C from my alto sax as the reference note, I checked its intonation with a digital tuner and it appeared in my tuner as E flat which means that the note C in my sax is in tune. Would it be possible that in the recording process, there is an alteration (notes becoming a step higher). Btw, I play by ear.

So we all don't have to keep guessing, can you find a tune on youtube that exhibits this problem so we can hear for ourselves?

 

[JL]

Whenever I play along with a recorded song, I noticed that I have to play a half note higher from the notes I hear from the recorded song.

Are you out of tune, or simply in the wrong key for the tune you're playing along to?

Need to clarify if you're talking about one specific tune or a whole lot of tunes, or what?

 

[Dr G]

Whenever I play along with a recorded song, I noticed that I have to play a half note higher from the notes I hear from the recorded song. Using C from my alto sax as the reference note, I checked its intonation with a digital tuner and it appeared in my tuner as E flat which means that the note C in my sax is in tune. Would it be possible that in the recording process, there is an alteration (notes becoming a step higher). Btw, I play by ear.

Or take a different approach and test your idea: If you record a song - the actual song that you are listening to, and compare the source to the playback, does the playback sound higher in pitch?

 

[soybean]

Probably a sample rate conversion as Pete mentioned. This is a common error when going between 48khz and 44.1

 

[Reet McVouty]

Whenever I play along with a recorded song, I noticed that I have to play a half note higher from the notes I hear from the recorded song. Using C from my alto sax as the reference note, I checked its intonation with a digital tuner and it appeared in my tuner as E flat which means that the note C in my sax is in tune. Would it be possible that in the recording process, there is an alteration (notes becoming a step higher). Btw, I play by ear.

If your horn plays in tune as you say you've checked it with a tuner, then your query make no sense. Do you have perfect pitch? You're hearing a note and your able to determine it's a half step off? If you play by ear then don't worry about what note it is, just play the note you hear. Or, come up with a better explanation so we know what your asking ...

 

[ToomanyTenors]

...and this problem from a guy who has posted 427 times? Find it hard to believe...

 

[lydian]

...and this problem from a guy who has posted 427 times? Find it hard to believe...

He also sawed off part of his neck to make his bell notes more in tune. So there's probably a lot more going on here than we know.

In any case, one example on youtube is all we need to solve the mystery. His disappearance probably means he figured it out. Would be nice to have closure though.

 

[Dr G]

He also sawed off part of his neck to make his bell notes more in tune.

Hmm, that's like cutting off your nose because your feet smell - neither effective, nor recommended. :shock:

OP - We really would like to help you, but from this side of the screen, the explanations of your experiences are not easy to understand.

 

[JayeLID]

...and this problem from a guy who has posted 427 times? Find it hard to believe...

Apparently he's not in any rush to reply again here, too.....his own thread (?)

 

[renegade]

Sorry for my unexplained absence. Just to clarify: 1) I play by ear although I can slowly read notes; 2) I am aware that saxophones are transposing instruments and I know how to transpose; 3) Just to be sure that the digital tuner is in the correct pitch, I checked it with a keyboard, thus, when I pressed the note C in the keyboard, the same letter C appeared on the tuner; 4) The recorded songs I am referring to were from Youtube. 5) I don't have this problem of being a half note lower when I play live with a pianist such that if the first note of the song we are playing is C, I am in tune when I pressed the note A in my alto.
Let me just say, I play saxophone as a hobby. If this is a problem without explanation, I just have to live with it.

 

[Bubba06]

4) The recorded songs I am referring to were from Youtube. 5) I don't have this problem of being a half note lower when I play live with a pianist such that if the first note of the song we are playing is C, I am in tune when I pressed the note A in my alto.

Could you give us an example of this, please?

-Bubba-