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Okay, this is me coming out from under a rock someplace, but over the weekend I started checking out Ned Goold. I had wondered who played those great sax solos on Harry Connick's big band other than Jerry Weldon (who has been discussed in this section and who I really dig) and discovered Goold. I really like his sound and ideas.

I've only listened to a few things from "The Flow" and off his website, but his tenor playing reminds me in some ways of Warne Marsh and his alto playing like Konitz. He clearly has his own thing going on both harmonically and rhythmically, but I hear a similar approach to the Tristano school with long lines and very original takes on standards.

Any suggestions for additional listening would be appreciated, as would some discussion on his use of the 12-tone row over standards.

And of course it wouldn't be SOTW if I didn't ask the inevitable question...does anyone know what his tenor and alto set-ups are?
 

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Nobody? Wow; if I had started a thread about Kenny G there would have been a dozen responses in as many minutes, LOL.
 

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I'm love his work with Connick - great player. Thanks for this thread...time to do a little research & find out what else he's done!
 

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He's a great player, also quite opinionated and true to his vision. Has developed a certain harmonic "system" which he applies to traditional bebop and swing forms.
 

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ving - As I understand it (from reading Goold's site) his harmonic system is based on applying the 12-tone row to traditional bebop and swing forms, which were largely made up of tin pan alley songs comprising the Great American Songbook. Frankly, I don't know much about 12-tone harmony, also apprently known as "serialism", other than that it gives each note in the scale equal weighting, so there is effectively no key in this music. Since classic tin pan alley tunes clearly have a key, I'm hoping someone can provide some clarity as to how this works and what I should listen for in Goold's music.
 

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I heard Ned in a small club in the Village. He does, indeed, have a unique harmonic approach. I wish I had a recording of the All the Things You Are that he playing.
 

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ving - As I understand it (from reading Goold's site) his harmonic system is based on applying the 12-tone row to traditional bebop and swing forms, which were largely made up of tin pan alley songs comprising the Great American Songbook. Frankly, I don't know much about 12-tone harmony, also apprently known as "serialism", other than that it gives each note in the scale equal weighting, so there is effectively no key in this music. Since classic tin pan alley tunes clearly have a key, I'm hoping someone can provide some clarity as to how this works and what I should listen for in Goold's music.
12 tone row refers to a school of composition developed in the early 20th century (think Schoenberg), where the requirement for a melody (or line, or tone row), is that all notes of the 12 tone chromatic scale must be played before any of are repeated in that melodic line. You are right in that tone centers are not relevant, and the harmony is also constructed to the same effect. Here's a concise description of the basic "rules" in the link below, spelling out the possibilities for octave jumps, inversions of intervals, etc.:

http://library.thinkquest.org/27110/noframes/periods/twelvetone2.html

A great example in jazz of a 12 tone row melody is Coltrane's tune Miles' Mode (the first and second half of the melody ascend & descend, respectively, through a 12 tone row)...a version of it that's easily available is on "Coltrane" (with The Quartet, on Impulse, 1962, not the earlier "Coltrane" on Prestige from the late 50s). There are also live recordings of this tune with Trane & Eric Dolphy, who really seems to feel at home in this realm...the great Eric Dolphy...
 

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Hak - Goold's CD "The Flows" is recording of his trio at various live events opening for the Harry Connick Big Band and has a version of ATTYA/Prince Albert which is really interesting (its one of the things which I downloaded). Goold's oblique references to the original melody are what reminded me of the Marsh/Konitz approach.
 

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citizn cane - Thanks for the background. I'll check out the link and the Coltrane piece.
 

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Ned's a friend of mine. I also present him in concerts in Toronto. (TorontoJazzBuzz.com or facebook group: TorontoJazzBuzz).

Ned's got tons of unreleased material. (He once sent me recordings from 2004-2010 of his live works at Smalls & FatCat in NY that amounted to about 50 albums worth!)

He awes me everytime... and I'm indebted to him for it.


If anyone here is from Toronto, and would like to check him out live, join my fb group to be kept informed.
 

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Okay, this is me coming out from under a rock someplace, but over the weekend I started checking out Ned Goold. I had wondered who played those great sax solos on Harry Connick's big band other than Jerry Weldon (who has been discussed in this section and who I really dig) and discovered Goold. I really like his sound and ideas.

I've only listened to a few things from "The Flow" and off his website, but his tenor playing reminds me in some ways of Warne Marsh and his alto playing like Konitz. He clearly has his own thing going on both harmonically and rhythmically, but I hear a similar approach to the Tristano school with long lines and very original takes on standards.

Any suggestions for additional listening would be appreciated, as would some discussion on his use of the 12-tone row over standards.

And of course it wouldn't be SOTW if I didn't ask the inevitable question...does anyone know what his tenor and alto set-ups are?
I know Ned but I haven't spoken to him in many, many years though, but it's Gould, not Goold. Maybe that's why nobody is responding. He's a really great player from NYC and used to play with a sax quartet or quintet which I can't remember the name of but I think Bobby Watson was in it. I wish I knew more but maybe if you Google Bobby Watson, Ned Gould both something will pop up. Phil Barone
 

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yeah, ned's awesome. i met him in montreal at a jam session once back in '07, connick was playing at the montreal jazz festival and he was there as well as jerry weldon. i've seen him play and talked with him a few times over the years, the last time being around october of '10 at fat cat while i was in nyc. he's actually friends with one of my former sax instructors. never asked him about that 12-tone system, but now after reading about it, it makes a lot of sense...
 

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Isn't there an old proverb? "All that glitters is Ned Gould".
 
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