It's perfectly possible to play beautiful lower register on a high baffle piece. However, if it's not working for you, then -- assuming you're sure your horn is in good condition (a tiny leak anywhere on the instrument can interfere with the lower register) -- you ought to try out something else. If I were you, I'd take my horn to the local sax shop and try out as many different mouthpieces as possible. If you don't find something that helps, then the mouthpiece is not the problem.
High Baffle = Difficult Low Register?
I've been Guardala pieces over the years: Studio, King, Super King...seems to have settled on high-baffled metal tenor pieces...but it seems that I'm still not very satisfied with my low register response, esp. subtoning and playing at low volumes.
Do I have to switch to lower-baffled pieces to address this issue? Do lower baffles equal better response at the low registers?
Advice? I'm trying to avoid GAS...pls help.
Do I have to switch to lower-baffled pieces to address this issue? Do lower baffles equal better response at the low registers?
Advice? I'm trying to avoid GAS...pls help.
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What reeds are you playing?
You can get these low notes easier with a softer reed.
You can get these low notes easier with a softer reed.
It depends on the high baffle piece. I used to play a Dukoff D7 on tenor, and the low register was always thin (but not difficult to play). I changed to an RPC high baffle piece, and get a nice, fat low register.
That's what I mean: it's not the high baffle per se.
The RPC is a great piece in all registers, for me anyway.
The RPC is a great piece in all registers, for me anyway.
It should be noted that the baffle is a tremendously touchy area to get "just right" (whatever that may be in each player's mind), and too much baffle in the wrong place can indeed make the low notes thinner and less responsive.
Painting all high baffle mouthpieces with the same brush in terms of general playing traits is like the old apples to oranges cliché.
Painting all high baffle mouthpieces with the same brush in terms of general playing traits is like the old apples to oranges cliché.
A very good point, that should be made more often!SAXISMYAXE said:Painting all high baffle mouthpieces with the same brush in terms of general playing traits is like the old apples to oranges cliché.
For the love of god please dump the hideous DG pieces and come back to the pieces that the greats were using back in the 50's and 60's. None of those guys were playing anything but large chamber pieces, and they still have the gold standard when it comes to a beautiful tone.
I didn't want to come right out and say that. . . .heath said:For the love of god please dump the hideous DG pieces and come back to the pieces that the greats were using back in the 50's and 60's. None of those guys were playing anything but large chamber pieces, and they still have the gold standard when it comes to a beautiful tone.
I had some difficulty with Guardala mouthpieces, I'm not surprised you are having problems low down. I'm also finding that an RPC does the trick, all the advantages of high baffle, but still very versatile and easy to get big fat low subtones.
I find that Dukoff baffles are usually too high near the tip rail for good low note response. But Guardalas are not too high. There is no hump near the tip.
The facing curves are decent on the LTs. I can usually adjust them to be even more responsive. I charge 1/2 a reface job for this.
The facing curves are decent on the LTs. I can usually adjust them to be even more responsive. I charge 1/2 a reface job for this.
Depends what kind of music you are playing...I don't want to sound like a guy from the 50s if I'm playing smooth jazz or even most funk...heath said:For the love of god please dump the hideous DG pieces and come back to the pieces that the greats were using back in the 50's and 60's. None of those guys were playing anything but large chamber pieces, and they still have the gold standard when it comes to a beautiful tone.
Link snob alert!!! Link snob alert!!!heath said:For the love of god please dump the hideous DG pieces and come back to the pieces that the greats were using back in the 50's and 60's. None of those guys were playing anything but large chamber pieces, and they still have the gold standard when it comes to a beautiful tone.
high baffle/low note trouble
I have a ponzol M2 with a 110 tip opening that i like a lot but I have some trouble with the low notes. Mojo or any other refacers out there; is this something that can be corrected?
I have a ponzol M2 with a 110 tip opening that i like a lot but I have some trouble with the low notes. Mojo or any other refacers out there; is this something that can be corrected?
I admit to being a Link snob myself (absolutely my favorite Tenor MP designs), but I also realize the wisdom of "different strokes for different folks".wersax said:Link snob alert!!! Link snob alert!!!
I've played mouthpieces with any variety and combinations of Chambers/facings/baffles, and winners/losers can be found among all the basic types.
I have the identical Ponzol and mine is great in all registers. There is alot to be said for checking for leaks unless you just got one that needs tweeked a little, which for a Ponzol is extremely rare.DannyZ said:I have a ponzol M2 with a 110 tip opening that i like a lot but I have some trouble with the low notes. Mojo or any other refacers out there; is this something that can be corrected?
This link provides some information about the different types of baffles and their effect upon the sound and how the mouthpiece plays. http://www.theowanne.com/mouthpieces101/baffle.php
Because the saxophone (like the oboe) is a conical instrument, the first resonances (fundamental frequencies) of the lowest notes are weaker to begin with. http://www.phys.unsw.edu.au/~jw/saxacoustics.html When a high baffle mouthpiece strengthens the upper harmonics to produce a brighter-edgier tone at the expense of the fundamental the result will be that the low tones will be even harder to produce especially at softer playing levels.
The last 2 charts in this mouthpiece materials experiment clearly show the difference in the sound spectrum produced by a tenor sax mouthpiece with a higher and lower baffle. http://hal9000.ps.uci.edu/Does Saxophone Mouthpiece Material Matter.doc.pdf
John
Because the saxophone (like the oboe) is a conical instrument, the first resonances (fundamental frequencies) of the lowest notes are weaker to begin with. http://www.phys.unsw.edu.au/~jw/saxacoustics.html When a high baffle mouthpiece strengthens the upper harmonics to produce a brighter-edgier tone at the expense of the fundamental the result will be that the low tones will be even harder to produce especially at softer playing levels.
The last 2 charts in this mouthpiece materials experiment clearly show the difference in the sound spectrum produced by a tenor sax mouthpiece with a higher and lower baffle. http://hal9000.ps.uci.edu/Does Saxophone Mouthpiece Material Matter.doc.pdf
John
All kidding aside, I'm right with ya........darylSAXISMYAXE said:I admit to being a Link snob myself (absolutely my favorite Tenor MP designs), but I also realize the wisdom of "different strokes for different folks".
I've played mouthpieces with any variety and combinations of Chambers/facings/baffles, and winners/losers can be found among all the basic types.
And none of them were trying to be heard over guitar and keyboard players going through the PA or a Marshall stack.heath said:For the love of god please dump the hideous DG pieces and come back to the pieces that the greats were using back in the 50's and 60's. None of those guys were playing anything but large chamber pieces, and they still have the gold standard when it comes to a beautiful tone.
My experience is similar to the others. I used to have a Dukoff D7 that was fantastic to play except for the lower end. My DG Studio has a reasonably high baffle and a great bottom end, subtones are a piece of cake.
I believe high baffle pieces often have a long facing to help the lower register speak freely.
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