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I know it's a silly question, but I have no real training in music appreciation or styles. I just started sax about 7 months ago. People ask me "Do you like jazz?" or "What kind jazz do you listen to?"

Not sure of the answer. Mostly I like the classic big band sounds like Benny Goodman, Glen Miller etc. Lately I've been listening to Big Bad Voodoo Daddy ever since I heard Mr. Pinstripe Suit at my daughter dance recital. It blew me away!
 

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i believe some jazz songs are labeled as swing rhythms. The tempo and style is a bit "dance" in this kind of music ......I think.
 

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mostly yes swing is considered jazz,
although if you think about it some classical tunes are slightly swung but not with the same emphasis as jazz swing.
i can't think of an example off the top of my head but i know they exist
 

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Is New Orleans/Traditional/Dixieland considered jazz? Yes? Then swing is too.

Surprisingly, some people don't consider swing to be jazz. There was jazz before bebop.
 

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Bird said...

It don't mean a thing, if it ain't got that thing! (swing) rhythm, backbeat, time-feel, the notion, it's the ocean, see im a typical hiphop scene looney ecstasy seeking realized being. Haha, just kidding.

Now's the time!
 

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Agent27 said:
Is New Orleans/Traditional/Dixieland considered jazz? Yes? Then swing is too.

Surprisingly, some people don't consider swing to be jazz. There was jazz before bebop.
That's right. And people used to dance to it. Back then, jazz didn't have intellectual connotations.
 

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Consider this as a non-answer to your question, but my parents danced to the music of Benny Goodman, Glen Miller, the Dorseys, and other swing bands of the era; however, they said they didn't really care for "jazz" because you couldn't dance to it... hmmmm. At the time, I was really hooked on Kenton, and their comments were pretty much aimed at him, but I didn't ask how they thought of Duke Ellington and probably should have since his music went both ways. I'm ambivalent. At different times I've thought jazz was different things. I had the same problem with Rock 'n Roll... I guess maybe I always thought of those classifications by where I was musically at the time. That's probably why I don't choke on the term "smooth jazz". I'd say if it's jazz to you, then it's jazz. I doesn't really care what you call it, someone else is going to disagree with you anyway. As for my personal opinion, Benny Goodman's music was "swing" played by real jazzmen. Same was true for many of the others. I personally ascribe to the feeling that if it ain't got that swing, it's not terribly good jazz.
 

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danarsenault said:
In many, if not most cases, yes.
I agree; and for me the criterion is this: are players given space for improvising, individually or collectively? If they are, then it's jazz.
 

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Yes, it's probably the purest form of jazz there is, the form that old Satchmo himself is usually credited as introducing to the art form back in the mid 1920's.

What ISN'T jazz to me is all this modern stuff that you hear on so-called jazz stations today. I'm not talking about smooth jazz, which I don't consider to be jazz at all. I'm talking about these lifeless numbers that usually feature a piano and some singer that you hear on public radio stations these days...or even recent stuff by Bergonzi or Lovano (or insert name of Trane-inspired saxophonist here).

I recently thought to myself while listening to this modern music, is this stuff jazz or some kind of ambient new age music? It's kind of hard to tell the difference with a lot of it anymore. And much of it is just plain boring--not exactly pushing the envelope a la Trane. Like they're not even copying Trane anymore. They're copying some other guy who copied Trane.

I respect Trane for his intensity and dedication to the music all all, but one of the reasons I've always like Rollins better is because he's never stopped swinging, never stopped having fun with it.

Yes, to me it is very true: "It don't mean a thing if it ain't got that swing...."
 

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This thread is taking on the look of a love-fest for swing.
 

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Definition of Swing music

Reedsplinter said:
I agree; and for me the criterion is this: are players given space for improvising, individually or collectively? If they are, then it's jazz.
I found the following definitions to Swing:

"Swing music, also known as swing jazz, is a form of jazz music that developed during the 1920s when people got together and had solidified as a distinctive style by 1935 in the United States. Swing is distinguished primarily by a strong rhythm section, usually including double bass and drums, medium to fast tempo, and the distinctive swing time rhythm that is common to many forms of jazz."

However, what is Jazz? I tried to find out a definition for it, but there seems to be no consensus on that. Duke Ellington summed it up by saying, "It's all music." Some critics have even stated that Ellington's music was not in fact jazz, as by its very definition, according to them, jazz cannot be orchestrated. I kind of agree with that, too...

Personally speaking - and I am just an amateur here - I would say that Swing is sub-genre of Jazz not fulfilling all the characteristics commonly associated with the main genre. To summurize my opinion, I will just quote Wikipedia here:

"What is now called swing diverged from other jazz music in ways that distinguished it as a form in its own right."
 

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jrvinson45 said:
This thread is taking on the look of a love-fest for swing.
Works for me!

Is it jazz?
short answer: Yes.
longer answer: It depends who's "swingin".
- Lawrence Welk: I'd say no.
- Zoot Sims (and most people): I'd say yes.
 

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JL said:
Is bebop jazz? Is jazz....jazz?
It all depends on how you define "jazz".

 
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