Sax on the Web Forum banner

1 - 20 of 31 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
86 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hi all! I am currently trying to find a new piece because the piece I am playing right now is just to dark for my taste now. I am a huge fan of Trane, Wayne shorter, Waltz Weiskopf and earlier Brecker (70s). I know all those guys used a Link STM and I really like that tone but all the vintage Links I have trialed or tested at the store just don't sit with me well because I am so accustomed to playing my rubber piece, My intonation is bad, I am squeaking, a lot and Its just not comfortable, I even had one of the pieces for almost three weeks! At this point I just want to practice more and be comfortable rather than trying to adjust or get discouraged with my playing due to new gear. But I really like the tone of A STM. I talked to my instructor and he agreed I should do that and even suggested I check out the Mouthpiece Cafe Slant Supreme (the one with Bergonzi on it) based on my influences. Do you think that is a good suggestion or do you have any others?? Thanks!!
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member, Forum Contributor 2015-
Joined
·
32,933 Posts
I am concerned about your squeaking issues - either you have some embouchure issues, or you played some really bad mouthpieces. Did your instructor check out the setup on the STM? Could it be a reed issue?

The Slant Supreme is based on the Link HR mouthpiece - not a HR homage to an STM. FWIW, Shorter also played HR Links (not just STM). Both Bergonzi and Shorter play on pretty open setups; Coltrane played a relatively close setup.

How long have you been playing? What setup?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
86 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
I am concerned about your squeaking issues - either you have some embouchure issues, or you played some really bad mouthpieces. Did your instructor check out the setup on the STM? Could it be a reed issue?

The Slant Supreme is based on the Link HR mouthpiece - not a HR homage to an STM. FWIW, Shorter also played HR Links (not just STM). Both Bergonzi and Shorter play on pretty open setups.

How long have you been playing? What setup?
Ive been playing for 8 years now, I didn't squeak that much after I got used to it but it would just be occasional and it really bugged me, the tip opening was a 6 and I was using a 3.5 rico royal, I normally play a 7* with a 3 reed so maybe that was it but I just think I would prefer to use a rubber piece honestly so I am just looking for suggestions on a piece. Thanks.
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member, Forum Contributor 2015-
Joined
·
32,933 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
200 Posts
Some suggestions:


Morgan "Jazz", "M", "L" chamber (the Excaliber can be a bit more edgy).

https://www.morganmouthpieces.com/collections/all/tenor-saxophone-mouthpieces
On the Morgans...you will want to check the Jazz Florida (inspired by Slant Link), Jazz Indiana (inspired by Early Babbitt Link) or the Excalibur Florida / Excalibur Indiana. The Jazz Models are standard size body pieces and the Excalibur Models are streamline body pieces. All of them are made from a 100% rubber formula from the 1940s/1950s...no synthetic fillers.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,611 Posts
I think Phil-tone's Sapphire might be my favorite Link-style HR piece. Although I think I read that Phil is in the process of redesigning that one?

I actually have a Solstice (.105 tip) that I'd be willing to sell pretty cheaply. PM if interested. But you can't have my Sapphire unless you pry it from my cold dead fingers.
 

·
Distinguished SOTW Member, Forum Contributor 2015-
Joined
·
32,933 Posts
Argggh, thanks for that MLucky! “Sapphire” is what I was thinking when my tired fingers typed “Solstice”. I had a Solstice on alto before I switched to an Intrepid on that as well.

I have his second generation Sapphire on my sop. Wonderful work!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,027 Posts
Squeaking usually comes the sax having a leak or possibly your mouthpiece doesn’t have a flat table.
Try wetting the reed where it hits the table before you play.
If you like those sounds you mentioned, you’re pretty much stuck with an STM. Nothing else will come close. The Brecker Lonk sound has always been one of those things stuck in my head. I tried a friend’s Double Ring Link the other day that screamed 70’s Brecker. It’s the only one I’ve played out of three or four I’ve tried that was that good. Hopefully, he’ll sell it to me.
Keep looking. You may have to buy and sell a few but you’ll eventually find one.
 

·
Forum Contributor 2016-17
Joined
·
482 Posts
I've wondered about this before as well. All of the mouthpieces recommended above are inspired or based on hard rubber Link mouthpieces. The mouthpiece manufacturers who make both styles of pieces - Phil Tone or Morgan Fry - may have some suggestions here. If I recall correctly, the hard rubber Link pieces, with the exception of the Reso Chamber, all have smaller chambers than the STMs.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
538 Posts
The list of guys you like: Trane, Shorter, Weiskopf and Brecker does suggest that the sound in your head might like the help of an STM to help coax it out. If you can find a great example of a medium or small tipped STM, they play fantastically well, play in tune and do everything you'll want. However they are hard to find, because the pool of vintage pieces has been picked over for up to 70 years...but sometimes you get lucky. As for adjusting to an STM, get a good one and keep playing it until one day you feel adjusted.
The four guys you mentioned, arguably used STM Links at the top of their game's, but they were all specific signature setups, with very particular STM and reed combinations.
Weiskopf for example, as you may know, uses a close tip EB STM 5* which measures stock at .085, he plays that with a Rico/ D'Addario 3s reed. This is an incredibly free blowing set up, but the ease, the lack of effort and struggle required to play it, appears to free the man up to create interesting musical ideas and an interesting tone. His face and throat are totally relaxed and open, because no strain is needed with this combination of mouthpiece and reed.
The other three guys mentioned had equally specific equipment which nudged them on their way.
If perchance you wanted to take the Weiskopf route (and already owned a mkvi horn), I have a particularly excellent 100% original EB 5* STM which I could sell, it wouldn't be cheap but it is exceptionally good. It is an original EB picked out by a top NY pro in the 1970s. It wouldn't surprise me if it's better than Weiskopf's one. Anyway shameless sales spiel aside, it is a very fine playing original EB STM. As much as I benefit from the services of some of the terrific refacers on this site, I have never played a refaced EB STM that was the equal of the best of the originals, they have a unique voice and response, but they are very hard to find. Of course regardless of how good my piece is, it may or may not solve your problems:)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,795 Posts
Lamberson L model hard rubber tenor. Info from the website:

L (tenor only)

This is my traditional jazz mouthpiece. The bore and baffle are a copy of a 1950's metal Link that Pharoh Sanders gave me. It has evolved somewhat over the years, but is still as close as I get to the old Link sound.
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
17,273 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
361 Posts
The list of guys you like: ...Weiskopf.
Weiskopf for example, as you may know, uses a close tip EB STM 5* which measures stock at .085, he plays that with a Rico/ D'Addario 3s reed. This is an incredibly free blowing set up, but the ease, the lack of effort and struggle required to play it, appears to free the man up to create interesting musical ideas and an interesting tone.
I spend a lot of time with Walt's instructional video series--Jazz Conception Workshop, and Master Class Rhythm Changes, Scales and Arpeggios, and Blues--trying to model after his tone which is nearly perfectly what I'd like to sound like. These are great because the audio is high quality and he is playing scales or simple lines at an assessable tempo to hear nuances in tone.

He mentions his MP opening and reed strength in the Workshop video, but I didn't know what scale was used (changed in 70s? with Babbitt) nor the actual opening, thanks! I'd still like to know if the facing is today's medium curve or an alternate used back in the small-tip era. But seriously, how contrarian when so many Redman-or-younger are using 9* and even 10* with 4 reeds or stronger. Wonder what Walt plays with Steely Dan?

I alternate between Phil-tone metal Tribute 7* .105" and HR Sapphire 7 .100". Throwing a small tip size into the stew is confounding. I guess I need to go to a symposium where I can try some and see if they are at all something I can play. On alto I tried a few smaller Jody Jazz HR* pieces and I was just blowing them closed with the 2.75 reeds I was using.

Most of the time I'm at peace with the fantastic gear I already have and work hard to simply sound better on it, and I do make progress. But then in moments of distraction I wonder about the mouthpiece at the end of the rainbow...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
86 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
On the Morgans...you will want to check the Jazz Florida (inspired by Slant Link), Jazz Indiana (inspired by Early Babbitt Link) or the Excalibur Florida / Excalibur Indiana. The Jazz Models are standard size body pieces and the Excalibur Models are streamline body pieces. All of them are made from a 100% rubber formula from the 1940s/1950s...no synthetic fillers.
Cool, thanks for the info!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
86 Posts
Discussion Starter #18
Squeaking usually comes the sax having a leak or possibly your mouthpiece doesn’t have a flat table.
Try wetting the reed where it hits the table before you play.
If you like those sounds you mentioned, you’re pretty much stuck with an STM. Nothing else will come close. The Brecker Lonk sound has always been one of those things stuck in my head. I tried a friend’s Double Ring Link the other day that screamed 70’s Brecker. It’s the only one I’ve played out of three or four I’ve tried that was that good. Hopefully, he’ll sell it to me.
Keep looking. You may have to buy and sell a few but you’ll eventually find one.
I actually just got my sax serviced so I don't think it was a leak, I think it is more I am just more comfortable with rubber. Hope you get your hands on that Double Ring! :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
86 Posts
Discussion Starter #20
Lamberson L model hard rubber tenor. Info from the website:

L (tenor only)

This is my traditional jazz mouthpiece. The bore and baffle are a copy of a 1950's metal Link that Pharoh Sanders gave me. It has evolved somewhat over the years, but is still as close as I get to the old Link sound.
This piece looks great, Ill contact him for more info!
 
1 - 20 of 31 Posts
Top