Sax on the Web Forum banner
1 - 10 of 10 Posts

·
Distinguished Member and Bass Sax Extraordinaire
Joined
·
1,050 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
The other day I had the opportunity to play test a Jinyin-made, vintage American style, bass sax stencilled for Xu Qiu. After writing about Asian-made bass saxophones for years, it was my finally the first time that had chance to play one of these horns for myself.

Given all the negative press that these horns have received since their introduction, I was prepared for something worse than I encountered. In short, the horn wasn't that bad. For the occasional bass player who plays 3 or 4 gigs a year and doesn't put the horn through a lot of playing throughout the year, this baby will likely do the trick.

However, and this is a big however, don't expect to have the horn play out of the box. You'll likely have to drop north of $1,000 into it to get it into playing condition. That said, if you can get one at a good price, that still can be thousands less than a rebuilt vintage Buescher or Conn. But... It all depends on what you plan to do with your bass.

I have written a full review of the Jinyin-made bass for the blog portion of my website.

If you're seriously considering a leap into the Asian bass saxophone market, and are thinking of one of the American-style horns made by Jinyin, I hope you find the review helpful. And yes, there are also lots of pics.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,793 Posts
Has anyone done a writeup on the other Chinese bass sax, the Jin Bao one? It's apparently a Selmer SA80 knockoff. I've read several reviews of the Jinyin (American style) one.
 

·
Distinguished Member and Bass Sax Extraordinaire
Joined
·
1,050 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Actually, there are quite a few reviews of the Jinbao bass, and in comparison, relatively few of the Jinyin. If you enter Jinbao into the Search Forum box--at the top right of the Bass Saxophone Forum, you get all these threads. Among them, you'll find quite a few reviews from players who own them.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
805 Posts
It basically comes down to sound preference and how much you would spend for that.
Jinyin is Conn sounding, Jinbao is Selmer sounding.
everything else is how much would you invest in achieving that concept.
I wouldn't spend one penny on the selmer sound on a bass sax even if it is better built. They just do not get it to my ears..
Long wrap for me until some Chinese guy figures out how to make an Eppelsheim knock off.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,682 Posts
Are the Jinyin basses still for sale somewhere? I'm considering a bass (planning stages,) and despite the so-so reputation of the Jinyin I think I'd rather have a long wrap (I can't imagine I'll miss the F# key.) However, all the store brand options seem to be the short wrap. While I'd prefer the long wrap, I must admit the short wrap from Thomann seems like an awesome deal, so that's my backup option.

Can the long wrap be ordered direct from Jinyin?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,793 Posts
I have a short wrap bass sax (Noblet) and I don't feel that, with a good mouthpiece, it gives up much or anything in tone to a long wrap bass. I tested it back to back against an old Conn, and when I was doing that I had just come from testing out a Buescher a week before. For me, I wanted the keywork to high F and I did take into consideration the ease of handling. Now the Noblet may be different tonally than a Selmer or Selmer copy; I can't speak to that. But if it's not, I don't have any experience of wanting more bass-ness. I was particularly impressed playing baritone parts in a big band on the bass, how powerfully it projects compared to the baritone playing the exact same pitches. It's different; it's more like a pipe organ laying down a huge bed of bass rather than the way a baritone cuts through more, but there was no question about being heard.

So although I read all this about "oh, the short wrap ones just sound like a slightly bigger baritone" my own personal experience has not borne that out. That said, of course, bass saxes are rare enough that you don't have a lot of opportunities to do good A to B comparisons, with mouthpieces and reeds suited to each horn, and enough time to get accustomed to each horn - like you could do pretty easily on tenors or altos.
 

·
Distinguished Member and Bass Sax Extraordinaire
Joined
·
1,050 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 ·
<snip>
Long wrap for me until some Chinese guy figures out how to make an Eppelsheim knock off.
Really? You would support a company that illegally produces counterfeits?

Think of all the R&D that Benedikt has put into his instruments. A company coming in a ripping off his designs is exactly why so many companies--of all kinds, be it manufacturers of musical instruments, cameras, cars, TVs, audio players, etc. etc.--all end up shuttering their businesses.

Not to mention the workers who are displaced when this happens; the workers who are exploited by working for so little $$ in overseas plants; and the damage to the environment caused by companies operating in countries with next to zero environmental oversight.

Given all this, would you really still support a company producing counterfeits by buying one of their products?

Are the Jinyin basses still for sale somewhere? I'm considering a bass (planning stages,) and despite the so-so reputation of the Jinyin I think I'd rather have a long wrap (I can't imagine I'll miss the F# key.) However, all the store brand options seem to be the short wrap. While I'd prefer the long wrap, I must admit the short wrap from Thomann seems like an awesome deal, so that's my backup option.

Can the long wrap be ordered direct from Jinyin?
There is a reason stores have moved away from Jinyin-made stencils. Overall, they suck. Sorry, it's true.

Years ago I was offered the chance to buy Jinyin-made basses to stencil with my Bassic Sax brand. I took a pass. I won't disclose the price, but it was so little, that I knew they had to be crap. A number of years later I had a chance to finally play one here in Vancouver. I wrote a review about it on my site as part of my series on the Chinese-made basses.

If you really want to buy a bass sax, buy a vintage American-made bass by Buescher or Conn.

If you're extremely lucky, you might be able to find a used Keilwerth--they too are "long wrap", or vintage American style horns.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,682 Posts
If you really want to buy a bass sax, buy a vintage American-made bass by Buescher or Conn.

If you're extremely lucky, you might be able to find a used Keilwerth--they too are "long wrap", or vintage American style horns.
Those are gonna be a little outside my price range. The last Keilwerth bass I saw cost more than my car. This would truly be a "novelty horn" for me. My thought was to get a Jinyin for cheap and put some work into it, see if I could give it a proper setup myself as a learning exercise. In your blog post you said the horn would need about an extra $1000, which depending on the initial price might be worthwhile. Otherwise the Thomann seems like the best bet: low price, good track record on SOTW.
 

·
Distinguished Member and Bass Sax Extraordinaire
Joined
·
1,050 Posts
Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Those are gonna be a little outside my price range. The last Keilwerth bass I saw cost more than my car. This would truly be a "novelty horn" for me. My thought was to get a Jinyin for cheap and put some work into it, see if I could give it a proper setup myself as a learning exercise. In your blog post you said the horn would need about an extra $1000, which depending on the initial price might be worthwhile. Otherwise the Thomann seems like the best bet: low price, good track record on SOTW.
I was very lucky when I got my Couf bass. Yes, it was more than I sold my Buescher for--quite a bit more actually--but the no fuss, no muss, playability makes it worth it for me. I still paid less than what many are selling for. I drive vintage Volvos with Collector plates. When I put the Couf in the Volvo station wagon, I joke that value of the car & contents just doubled. ;) :LOL:

The $1,000 I mention on my site was based on 2016 $. Don't know what it would cost in 2021 $$.

As far as the Thomann goes, are you talking about their short wrap TBB-150? I don't see another style bass on their site. I am surprised that they can offer a Jinbao stencil for so little. Last I checked Jinbao charged more than that for their horns for dealers.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,682 Posts
As far as the Thomann goes, are you talking about their short wrap TBB-150? I don't see another style bass on their site. I am surprised that they can offer a Jinbao stencil for so little. Last I checked Jinbao charged more than that for their horns for dealers.
Yup, that's the one. Selmer-style short wrap, but affordable enough I'm willing to give it a go. Bit of a lead time on them, but I'm nothing if not patient.
 
1 - 10 of 10 Posts
Top