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Discussion Starter #1
Hi,
I had some bad experience with some bad pads, tryed all the advices you gave me to make them better, but they were beyond salvation. I am going to have them changed by new ones.
What should I look out for, size, thikness, stiffness?

Regards!
 

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If you order from musicmedic.com (which is what I would suggest), they will have an option for you to select your horn's make/model before adding the pads to your cart. If not, perhaps if you supplied a serial number somebody here with a Big B, or at least experience with them, could give you a list of tone hole diameters.

As far as thickness, I believe Curt Altarac recomends pads between .160" and .165" thick for Buescher horns. Do you have the original snap-ins? If you do, it's wise to keep them and use the musicmedic replacement snap-ins, although you can also modify roopads, and likely others, to fit this system. Just don't remove the snaps and spuds!!

- J
 

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Discussion Starter #3
If you order from musicmedic.com (which is what I would suggest), they will have an option for you to select your horn's make/model before adding the pads to your cart. If not, perhaps if you supplied a serial number somebody here with a Big B, or at least experience with them, could give you a list of tone hole diameters.

As far as thickness, I believe Curt Altarac recomends pads between .160" and .165" thick for Buescher horns. Do you have the original snap-ins? If you do, it's wise to keep them and use the musicmedic replacement snap-ins, although you can also modify roopads, and likely others, to fit this system. Just don't remove the snaps and spuds!!

- J
It´s a 298xxx and it has the studs & snaps.
 

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If the keys hasn't been bent, the proper thickness should be 4.5 mm if you plan on doing it the right way and not have them pads shellac'd and "floated".

I like Pisoni deluxe pads, they have a wealth of skin assortment for you to choose. I like the premium deluxe weatherproof pads. You should get them with no resonators as you'll need to punch them center holes larger to fit the spud and snap thru the pad.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
If the keys hasn't been bent, the proper thickness should be 4.5 mm if you plan on doing it the right way and not have them pads shellac'd and "floated".

I like Pisoni deluxe pads, they have a wealth of skin assortment for you to choose. I like the premium deluxe weatherproof pads. You should get them with no resonators as you'll need to punch them center holes larger to fit the spud and snap thru the pad.
Thank you for your reply Jicaino. So you use the Pisoni pads and keep them floating with no shellac? How about the Pisoni´s are they stiff?
 

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The question is, are you installing the pads yourself, or having someone else do the repad for you? If you are trusting a professional tech with your sax, then you might want to get that person's opinion on which pads to use as well. If you are ordering the pads and doing the work, I would suggest carefully measuring the pad cups with calipers and ordering those exact sizes. The way I do it is to measure north - south, and east - west and average the two diameters. If it is between the half mm sizes, I round down to the next smaller size. By measuring the key cups carefully you are sure to get pads that all fit. It is also a good idea when ordering to get extras of the palm key, and low Eb sizes since those are the pads that need replacing the most often.

I don't want to rekindle an old argument here, but you need to know that there are also experienced techs who choose to use shellac on Buescher snap in pads. It is a matter of personal preference and neither way is right or wrong as long as the pads are seated to a high standard. Curt Alterac is one of the very best, and he prefers to use shellac to float pads on Bueschers to do his best work. I am sure jcaino does just as good a job without shellac.
 

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Just to set the record straight, I'm not dismissing shellac as an option for Buescher saxophones even still retaining the snap in feature. If I use shellac I just complete the backside to level the cardboard with the leather. I avoid like hell using shellac to affix snaps because it leads to snap wear and break of the prongs that actually snaps around the stud.

My reply adresses the fact that if you're going glueless, you need a thicker than .160-.165 pad.

I use shellac mostly when the padcups and snaps has substained repeated services thru the years (more wear and tear and bending back and forth into shape) and the condition of the cups, spuds and snap on resonators are less than optimal.

Thru the years I've seen maybe a dozen of horns that were serviced very disrespectfully (mainly with the snap-in system) and I've had to mill the spuds stumps remaining in place. When I begun repairing, old horns were just old horns and not cult objects. I even desnapped a perfectly good horn that was my first saxophone ever, because back in those days I had no access to american suppliers, had very little information and insight on buescher saxophones and was a young fellow thinking that I knew everything better.

I can say that I've played that horn with snaps and leaky original pads, with snaps and substandard (still sealing) pads (too soft) with snaps and proper firm felt pads sealing, and with no snaps and excellent quality pads. I cannot say that the snaps are definitory to the buescher tone, what I can say is that there's a "feel" to buescher's keyboard and action when the snaps are there that isn't the same when they aren't.

Regarding shellac, if the pad is a plain pad, using shellac allows for a finer installed pad look. The snappin in tends to "dish in" the pad around the snap if you're using a cardboard pad and no shellac. If you fill in with shellac up to a safe distance (not touching .125" around the spud) and then snap in, the result is that the surface of the pad looks flatter all around and the seat is not so deep on certain pads (like E1 key on tenors wich has a relatively large pad for a small tone hole, resulting in the seating force being applied over an area that most likely wouldn't have leather on the backside, causing an apparent too deep seat just because the edge of the pad will be higher than the area where the seat is impressed on said configuration keys)

My main tenor is a 400 TH&C that's far from a collectors. It has a myriad of non original modifications such as the dreaded L links on side keys, bell keys and lower octave key removed, I retained the snaps but welded larger slight dome brass resonators on some keys where the snap was too small, and such. It has shellac backed precision pads, that I custom ordered with double cardboard from Curt. It has been on active duty for about 3 years now and it's solid as a rock although the pads are showing signs of aging and I'd replace them soon. The leather on the precision pads is good for about 2 years IMHO. then it dries out and the felt although firm is not of the highest quality. Even with those consideration they beat the heck out of other comparable "cheap" pads.

Sorry for the long winded post, just wanted to be clear that I'm not denying the value of shellac as a helper on Buescher padding.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
The other pads "My Pads by Pisoni" where seated with shellac so I guess the tech will do the same with the new ones.
As he only works with MY PADS he told me to get whatever other pads I want and he will put them in.

I was considering the Pisoni deluxe you suggest Jicaino or Rigotti Deluxe as I have them in my Selmer Tenor and work quite well.

If I order a complete set, do these come in standard size´s for tenor or should I need to specify exact measurements?
 

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sizes I use for buescher tenors

9,5
18,5
20,5
27,5
30,5
32
34
37 (only one, the back side F#)
38,5
41,5
45,5
48
50
 

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not that I don't want to "disclose" my pad choice quantity, but there's some variances around the early big B's. However those are the sizes you should pick from. It will surely make it easier to measure the horn with a small steel ruler and not needing to disassemble the horn
 
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