[rogcwilliams]

HI now dont all jump on me for asking this but im curious to know what other people think about the matt finish selmer put on there Reference 54. and do you all think it would be better if it was not lacquered and didnt have the fake black vintage bits sprayed on it.

Just curious ??????

 

[hgiles]

I think all matte finishes are hokey. Start with a bare unlacquered finish and go with that....Or earn the look the good old fashioned way!

 

[heath]

Basically it's just a finish. If you're going to buy a new Ref 54 I'd suggest the 54LE with honey gold lacquer like the Ref 36. I have a Ref 54 and 36 and I at first I thought the Ref 54 matte was butt ugly, but like most people said the finish grows on you and now I think it's a sharp looking horn. Here's some photos of my Ref horns sided by side.

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2003-11/513693/JEWXY-100_0517.JPG

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2003-11/513693/RKWWD-100_0518.JPG

 

[Finnerski]

Nice looking horns, Heath. I like the Matte finish. They can look real cool under certain lighting. I was playing a big band gig the other night and I was noticing my JK nickel silver was changing colors. I think they look sharp. I have heard some people say that the matte finish looks "industrial". I even heard some one say the JK nickel silver finish looks like the "kitchen sink". To each is their own.

 

[Reedsplinter]

I'm with Heath that it's just a finish. Personally I have no strong feelings about it one way or the other, and as a consequence I tend to go with traditional finishes: my Ref. 36 is honey gold. I saw someone with a matte finish 54 the other night: from a distance in dim light for about 10 seconds I was fooled into thinking it was a vintage nickle-plated horn; then I came to my senses. Another player I know has the nickel plated JK tenor: it looks like a tenor. I'd play a horn finished in elephant hide if it played superbly for me.

 

[Finnerski]

I'm with you guys too, its just a finish. But if your spending big $$$$ on your horn, it doesn't hurt to like how it looks, as long as it sounds the way you want it. Back when Sonny and Trane were doing their thing, they weren't playing old beat up "Vintage" horns. They were brand new back then. Elephant hide, you might be on to something there Splinter.

 

[rogcwilliams]

Im not just talking bout Selmer im thinking what if someone bought out a sax that was Unlacquered and had the brushed matt finish..i mean after a while how cool would that look do you think.

 

[Grumps]

...do you all think it would be better if it ... didnt have the fake black vintage bits sprayed on it.

That's what irks me; the faux antique shading.
Will look horrible when that starts to go.

 

[Al Stevens]

I call it the "designer bathroom fixture" finish. It reminds me of pewter, too. I like matte saxophone finishes about as much as I like black, white, purple, green, red, etc., finishes on saxophones. They are showy and pretentious. Eye candy. They call attention to the visual and away from the audible.

 

[hgiles]

That's what irks me; the faux antique shading.
Will look horrible when that starts to go.

Yeah, agreed, I suppose that bothers me more than anything -- faux anything...

But Heath, really good looking horns though...

 

[Reedsplinter]

Is it really the nature of the finish you object to, Al, or the departure from a norm? One could say that standard gold lacquer finishes are flashy and showy -- they certainly are pretty. If it had been the norm for hornmakers in 1920 to put matte finishes on horns, would we now be having this conversation about those newfangled gold lacquer instruments? My guess is that most people don't pay much attention to the way the horn looks (unless maybe it has elephant hide finish, a notion I'm starting to like). Even the musicians I play with regularly wouldn't notice if (as happened once) I suddenly showed up with a silver plated axe instead of my usual gold lacquer. The audience is even less observant about these kinds of things.

 

[rogcwilliams]

That's what irks me; the faux antique shading.
Will look horrible when that starts to go.

I totaly agree Grumps i hate the fake black bits if it was just brushed and unlacquered it would look really cool after a few months..

 

[rogcwilliams]

I call it the "designer bathroom fixture" finish. It reminds me of pewter, too. I like matte saxophone finishes about as much as I like black, white, purple, green, red, etc., finishes on saxophones. They are showy and pretentious. Eye candy. They call attention to the visual and away from the audible.

I think AL has anger issues

 

[Spooner]

To each his (or her) own I say.

I have to say that one of the things about the 54's matte finish that appealed to me was that it wasn't all shiny and engraved. Don't get me wrong, I love beautifully engraved horns and think that saxes of all types are beautiful. But with the 54 I like the fact that it's not flashy and showy--it's a tool to make music and that's what it looks like to me--a real working man's horn as I think I read heath describing it at some point (correct me if I'm wrong please). The only thing that makes it stand out at all is that it looks different than most other saxes (which in my opinion are more flashy).

Of course this stuff is all secondary to how the horn plays, and I can honestly say that my 54 does that for me very well and that's why I bought it.

 

[saxphil]

Matte finish= hokey
Should be $1000 cheaper

 

[Al Stevens]

Is it really the nature of the finish you object to, Al, or the departure from a norm?

I don't object to the finish. I don't like it. I don't like sweet potatoes and squash either, but I don't object to them. I just don't eat them.

The subject of this thread asks whether we like the finish. I answered and said why. I thought that's what was wanted. For some reason, my participation in the discussion is open for some kind of pop-psycho-babbble Dr.Phil deep analysis of motives and anger. Horse hockey. It's not all that complicated. I just don't like it. If someone owns a sax with that finish and likes it, that's no reason for them to feel threatened and rush to defend their preferences or try to find some hidden meaning in mine. They probably like sweet potatoes and squash, too. I can't imagine why, but that's another subject.

In case you didn't know, finish does affect tone. Studies have proven that a matte finish makes a player sound more like Kenny G than any other finish. It's very subtle, but it's there. But that's not why I don't like it.

 

[saxphil]

Matte finish + Kenny G = sweet potatoes + squash

 

[Teddy]

My Ref tenor sounds great and is matte finnished.After I sent it to Sherry Huntley for the classic american MkIV floral engraving it looks as great as it plays.

 

[hakukani]

They probably look better on TV. Less reflection/glare from the lighting.

 

[LateNiteSax]

The matte finish is an abomination, like vinyl siding on a house vs. real wood slats (yeah i have vinyl .) But a new horn should be gleaming and shiny, and after 20 years of bar wars, it will be a true, Clint Eastwood-esqe battle hardened warrior, and have a tough but tender, broken in sound to boot. Hu Ra, Bring it ON!:shock: