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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
This is driving me crazy. I know I've seen this stencil make horn before but I cannot ID it positively this go round. The left hand pinkie key cluster alone should pin it down, but I'm drawing a blank. Any ideas?

81076672182117JCnd.jpg 12515982182117JCnd.jpg 28172802182117JCnd.jpg
 

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It looks Buescher-ish to me - late series True Tones had the additional roller on the Bb. This horn has same side bell keys so could be a 30's stencil. It looks like a Gretsch Commander I had a while back that I'm pretty sure was a Buescher.

Here's a TT from saxpics with the same pinky cluster.

ba236894i.jpg
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Cheers. I was suspicious that it was a Buescher, but is seemed to have traits of other makers as well.
 

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Some aspects are similar, but not identical to my Martin Indiana.
 

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The first thing I look for is the heavy, soldered-in tone rings of a Martin. This one has drawn tone holes so it is definitely not a Martin.
 

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The first thing I look for is the heavy, soldered-in tone rings of a Martin. This one has drawn tone holes so it is definitely not a Martin.
I wasn't referring to tone holes, but rather the similarities in the keywork. The pinky cluster was mentioned so I went off that.
I guess I should have been more specific in my reply.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I wasn't referring to tone holes, but rather the similarities in the keywork. The pinky cluster was mentioned so I went off that.
I guess I should have been more specific in my reply.
Yes, I IDed some Martin like traits too, which is what threw me off of the strictly Buescher path.
 

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I saw that Ad too. The keywork is Buescher like. The bow fin shape is off. The nice engraving doesn’t ring a bell. No name? Maybe it was a order gone bad and Buesher just stuck “Made in Elkhart” on it. Guessing late ‘30’s? Someone got a nice vintage alto.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I bid on it myself (like I need another one in the hoard), but was outbid in the last minute. It went for more than I was willing to pay for it anyway.
 

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Bidding is easy. It’s explaining to the wife that’s hard. Went for a decent number.
 

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I agree a Bueschwer TT III or IV post 1929. They aren’t all that rare but maybe not in this state.
 

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I disagree Buescher True Tone as they had one bell key per side. It seems that manufacturers didn't always use their top of the line parts on stencils, so this one got the TT LH spatula. This one has the Conn style curve up to the pearl on the A key. Martin and Buescher are made with a right angle.
 

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The G# trill key is identical to my Elkhart Band Instrument Company Alto. The LH Pinky cluster is very similar except for the extra tab on the Bb key. Other similarities as well, wire guards, shape of post pads, neck octave etc. Mine is from 1929.

P1150899.JPG Elkhart Alto_LH Pinky Table.JPG IMAG1047.jpg IMAG1049.jpg
 

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The additional roller and side tab for Bb on the pinky cluster was added on the early Aristocrats and some very late True Tones - the pic below is from a New Aristocrat which was kind of like a transitional model from a True Tone to the Series I Aristocrat.

davidlh - I suspect your Elkhart is later than 1929, probably mid-30's/post 1935 since it has same side bell keys.

237110C5.jpg
 

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I am quite sure that removing a pad will reveal a stud and that on the neck there will be a number ( 1-2-3).
If these things are there this will be a 100% Buescher.

I don’t Believe in cross pollination between brands belonging to different owners. I also believe that if a piece like the G# belonging to Buescher this would have been patented and if it would have been used by any other brand this would have been fought in the courts.
 

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I wouldn't bet on the keycups having the studs for snap-in pads, or the neck being numbered.

Other than that everything I see there says "Buescher" to me.

Even the engraving pattern looks very much like an Aristocrat pattern, except for the "made in Elkhart" lettering.
 

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Interesting horn. I have seen similar 'elevated' stencils made by Buescher before......if it stayed under $400 it was a nice take for someone, I would bet when one measures up the body they may find they ended up with an early 'Crat body outfitted with some TT keywork....not the worst hybrid, for sure.
 
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