[bholder]

I just picked up my new (to me, used) alto sax - it's an RS Berkeley, not sure what model, but probably the "base" / student model ALS501. Only paid $200 from a pawn shop on ebay, but it looks to be in great condition and seems to play ok. I only have a 3&1/2 reed for it (usually use a 2), so it's a bit challenging from that standpoint, but seems like a pretty good deal. Anyway, I'm happy so far, might even try to get in on the June B&I TOTM with it before the end of the day...

 

[bholder]

Rats - too good to be true - I contacted RS Berkeley to find out what model number it is, and they tell me it was stolen (rented and never returned) and asked me to return it. Now to see if I can get my $200 back from the ebay seller.

 

[J-Moen]

I really dislike people who do stuff like this. Sorry to hear about that!

 

[Reet McVouty]

Rats - too good to be true - I contacted RS Berkeley to find out what model number it is, and they tell me it was stolen (rented and never returned) and asked me to return it. Now to see if I can get my $200 back from the ebay seller.

One would assume you paid with a CC or PayPal. Contact them immediately. I would also report the seller to eBay, even if they unwittingly bought the horn from someone else they should still be penalized. If you really like the horn you should also call back RS Berkeley and see if they will sell you the horn at a discount, you may still get a good deal.

 

[Reet McVouty]

Rats - too good to be true - I contacted RS Berkeley to find out what model number it is, and they tell me it was stolen (rented and never returned) and asked me to return it. Now to see if I can get my $200 back from the ebay seller.

One would assume you paid with a CC or PayPal. Contact them immediately. I would also report the seller to eBay, even if they unwittingly bought the horn from someone else they should still be penalized. If you really like the horn you should also call back RS Berkeley and see if they will sell you the horn at a discount, you may still get a good deal.

This appears to be the ALS502 Model. New it sells for $1125.00 on Amazon. Considering the one you bought is used and was rented $500-550 would be a reasonable offer.

 

[soybean]

Wouldn't eBay be the one to shoulder the costs? I say keep the horn and tell RS Berkeley to deal with eBay. You did nothing wrong.

 

[bholder]

One would assume you paid with a CC or PayPal. Contact them immediately. I would also report the seller to eBay, even if they unwittingly bought the horn from someone else they should still be penalized. If you really like the horn you should also call back RS Berkeley and see if they will sell you the horn at a discount, you may still get a good deal.

This appears to be the ALS502 Model. New it sells for $1125.00 on Amazon. Considering the one you bought is used and was rented $500-550 would be a reasonable offer.

Yes, that's my plan, actually.

 

[ZootTheSim]

soybean is right from an ethical stance. But from a legal stance, possessing stolen goods is a crime, so you probably should return it. Sorry for your bad luck, bholder. Keep looking, and another real deal will come along.

 

[bruce bailey]

Don't you mean return it to the ebay seller? It probably was rented from a local music store who posted somewhere that it was stolen, not the factory. just go through ebay channels with documents showing it was stolen (from the local police records).

 

[bholder]

Don't you mean return it to the ebay seller? It probably was rented from a local music store who posted somewhere that it was stolen, not the factory. just go through ebay channels with documents showing it was stolen (from the local police records).

The manufacturer has requested I ship it to them so that it can be returned to the actual owner. I'm fine with that if I can get my money back from the seller. I just don't want to be the one left "holding the bag".

 

[adamk]

You might end up loosing your money.
Years ago my Muramatsu was stolen.
I filed a police report and put it up on all the sites I could find.
Many years later it showed up on eBay and somebody saw it (serial # was listed) and called the police who called me.
Turned out it was in LA and I was in the OC so I went and got it.
The seller was screwed so I gave him a couple of hundred.
That was the beginning of a saga.

 

[B Flat]

Just return it under ebays ridiculously long return policy.
Just say it’s not as described, unless seller stated that it was stolen in the listing.

 

[Figaro]

Just return it under ebays ridiculously long return policy.
Just say it's not as described, unless seller stated that it was stolen in the listing.

YES! What B Flat said. Open a case with Ebay. I've had success getting a refund a few with items "not as described".

 

[tedtelle1]

OUCH!!!!! Hoping you recoup what you paid.

 

[JayeLID]

This is a prickly, actually..if not morally, then logistically.

If I were in OP's shoes, I would also want the quickest way out, and least complicated....given I had done nothing remotely wrong.

But opening a case with eBay and forcing a return to the seller ?? ...

OK so it gets the horn out of the OP's hands....but ostensibly it puts the horn back into seller's hands which may be returning stolen merchandise to the third party (let's assume the pawn shop had no idea it was stolen).

Given RS has already requested the OP to send horn to them.....would this get the OP off the hook here ?

Or would RS be angry at OP for returning the horn to the eBay seller ?

You see ?

I say, do NOT open a 'request return' case....but DO contact eBay and speak to a rep and explain the situation, emphasizing that RS instructed you to send horn to them. Then see what eBay says....

I doubt you will lose your $....I wouldn't worry too much about that...BUT you should try to find out the best steps to handle this via it being an eBay transaction....I am certain this happens on eBay and they have a policy path for it...

The second option would be for you (OP) to discuss with RS that you'd be happy to ship it to them but before doing so you want your $200 back. I think this is a BAD course, personally, because it starts getting you unintentionally entwined in a stolen property situation, as opposed to eBay being entwined in it...
IOW, I think a lawyer would probably say your transaction relationship is with eBay and the eBay seller, and NO other parties...so do not open/pursue a further relationship with a third party (which in this case would be RS) on the matter....

 

[bholder]

This is a prickly, actually..if not morally, then logistically.

If I were in OP's shoes, I would also want the quickest way out, and least complicated....given I had done nothing remotely wrong.

But opening a case with eBay and forcing a return to the seller ?? ...

OK so it gets the horn out of the OP's hands....but ostensibly it puts the horn back into seller's hands which may be returning stolen merchandise to the third party (let's assume the pawn shop had no idea it was stolen).

Given RS has already requested the OP to send horn to them.....would this get the OP off the hook here ?

Or would RS be angry at OP for returning the horn to the eBay seller ?

You see ?

I say, do NOT open a 'request return' case....but DO contact eBay and speak to a rep and explain the situation, emphasizing that RS instructed you to send horn to them. Then see what eBay says....

I doubt you will lose your $....I wouldn't worry too much about that...BUT you should try to find out the best steps to handle this via it being an eBay transaction....I am certain this happens on eBay and they have a policy path for it...

The second option would be for you (OP) to discuss with RS that you'd be happy to ship it to them but before doing so you want your $200 back. I think this is a BAD course, personally, because it starts getting you unintentionally entwined in a stolen property situation, as opposed to eBay being entwined in it...
IOW, I think a lawyer would probably say your transaction relationship is with eBay and the eBay seller, and NO other parties...so do not open/pursue a further relationship with a third party (which in this case would be RS) on the matter....

Yeah, I've got no plan to return it to the pawn shop seller. Either it stays here (legally) or it goes back to the rightful owner. The only detail with ebay and the seller is the small matter of my refund. They're not in the game other than that.

 

[jman1977]

Yeah, I've got no plan to return it to the pawn shop seller. Either it stays here (legally) or it goes back to the rightful owner. The only detail with ebay and the seller is the small matter of my refund. They're not in the game other than that.

In a somewhat simplified summary, you have no right to keep it. The rightful owner (not the seller) has the right to take it from you and your right is to then get your money back from the person who sold it to you, who then has the right to go after whoever sold it to them, and so on.

As illustrated time and again, though, the way eBay does things is not always as straightforward as they should be. Also, there is the matter of logistics RE: how you are actually getting it back to the rightful owner.

Also, this is not your typical open a not as described case with eBay where you return the item to the seller and the seller (or eBay) refunds your payment. The item should not go back to the seller since it is stolen goods. Maybe eBay already has protocols in place for cases like this. Have you contacted eBay yet? I'm sure this isn't the first time something like this has happened.

 

[Grumps]

I just feel sorry for whoever ultimately ends up with the horn... having tried one, that is.

 

[bholder]

In a somewhat simplified summary, you have no right to keep it. The rightful owner (not the seller) has the right to take it from you and your right is to then get your money back from the person who sold it to you, who then has the right to go after whoever sold it to them, and so on.

As illustrated time and again, though, the way eBay does things is not always as straightforward as they should be. Also, there is the matter of logistics RE: how you are actually getting it back to the rightful owner.

Also, this is not your typical open a not as described case with eBay where you return the item to the seller and the seller (or eBay) refunds your payment. The item should not go back to the seller since it is stolen goods. Maybe eBay already has protocols in place for cases like this. Have you contacted eBay yet? I'm sure this isn't the first time something like this has happened.

My plan has always been to return it to the seller. Yes, already contacted ebay, waiting on a response. At the moment, I'm not just waiting on my money back, I'm also waiting for an answer from RSB about who's going to cover the shipping. Ball's in their court...

 

[JayeLID]

I just feel sorry for whoever ultimately ends up with the horn... having tried one, that is.

I was gonna go there, but refrained, lol.....