[Saxolyp]

Just my personal experience and opinions,
"Student" horn mean cheap price! Come with everything you need to start!
Feature of "Student" horn:

Horn: Slowest reaction, with bright and loud sound, if you finger does not press fully or accurately! That's mean your horn will blow everybody ear off! Good for finger practice!

Mouthpiece come along with "Student" horn: Hardest to blow! With extra large opening with super hard reed, but is good for stamina and circular breath training, you must blow with correct air stream or else "emptying" of your lung.:mrgreen:

Quality of Sound: 2 out of 5, bright and loud but meaningless sound, totally different from a real sax…usually feel like a mix from clarinet + pipe or trump, Bi Bi Bi or Ba Ba Ba or Bu Bu Bu[rolleyes]….compare with Pro.Sax should realize that.
P.S forgot to mention.you can improve the sound quality if you change a mouthpiece and reed, should choose your own mouthpiece and reed.
Price: Cheapest and can be describe as disposable if compare to Mark6, so not a big deal even without any knowledge for cleaning and maintaining.
Add:Must below 1000USD...my friend said: "I'm using "student" horn too...and without any complain" P.S "student" horn by Selmer Paris ":soapbox:

Beautiful horn: Can hang it on the wall as decoration if you found that sax is not your cup of tea.. lol:mrgreen:

As my recommendation, never ever :tsk:choose or buy "student" horn if you:
1) You're already fall in love with Sax
2) You're able to learn all basic within a month
3) You're able to take good care of your Sax
4) You have extra Budget.

Welcome to share your experience and opinions!

 

[Enviroguy]

This is not true.

A "student" saxophone is simply one that is marketed for use by students. The quality and price varies depending on which student model being discussed and when it was made. A few student models (such as Yanagisawa and Keilwerth stencils) are as good or better than some saxophones marketed to professionals.

In general, you must know much more about a brand, model, history, and time period it was made before you will know if a saxophone has the potential to be good or bad based solely on it's name. And the only way to know for sure is to play that specific individual saxophone yourself.

This SOTW forum is a great resource to find out about specific models, both student models and professional models. And welcome to SOTW! :bluewink:

 

[sirspinbad]

im playing an intermediate conn bari from the 70's and it KILLS!! i suppose intermediate might mean easier to play?? Ive got no complaints with that...!!!

 

[Kontra]

While I agree there are a lot of great student horns out there, my Conn 6M in lousy condition sounded better than the Selmer Aristocrat and Bundy II in good condition that the other sax players in my band have.

However, because my 6M was in bad shape, they SA and Bundy II PLAYED better, but the sound was nowhere near as good as the Conn. I'm not exactly sure why. I used the same reed and mouthpiece setup.

 

[AhCheung]

Both saxolyp and enviro are right.
I believe saxolyp (thanks for the funny post!) was referring to the numerous Asian made new shiny saxes available online.... although there are a few exceptions there (eg Venus, Bauhaus, Golden Cup)... depending on the finish some sound horrible indeed (plated inside and outside).
Agree entirely with enviro, though.... my old, well used YAS-23 sounds better than the new Cannonball ('pro' model) of an advanced student I know...

 

[ericdano]

Horn: Slowest reaction, with bright and loud sound, if you finger does not press fully or accurately! That's mean your horn will blow everybody ear off! Good for finger practice!

Not true. There are plenty of variations of student horns. Unison used to make horns (or still does?) that were made of really soft (ie: easily bent) metal but they had good tone. Some of the other off name brands play well. Certainly react just as fast as a "pro" horn.

Mouthpiece come along with "Student" horn: Hardest to blow! With extra large opening with super hard reed, but is good for stamina and circular breath training, you must blow with correct air stream or else "emptying" of your lung.:mrgreen:

Large opening? I'd say just the opposite, they usually are like about a 4 Meyer size or so.

Quality of Sound: 2 out of 5, bright and loud but meaningless sound, totally different from a real sax…usually feel like a mix from clarinet + pipe or trump, Bi Bi Bi or Ba Ba Ba or Bu Bu Bu[rolleyes]….compare with Pro.Sax should realize that.

***.....you really don't know what the hell you are talking about. There are PLENTY of good student horns. Heck, I used to have a sax teacher who played on an old Armstrong (USA brand from 80s student alto) that he made sound better than my friend who had an old Selmer Balanced Action alto.

Price: Cheapest and can be describe as disposable if compare to Mark6, so not a big deal even without any knowledge for clearing and maintaining.

Again.....***. Disposable? Hardly. Depends on the model, but a lot are very durable.

Beautiful horn: Can hang it on the wall as decoration if you found that sax is not your cup of tea.. lol:mrgreen:

Ok......

As my recommendation, never ever :tsk:choose or buy "student" horn if you:
1) You're already fall in love with Sax
2) You're able to learn all basic within a month
3) You're able to take good care of your Sax
4) You have extra Budget.

My recommendation is that anyone who wants to play sax who hasn't, RENT one. Don't shell out $500 on something you don't know if you are going to stick with. After 6 months, you can talk to the shop where you rented it and either buy it or use the money towards a new or better one. I can't think of any music stores that don't allow you to do that.

 

[JayeLID]

Well...I'll give you another take on it:

"Student" horn was the creation of marketing people...who wanted you to believe that it is more appropriate/smarter to buy a new/newer horn of questionable tonal and construction quality. They also want to make you believe that, at the paltry budget a beginner happens to have...their only choice is a Student model....

(BTW...I believe what Saxolyp meant by 'disposable' was....right at the get-go it is understood that the instrument will very, very likely be replaced. In that respect, I agree).

I, Like AhCheung, also think the OP's post was pretty darn funny....Some of it was pretty darn astute actually (why, along with a student horn, one gets a 'stock' student mouthpiece which 90% of the time actually handicaps the player right out of the gate !!!)

The only comment I would make is...you don't need any "extra budget" to get a non-"Student" sax. On the contrary....they are many times more expensive than far, far, far superior and reputed second-hand models, most of the time.....

So you get the double-play: screwed in the wallet and screwed with the horn.

Boo-yah. :|

 

[JfW]

The "student horn" moniker means one of three things depending the speaker's motives:

1) A quality no-frills instrument with a reliable mechanism, good tuning, durable build, and competent setup. Compromises should be based on aesthetics and advanced features.

2) A crummy, low-priced instrument who's seller is trying to convince the unwary buyer that it's "good enough for a beginner", though it really isn't.

3) A person's derogatory assessment of an instrument that's not up their own personal liking, particularly regarding tone.

 

[bandmommy]

HA! In my house a 'student' horn is an entry level PRO horn.
I did get them 'less expensive' instruments for Marching Band, but none of them had the problems listed by the OP.
I think someone needs to stop shopping at WalMart....

 

[Grumps]

A student horn is any horn you give to a kid to play that you don't mind so much if it gets wrecked.

 

[zorrosg]

The "student horn" moniker means one of three things depending the speaker's motives:

3) A person's derogatory assessment of an instrument that's not up their own personal liking, particularly regarding tone.

Bingo, I think this member has hit the nail on the head, with heavy emphasis on the words "derogatory" and "personal liking".

 

[Starsax A2]

The student/pro label gives an unfortunate bad rap to some good saxophones (and other instruments as well). One of our pillars of faith in this modern technological world is that better and more expensive gear will magically achieve the goal. We'd be better off realizing that some elbow grease, in the form of practice, would serve our purposes better.
The more expensive horns are made with better materials and to closer tolerances, and they give a more refined sound and feel when playing. But the good student horns are "real" saxophones, and they give correct intonation and good sound.
I wouldn't necessarily apply the term "student" horn to the typical $169 Ebay comes-with-white-gloves saxophone. You would probably want something a bit more substantial for a true "student" to learn on.
I'm reminded of the old story of the violin virtuoso who was to visit a music school to give a performance. He walked out on stage and played his opening number. The enthralled students applauded enthusiastically. An assistant then walked out and handed the virtuoso a second violin. He held it up and announced it was his Stradivarius. He said the first one he bought at a pawnbroker's for a small sum. He then told the students to learn all they could and practice, practice, practice.
I'm not knocking the more expensive "professional" horns at all. If I had the money, I'd get one real quick. I'm just saying a good "base" model Yamaha or Selmer or King can take you a long way.

 

[jbtsax]

Think of the difference between an economical set of golf clubs for a beginning golfer compared to a high end custom set for a very advanced or professional player. Both sets do what they are intended to do. In fact, the advanced golfer will do much better when playing with the economical set than the beginning golfer. The beginning golfer on the other hand may never develop the level of skill to get the most out of the advanced features of the high end set.

The differences between the two sets of clubs are:

- The cost and quality of the materials
- The sophistication and engineering of the design
- The quality and quality control of the manufacturing
- The cost of advertising and marketing
- The brand name recognition and reputation

Just because a pro might use an economical set of clubs from time to time does not make that set a professional set of clubs or even comparable to a professional set of clubs.

 

[Mikkeos]

Student horn: Missing the expensive handcrafted engraving of more expensive models and may have no mother of pearl inlays.

 

[ratracer]

My personal definition of "student" horn - ANY horn given to yours truly, saxophone student extraordinaire. (still, and after all these years.)

To inject a little jocularity into the topic. - Father Mulcahy, M.A.S.H. 4077

 

[MADLOU]

Enough with all this nonsense about a "student", "intermediate", "entry-level professional" and "professional" saxophone. That is nothing but pure marketing hype. Like Dave Kessler told me recently when we discussed the subject, a good horn is a good horn and a bad horn is a bad horn no matter how the manufacturer categorizes it. I think Duke Ellington expressed the same sentiments.

 

[Fader]

A "Student" horn is what most working pros can afford. Pro horns are what most collectors buy.

 

[bandmommy]

In a way we are all still 'students'. My last student clarinet set me back ~$2600 about 8 or 9 years ago.
That's a hell of a lot more than all 3 of my student saxophones + repairs combined.

 

[AuntSaxophone]

I think the term is kinda misused a lot. A lot of the horns that are called Student horns in a bad way are considered bad because they are basically trash to begin with. Kids want shiny new horns that look cool. Non-Smart Parents don't want to spend a fortune just for their kids to give up the horn a few months later. So they buy the cheap horn figuring they can at least resell it later or something and if not, it's not much of a loss.

But these cheap horns don't tend to be made very well. Sure they might be shiny and cool looking but they might squawk like a dying goose even in the hands of an experienced saxophonist. If the horn is taken to a tech, any repairs or adjustments made might not work for very long. The student gets frustrated that they can't sound as good as that other kid using the beat up horn that is twice their age. Eventually, giving up is likely to be heavily considered and another ultra cheap horn finds its way into the garbage pile.

But there are horns that are considered student horns, not because they are throwaway horns, but because they are long lasting horns that will serve a student well.

I have one of those good, quality student horns. It is 2.3 times my age, and I am willing to bet it served someone or multiple someones very well over the 53 years it has been in existence. The neck is very discolored but I am old enough to not really care what it looks like on the outside. After all, it is how it plays that counts. I tried two newer saxes, one of which was a brand new Unison, before my 1958 Conn Director came into my hands. They sounded bland in comparison. Even my family members commented that it sounded better.

 

[marton]

A student horn is any horn that is currently being used by a student.