[wheels410]

Hi,

I play an old French Vito, and have been noticing some problems when playing with our local big band. After some frustrating outings, I bought a tuner and spent some time playing long tones.

I've noticed that while most of the horn is in, the D2 and E2 are WAY sharp. Almost a half step.

Is this something that can be adjusted by a tech? Mouthpiece is a Meyer 6, and I switch back and forth on reeds from LaVoz medium soft, and Vandoren regular #3. Tuning issues are there with both reeds, as well as with the original mouthpiece that came with the horn, (Vito Melodia). I have noticed that the Vito mouthpiece is way loose on the cork, and goes amost all the way on before it is tight. The pads look old, but all seal well.

I'm getting frustrated as I like the horn, but can't stand the tuning problems. I've been playing for 30 years, and try to adjust as best I can, but can't always get where I'm in when I need to be.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!
Jeff

 

[bandmommy]

Your tech may be able to adjust the key heights in an attempt to get things closer to where you need them.
As for the Vito mouthpiece being loose, you can wrap the cork with some teflon plumbers tape. Quick, cheap, and effective for making loose pieces fit better.

 

[Grumps]

I've noticed that while most of the horn is in, the D2 and E2 are WAY sharp. Almost a half step.

These notes, and especially D2, can be sharp on a lot of horns. Having a couple sharp notes isn't as bad as having them flat. Learn to lip them down.

 

[Stephen Howard]

Perhaps you should try a different mouthpiece - the Vito piece is a bit of an unknown quantity.

As a general rule the mouthpiece should sit about 2/3rds the way down the cork. If it's placed much outside this region it can throw out the internal tuning of the horn.
In most case this will mean playing flat or sharp throughout the range, but if a player works their embouchure to make the pitch it can throw up anomalies like the ones you're experiencing.

Regards,

 

[wheels410]

Your tech may be able to adjust the key heights in an attempt to get things closer to where you need them.
As for the Vito mouthpiece being loose, you can wrap the cork with some teflon plumbers tape. Quick, cheap, and effective for making loose pieces fit better.

Thanks very much for the tip with plumber's tape! Will try that. Will also try a trip to the music shop to get with a tech. Maybe he can help too!

 

[wheels410]

Learn to lip them down.

Thanks. That's what I've been trying. Problem is that they're so sharp, it's hard to get them down enough.

 

[wheels410]

Perhaps you should try a different mouthpiece - the Vito piece is a bit of an unknown quantity.

As a general rule the mouthpiece should sit about 2/3rds the way down the cork. If it's placed much outside this region it can throw out the internal tuning of the horn.
In most case this will mean playing flat or sharp throughout the range, but if a player works their embouchure to make the pitch it can throw up anomalies like the ones you're experiencing.

Regards,

I'll take a look at other mouthpieces. My Meyer sits just right at about 2/3 the way down as you stated it should. Thanks!

 

[kymarto]

If the low D and E are not too flat you can have crescents put in the tone holes, which will lower the pitch of those two notes (but in both octaves obviously).

 

[eugeneherman]

Which Vito alto are you playing on? I use a Vito Melodia 3V & enjoy it's tone and flexibility on my Vito/France 38 alto... I've never noticed an intonation issue! I will check my Melodia and Vito on a tuner to determine intonation in your 'issue' range...

 

[JayeLID]

Yes, my first impression was the same...Vito/Beaugnier designed horns usually have excellent intonation.

A dumb Q I gotta ask, to which I am sure you already have an answer.... is: is it the original neck ?

Now...on a D almost ALL keys are already closed....so, perhaps you or a tech can fool with the C/B/Bb heights...but that's about the only wiggle room you may have in keyheight adjustment.

As Grumps said, D2 is the traditionally funky note on most any sax. But it does sound a bit dramatic as you describe it, so perhaps some tweaking is in order.

A m'piece may well change things, too....although I have found Meyers work wonderfully on old Beaugnier/Vito/Noblets, usually....

 

[wheels410]

Which Vito alto are you playing on? I use a Vito Melodia 3V & enjoy it's tone and flexibility on my Vito/France 38 alto... I've never noticed an intonation issue! I will check my Melodia and Vito on a tuner to determine intonation in your 'issue' range...

Sounds great! I wish I could tell you which Vito Alto it is. Best I can do is describe it and attach some photos. S # is 21586. Low B and B flat pad cups are on the players side of the bell. Has that big white left thumb rest and the right thumb rest is not adjustable. Has a nice engraving. Says Made in France on it. The mouthpiece is a Vito Melodia 2V that says France on it. Ligature is just a normal looking 2 scew lig.

 

[wheels410]

Yes, my first impression was the same...Vito/Beaugnier designed horns usually have excellent intonation.

A dumb Q I gotta ask, to which I am sure you already have an answer.... is: is it the original neck ?

Now...on a D almost ALL keys are already closed....so, perhaps you or a tech can fool with the C/B/Bb heights...but that's about the only wiggle room you may have in keyheight adjustment.

As Grumps said, D2 is the traditionally funky note on most any sax. But it does sound a bit dramatic as you describe it, so perhaps some tweaking is in order.

A m'piece may well change things, too....although I have found Meyers work wonderfully on old Beaugnier/Vito/Noblets, usually....

I can't say that it is the original neck, but I believe it to be. The horn looks like it's been very well taken care of. There are absolutely no dents or dings on it. Only normal signs of use. Thanks for commenting. It looks like I'm going to have to let a tech look at it.

 

[wheels410]

I just realized the darn pics are sideways. Sorry about that. My computer skills are lacking.

 

[wheels410]

If the low D and E are not too flat you can have crescents put in the tone holes, which will lower the pitch of those two notes (but in both octaves obviously).

Thanks! I'll spend some more time in front of the tuner and see how that shakes out.

 

[eugeneherman]

You have a fine alto... My avatar is the tenor model of this type... When produced/assembled etc. in Kenosha, your alto was a Model 36... So you have a Beaugnier French built alto that by most anecdotal reports and general agreement is a great instrument intonation wise... So a mystery it be ay? Keep us updated... I personally am keenly interested in your findings...

 

[eugeneherman]

For comparison, here are pics of my Model 37 & Model 38 Vito altos... http://www.doctorsax.biz/vito_alto_10771A_Model37.htm

 

[martinm5862]

Thanks. That's what I've been trying. Problem is that they're so sharp, it's hard to get them down enough.

D2 and E2 are sharp on all horns. Change your tongue position to lower them or depress the low B key.

 

[eugeneherman]

martinm5862... you talkin' D3, E3... wheel talkin' D2, E2 no?

 

[martinm5862]

martinm5862... you talkin' D3, E3... wheel talkin' D2, E2 no?

Thanks, I did catch it and changed my advice for a correction.

 

[eugeneherman]

BTW... The Vito Melodia mpcs were produced by Lelandais in France and hand worked w/ a slight rollover baffle & rounded/not square sides to baffle in throat... A 2V is a very closed facing... A 3V is a medium facing or less in current popular facings... A 2V is very closed by current standards I am saying...