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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey there-

The title pretty much asks my question-are there bore differences, as in significant playing differences, between the old Kielwerth Bundys, Couf Superba I's, and Kielwerths? The Couf and the Bundy, in particular. I've had a couple of Superba I's-normally I play a 78k VI or a 298k Super 20, but I always really liked the Coufs. Financial necessity forced the sale of both of them; I play Selmer and King tenors as well, so it seemed at the time the best move for me was to keep the Selmers and Kings and sell the Coufs. I've always intended to get another Superba I when I was flush enough, but they're getting more difficult to find and a bit more expensive, so the prospect of buying a Couf Bundy stencil is more attractive, IF they play about the same. I'll miss the big, doofy pearls and the cool Couf engraving, but the difference in acquisition cost is significant enough that I think I'll learn to live with it! Just to try to head off those who want to give me a load of crap for selling the Coufs as opposed to the Selmers or Kings, I was doubling on tenor and alto a lot on gigs and recording sessions, and I found it easier to go from Selmer to Selmer (or King to King). Also, I never owned a Bundy/Couf/Kielwerth tenor so the choice seemed obvious. Frankly, I never liked the Kielwerth tenors very much...great horns, but not for me. You Kielwerth guys, please let me know your thoughts about the similarities and differences. Happy new year to all. Thank you in advance.
 

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Hi, I think the main differences are going to be whether or not the Bundy labeled horns are the specials and the altos and tenors in that series have the real rolled tone holes (not the later soldered on rings of the SX series) like the King and Couf Superba I horns.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Hi, I think the main differences are going to be whether or not the Bundy labeled horns are the specials and the altos and tenors in that series have the real rolled tone holes (not the later soldered on rings of the SX series) like the King and Couf Superba I horns.
Thanks-I was hoping someone would share doe kind of information. I just bought a Kielwerth that's a Selmer stencil; as it's plated, it will probably be very difficult to tell whether the toneholes are actually rolled or are soldered on. Somehow I was dimly aware of the SX horns having soldered on tonehokes; I didn't know that applied to the Couf Superba I as well. I imagine the toneholes follies out of the actual metal of the tonehole have the potential of more resonance. I always liked the Superba I, though, so I think I'd be good with either. As a player that usually plays Selmers, Kings, and occasional Conns this stencil most likely won't be my main horn. It's gonna need work, at least-possibly a complete repad, though I will first attempt to get it going with minimal intrusion, just to see what's there. You sound like you know a lot more about these horns than I do-if you were to repad, what would you use? My instincts would be a "B52" style pad (Allied) with stick Selmer nylon domed resonators...that's always been a safe bet for most horns I've done in the past, but please-let he know your thoughts! Thanks for the info.-Gof
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I hate spell correct about 95% of the time...that should read "toneholes ROLLED", not "toneholes FOLLIES". " stock Selmer rosonators", not "stick Selmer resonators". And so on. Obviously, "tonehokes" should be "toneholes"...et cetera.
 

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Anyone have a set of calipers ? If we are talking Altos, measure up your JK stencil horn and lets find out. I have a King Tempo here I'd be happy to measure.

My impression has always been that the New King model stencils are the same body and neck specs, just tonehole difference and some keywork tweaks. But, honestly, it'd be a good question to investigate.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Anyone have a set of calipers ? If we are talking Altos, measure up your JK stencil horn and lets find out. I have a King Tempo here I'd be happy to measure.

My impression has always been that the New King model stencils are the same body and neck specs, just tonehole difference and some keywork tweaks. But, honestly, it'd be a good question to investigate.
When it arrive I will the some measurements. Like I said, at first I'm going to see if I can get it playing pretty well, so I won't completely dismantle it. If I like it well enough to repad it, I'll measure everything I can access on the body.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Stung by autocorrect once again-I should've proofed it. I'll take some measurements when the horn arrives.
 

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Gofy, I think you misunderstood my last sentence: The Superba I horns had genuine rolled tone holes like The King. Once Keilwerth went to fully producing offsetting upper and lower key stacks and detachable bows Selmer style, so went the real rolled tone holes as well as the aligned upper and lower stacks. The one thing I really noted between the Superba I and the SX aside from the very obvious and thorough modernizing of the SX was how the necks played differently; the stock Couf Superba I neck had a more open and clear feel to it. Whether that was the result of a bore change or not I don't know but at the time the profile between the 2 seemed a bit different to me.
 
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