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Yanigasawa S-6 soprano, Yamaha YAS-62 Alto; Selmer Mk VI Tenor; Martin Committee III Baritone
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi,

I’ve read through the various posts and am not looking to restart any old debates on flat vs concave tables. I just picked up a Vintage Series Link Tone Edge and the table is very concave. The table curve resolves very near the facing break and well past the start of the window. It plays okay but maybe not great. I’ve never played a Slant or any high end copy so I don’t have much to compare it too. Opinions?
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I would need to check it in different spots, BUT that is a too big and long concavity for my taste. On my pieces I put concave tables too, but not that deep. When it’s done right, you shouldn’t be seeing any light when looking from the side.

It can leak actually if you put your ligature towards the shank.


AFAIK, JJ Babbitt do that on purpose, though it seem to be killing reeds faster.

Okay-playing may be due to bad curve numbers, that’s another thing.
 

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Yanigasawa S-6 soprano, Yamaha YAS-62 Alto; Selmer Mk VI Tenor; Martin Committee III Baritone
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Not a serious suggestion, but does the tip opening change depending on how hard you clamp the reed with the ligature?
I had to do it multiple times to be sure but yes tightening the lig more does open up the tip ever so slightly.
 

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Yanigasawa S-6 soprano, Yamaha YAS-62 Alto; Selmer Mk VI Tenor; Martin Committee III Baritone
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I had to do it multiple times to be sure but yes tightening the lig more does open up the tip ever so slightly.
I would need to check it in different spots, BUT that is a too big and long concavity for my taste. On my pieces I put concave tables too, but not that deep. When it’s done right, you shouldn’t be seeing any light when looking from the side.

It can leak actually if you put your ligature towards the shank.


AFAIK, JJ Babbitt do that on purpose, though it seem to be killing reeds faster.

Okay-playing may be due to bad curve numbers, that’s another thing.
Thanks, it’s definitely a deeper curve than my stock modern Tone Edge and you can see right though it too.
 

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Researcher, Teacher and Horn Revitalizer, Forum Co
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With the ligature in the middle behind the "break" then the reed would get "bent" and cause playing issues as the reed will then require the embouchure to squeeze it shut to play kinda "normally"

I'm not familiar with Tone Edges but I wouldn't see how that would be normal.
 

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Tables are meant to to be flat. Should not see light passing underneath. I adjust my reeds so that when water-soaked, they are also flat. I will sometimes put a bit of concavity on the mpc table near the window, but that does not extend to the outer edges of the table such that light would pass through from one side to the other.

If someone has found that concave tables are of benefit, more power to them. They also probably think the type of ligature one uses makes a huge difference in their sound ;) (which I don't... and I also don't battle with "bad reeds").
 

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* EDIT* Removed quote of deleted post.
Tell that to ALL Dukoffs and Links from the 40s lol that had it on purpose.

Enjoy.

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And these are exceptionally playing mouthpieces that seal perfectly.
I don’t see anything wrong with concave tables..many pro cats like Sebastian Knox do not too.
Once the reed warps, and it always does, it has room to warp, while on your flat tables, the side parts will lift up and a leak will appear.

If the sh’t’s made right, it works. On OP’s piece it’s made the wrong way as I stated above.
 

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King Zephyr Tenor, YTS 82ZIIB
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I too bought an Otto Link vintage series Tone Edge recently and mine does not have a concave table.
The table is flat and plays great. Great for me is highly subjective as I am re-tread horn player having picked it up a few months ago after many years of non play.
Peace
 

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I used to design chilling blocks for CPUs/GPUs (-160 C triple stage cooling) and one of the ways to assure a perfect seal under pressure was to hit the block after machining to have a concave surface that, under pressure adjusted perfectly to the mating target. So yes, I am with you but there is an art to that and a limit.
 

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Yes, you’re accepting facts, not my views. These exceptionally playing mouthpieces have concave tables off the factory, and they work.

If you prefer flat tables, that is totally fine with me, and I know a lot of cats who do also, but saying that something is “none sense” just because you think it’s wrong or do not like it, is nonsense.
 

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Lateral concavity (as shown in your images) doesn’t have the adverse effect on reed lay in the same way that longitudinal concavity does (as shown in the image from the OP).
 

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Lateral concavity (as shown in your images) doesn’t have the adverse effect on reed lay in the same way that longitudinal concavity does (as shown in the image from the OP).
I don‘t think I‘ve ever said that the concavity on OP’s photos was right, have I?

These pieces all have that longitudinal concavity, but only in the middle of the table - by the sides it straightens out. That’s the point, that’s why it works.
 

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The point to be taken from the discussion is that the direction of concavity matters and that it is not desirable along the length as shown by the OP.
 

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Maybe manufacturers intentionally made them concave because flat it too finicky to acheive. I think that for various reasons, when dragging a peice across an abrasive on a flat surface, there is a natural tendency for more material to come off around the perimeters than in the center, leaving the table convex which is real bad.

In my experience, dead flat and concave do not leak but convex is an obvious and emediate problem. It's possible that they were taking reed warpage into consideration, but it's just as likely that mass producing with a slight convavity elliminates the possibility of a convex table and gives an overall better success rate.
 

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They are not intentionally concave. They are left concave because they still play well enough with a concave table. They are concave because the facings are milled and done quickly. They are "allowed" to be convex because this gives the cut off material some place to go. So its not a goal, its an exception. I prefer not to make that exception.
 
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