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Discussion Starter #1
Hey,
So i have a p.mauriat 67rdk that has a good sound but the problem is the low notes just arnt doin it for me. The sound is good for concert band but i need to be able to hit lower than a D :space0: to be able to practically play this horn. Now the sound is repeating almost like a flutter tound effect but im not doing anything. the horn just isnt letting me play the note. It sometimes talke up the octave and goes into that too. The low D sounds fuzzy but comes out. If i try to hit a C or C#... nope. But the problem isnt me because i can go on any other horn and play all the way down to a Bb without a problem and hit all the way up to an altissimo A. I just wanna figure this out begause my tech cant figure this out because ive taken it into him 3 separate times with the same problem. Now its not the mouthpiece because ive changed the mouthpiece and lig and reed. I just need to figure this out soon because concert band for college will be up soon and im planning on using this horn for that. If anyone has had this problem before or anything like this anything truely would be much apriciated because ive had this problem pretty much since 2 months after i got the horn. Thanks!

Best wishes,
-Dylan
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I don't personally know my tech for this sax, I have a free service plan from Sam ash, the place I bought it. So I take it to them and they send it out. Uhm but yes it does very much seem like a leak but they insist that there isn't a leak.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
I just read that thread and I play the same 3 mouthpieces on my 1925 king and literally the thing plays up and down like a dream, only catch is the Damn thing is flat on c# and Sharp on D. That's a completely different story though. Anyways yea I just don't know why this darned thing won't play below a d
 

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a not easily visible leak is always possible and can drive you nuts, but we’ll get to that later.

Have you had anyone else try your horn? If not, do that. Have someone try your horn with the same mouthpiece and with another mouthpiece. Don’t tell them what it is that you are looking for.

Let them position the mouthpiece on the horn, don’t do it for them.

If they don’t have a gurgle, it is not a problem with the horn.

If it is not a problem with the horn it has to be a player’s problem. You could be placing the mouthpiece not far enough and normally play with a pinched embouchure (which gives also other problems but never mind now about these).

This could cause a gurgle.

Try pushing the mouthpiece much further than you would normally do, relax your embouchure, support with your diaphragm. Try different mouthpieces to suit your embouchure and the horn.

If the gurgle persists try the old fashioned method (which is not a solution) and put something into the bell, a golf ball will do fine. This is not a solution in my opinion but some people use it and indeed apparently American assembled Selmer Mark VI altos were fitted with a soldered piece of metal in the bow t cure a gurgle which European assembled Selmer Mark VI altos ( I have two) don’t have!

Mysterious!

Anyway, there are several places where a hidden leak might be.

Fist check that the octave pips are not unsoldered and leaking. This is not the kind of leak that you could find with a leak light.

Check that the neck is sealing (blow air in the neck without mouthpiece while closing the other end) . The receiver/tenon arrangement might be leaking because of a faulty solder or because the receiver is broken (this is a bit more difficult to check ).

The palm keys might be leaking very very little, this is only possible to spot with a powerful leak light and in total darkness (a lot of technicians don’t check the horn in total darkness).

Some keys might be shut while not playing and because of a weak spring they might open while playing check spring tension although normally it is very tense on Taiwanese horns like yours.


Good luck!
 

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Also check the bow to body connection, if the glue is compromised you can have a very serious leak. Find another technician in your area, see if he/she can spot the problem. It's always a good idea to get a second opinion if the horn is still having issues.
 

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I'm reading this because I've had the same issue on a horn I recently acquired. I checked everything Milandro suggested before getting out the screwdrivers.

As soon as I released the springs on Eb and C, I knew what was going on - too much play between the posts and the key tubes. The spring tension was holding the key in place. The leak did not show up with the LED tube lights perhaps because there are too many lights on. If you have a single penlight, tie a string on it and drop it in the sax. Maybe you'll find something.

See if there is any movement in those keys. If so, move them up or down and test to see if the gurgle is still there.
 

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I don't personally know my tech for this sax, I have a free service plan from Sam ash, the place I bought it. So I take it to them and they send it out. Uhm but yes it does very much seem like a leak but they insist that there isn't a leak.
It's entirely possible that they aren't trying very hard under the conditions of the service plan. You may have to get more insistent with them, should you determine (after following the good advice others are offering here) that there is a problem. If there is a reputable repairmen near you, you may have to resort to an independent checkup.
 

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I don't personally know my tech for this sax, I have a free service plan from Sam ash, the place I bought it. So I take it to them and they send it out. Uhm but yes it does very much seem like a leak but they insist that there isn't a leak.
There is your problem. Find someone else to fix it. From my experience their contracted wind techs are sub-par... I've picked up "fully adjusted" flutes in their stores that I couldn't get a sound out of (and neither could a friend I was with, same for the sales girl who claimed to be a flautist and that it worked when they brought it in...)

Otherwise follow Grumps' advice, you may end up having to return it.
 

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All of My horn's gurgle when I do not have the mouthpiece pushed far enough in on the neck or using bad posture and lack of air support.

*** Find a good local tech ****

Ensure you are using the proper reed strength for your "embrochure" - might want to try a softer reed!

First play the neck and mpc with a tuner you should be hitting G#

Put the neck on the horn and tighten - using the same embrochure play F# and the tuner should hit "A"

Play C - tuner should be at Eb

Play low B with good air support - if not clean push the mpc in a tad.
 

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If the gurgle persists try the old fashioned method (which is not a solution) and put something into the bell, a golf ball will do fine. This is not a solution in my opinion but some people use it and indeed apparently American assembled Selmer Mark VI altos were fitted with a soldered piece of metal in the bow t cure a gurgle which European assembled Selmer Mark VI altos ( I have two) don’t have!

Mysterious!
<requisite derail> Does this observation correlate with whether the bow is soldered to the body on those Selmers? Do both your horns have soldered bows (vs removable)?
 

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Always check G# first to make sure its not slightly venting on the low notes. Thats a recurring theme for your described problem.
 

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Always check G# first to make sure its not slightly venting on the low notes. Thats a recurring theme for your described problem.
but I would expect that would be one of the first things that the Sam Ash technician would have looked at
 

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Always check G# first to make sure its not slightly venting on the low notes. Thats a recurring theme for your described problem.
Having the C speak clearly while C#, B and Bb problematic would indicate the G# is opening.
 

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If the horn was purchased new right off the wall from a music store a very real possibility is that your instrument was never set up properly. A good quality set up job can be very expense relative to the cost of your instrument, new or used. Of course there is also a very real possibility that it is a lemon to be begin with and therefore a money pit. Fortunately an ethical tech would tip you if the set up cost is worth it, or just a plain old cost prohibitive lemon.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
its actually a straight factory horn, never hit the shelves. uhm im gonna go play and ill get back to yall in bout an hour or so
 

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Discussion Starter #20
okay so i just went down and found 3 leaks haha. i found the alternate f#, regular f# and low Bb. These are probably the reasons why the sax isnt playing low. So im gonna take the sax in later this week when i get a chance and tell them to replace those pads. i will keep everyone posted but keep the discussion going for anyone else that has this problem too.

Now ive never looked for leaks. I believe they are when the light comes through. Again i am a novice when it comes to fixing a sax. Im a decent player but never really tries to fix my sax other than bending posts and tightening springs. I saw light coming through all 3 pads.

I initially pushed in the mouthpiece till there was no cork. Slight improvement, still "motorboating"
Switched to all 3 mouthpieces that i use. Each one gave the same charateristics but no change on the problem.
Then i dropped a couple of things down the sax of different sizes. Cut down the volume, still taking it up the octave and i actually noticed that when the C goes up it hits the subtone G instead.
Next i played with all the air i could and standing up. Volume of course went up. Each not came out but was just as nasty if not worst because you could hear each gurgle.
then i took the micro light. Found all three leaks. Obviously no change in sound.
 
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