Sax on the Web Forum banner

1 - 20 of 67 Posts

·
Moderator
Grafton alto | Martin Comm III tenor
Joined
·
28,951 Posts
I agree, although I believe the term funk was used earlier than most people think, ie predating what most people think of - AWB, Tower of Power, James Brown etc. But I think it was more the bluesier soul jazz (maybe latin influenced ) straight 8s of the early 60s.

But no So What IMO.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,324 Posts
What is the purpose of putting everything into little drawers with labels. If So What has elements that conform to Funk, then regardless off the official creation of funk, you may think of it as such. Some of these discussions remind me of Mel Brooks history of the world, asking for novocain and being told it has not been invented yet ... That is just my ignorant opinion but my cello teacher used to show me / play me pieces by Bach that with just slightly changed bow technique sounded like Rock'n Roll, so all the elements were there and my teacher (RIP) was pretty adamant that Bach already invented it and everything later was just adding some refinements - and a new name of course.

Also, the question asked by OP was whether there was a funk FEEL ... :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,800 Posts
Also, the question asked by OP was whether there was a funk FEEL ... :)

Answer is still NO!

Here goes one of those stupid threads with future 862 replies, 75% of them pseudo-psychological, convoluted, run-on garbage...............................*******vomits early on********
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
547 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
Here are my arguments:

1. The classical swing hierarchy consists of a melodic pulse in eights, bass pulse in quarters and harmonic pulse in halves. However, if we compare "So What" with the sample "Jordu", then with the similarity of melodic rhythm and bass, there is no pulse of harmony - it is static, despite the walking bass in improvisation. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QuAh7_JcMTM

If you put "Jordu" 2 times faster, you will hear that harmony starts walking like a bass at the original tempo .

2. Since in "So What" there is no every bar active harmonic rhythm , the tune does not require from the bass *walking rhythm in a quarters. Therefore, I allowed myself to imagine the melody as a sequence of sixteenths , without canceling the swing feel.

3.The next step : the extraction of system of accents, explicit and hidden, inside the melody and and around. Their synthesis is on the percussion line.

View attachment 236898

Is the result NOT a funk?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,587 Posts
You’re not seeing the forest from the trees.

Here are my arguments:

1. The classical swing hierarchy consists of a melodic pulse in eights, bass pulse in quarters and harmonic pulse in halves. However, if we compare "So What" with the sample "Jordu", then with the similarity of melodic rhythm and bass, there is no pulse of harmony - it is static, despite the walking bass in improvisation. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QuAh7_JcMTM

If you put "Jordu" 2 times faster, you will hear that harmony starts walking like a bass at the original tempo .

2. Since in "So What" there is no every bar active harmonic rhythm , the tune does not require from the bass *walking rhythm in a quarters. Therefore, I allowed myself to imagine the melody as a sequence of sixteenths , without canceling the swing feel.

3.The next step : the extraction of system of accents, explicit and hidden, inside the melody and and around. Their synthesis is on the percussion line.

View attachment 236898

Is the result NOT a funk?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
547 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
The cymbal beat goes ting ting ga ting. It's swing.

Swing music and a swing tune are totally different things.
Yes, you are right: this is the swing rhythm, but this is alte sachen , and does not correspond to the tune. Outside is 1959 , the period of general restructuring of the groove begins *from swing 4/4 to the feeling of 8/8, warmed up by Rhythm and Blues and latin music . There are examples of "Sketches of Spain" by Gil Evans, "Stand By Me" Ben. E. King (from the secondary unimportant party of drums , less than percussion), "Watermelon Man" by Hancock, and others. During this period, records appeared where 4/4(shuffle) and 8/8 collide, for example Hank Ballard, “The Twist” or The Beatles "Love Me Do" .
 

·
SOTW Columnist, Distinguished SOTW Member
Joined
·
23,026 Posts
No, I wouldn't call "So What" a funk tune, at least not given my understanding of the term. It does have plenty of "soul" though!
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member
Joined
·
3,223 Posts
Answer is still NO!

Here goes one of those stupid threads with future 862 replies, 75% of them pseudo-psychological, convoluted, run-on garbage...............................*******vomits early on********
Who are YOU to say it's not?? My brother's friend's cousin's dog's aunt's buddy heard from a guy's cousin's girlfriend that it was indeed a funk tune. If that ain't proof, I don't know what is.
 
1 - 20 of 67 Posts
Top