guardala mb question..
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466 Posts
Im pretty sure D G means Dave Guardala and MB means the Michael Brecker model but I don't know what the number means.
Guardala
Does it have the pink bite plate and the cross hatch marks in the baffle area? The tip should be around .112 ~ .115. Can you post a picture of it and we could tell you MUCH more?bbbouklas said:Hi, I am to buy a guardala silverplated mb tenor mpc that is inscribed
"D
G"
and
"MB
4320"
is it one of the early handmade models? tip opening?
I would appreciate any help..
thanx
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706 Posts
sorry I don't have a pic, a friend just sent me an email that he is selling it and he doesn't really have more info on the piece.. I will ask him to send a pic and then I'll post it..
I don't think that it could be a laser trimmed model, those don't have serials, or do they??
thanx again
I don't think that it could be a laser trimmed model, those don't have serials, or do they??
thanx again
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2,294 Posts
DG means Dave Guardala, MB means Michael Brecker, and 4320 is the serial number.bbbouklas said:Hi, I am to buy a guardala silverplated mb tenor mpc that is inscribed
"D
G"
and
"MB
4320"
is it one of the early handmade models? tip opening?
I would appreciate any help..
thanx
That would make it one of the earlier handmade, original Brecker models - the one everybody seems to want!
Try it, and if you like it, buy it! But don't buy it just because it's what it is, especially if it's expensive. And if it's silly money, don't buy it anyway!
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2,892 Posts
All the Sup Kings I ever saw were .120-.125. The bad info comes fromm WWBW. For some reason they changed the #'s on the Guradala tip openings, I think it was around 2000. I even called thinking there had been a change from Guardala, but the Woodwind "specialist" didn't even know about it; apparently it's a typo noone ever caught. Kind of amazing really. If you look at an old enough WWBW catalog, you'll see MB, .115, MB II, .117, King, .119, etc..........daryl
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15,569 Posts
Mouthpiece tip charts are just a close idea of what they should be. I have had original Bergs and Links that arent that close in tip size to what these charts say they should be...but they were original. Along the same lines...mouthpiece value charts are just an approximation too.
Theo's mouthpiece value chart in MANY ways, is WAY off in value. Alot of guys look at his chart as THE referrence, and now many pieces have double or tripled in perceived value, and others are way lower in value on his chart than they actually go for in todays market. Mouthpiece tip opening charts are closer to reality...but not always acurate either.
Guardala would make custom pieces for guys all the time and put whatever tips the buyer requested on those pieces. I have had MB's that measure .107-.122 and were all original. Dave told me that guys would want the pieces but would want them a little bigger or smaller than how he made them, and he would customize them for the buyer.
"I want a Brecker, but I want the tip around .120, "cause I like to play a 9 tip." Stuff like this happened all the time Dave told me. So now many of his pieces are floating around that came right from Dave's shop originally with different tips than whats published on these tip opening charts. Also, alot of pieces he'd bring around to various shows, were quite different from the ones you read about. ALOT of prototypes of his are floating around, that were original from Dave. I think Theo and others have done a good job overall, but there are variables and market swings that make alot of whats written, something to take with a grain of salt.
I've been asked many times to put out charts on mouthpiece comparisons, and values...but its a double edged sword, and it would do more harm than good, in my opinion. What I hear as to the difference in two pieces...you may not hear at all, and not agree with my findings.
One time Bergonzi came over my house looking for mouthpieces, and he heard me on a piece that I thought would be perfect for him, and he said it sounded too bright for his taste. I washed out the piece, he tried it...and loved it! It sounded Way darker for him than it did for me. Thus, describing comparisons between pieces is too subjective to be accurate.
Mouthpiece values fluctuate so much too. I have seen original Slant 8 tenors go for $750-$1550, depending on how the market is at a certain time. I have also had original Link Slant 6's that can measure .088-.096 opposed to the .090 they are said to have had if they were original.
Just a few thoughts from a guy that has seen ALOT of mouthpieces.
Theo's mouthpiece value chart in MANY ways, is WAY off in value. Alot of guys look at his chart as THE referrence, and now many pieces have double or tripled in perceived value, and others are way lower in value on his chart than they actually go for in todays market. Mouthpiece tip opening charts are closer to reality...but not always acurate either.
Guardala would make custom pieces for guys all the time and put whatever tips the buyer requested on those pieces. I have had MB's that measure .107-.122 and were all original. Dave told me that guys would want the pieces but would want them a little bigger or smaller than how he made them, and he would customize them for the buyer.
"I want a Brecker, but I want the tip around .120, "cause I like to play a 9 tip." Stuff like this happened all the time Dave told me. So now many of his pieces are floating around that came right from Dave's shop originally with different tips than whats published on these tip opening charts. Also, alot of pieces he'd bring around to various shows, were quite different from the ones you read about. ALOT of prototypes of his are floating around, that were original from Dave. I think Theo and others have done a good job overall, but there are variables and market swings that make alot of whats written, something to take with a grain of salt.
I've been asked many times to put out charts on mouthpiece comparisons, and values...but its a double edged sword, and it would do more harm than good, in my opinion. What I hear as to the difference in two pieces...you may not hear at all, and not agree with my findings.
One time Bergonzi came over my house looking for mouthpieces, and he heard me on a piece that I thought would be perfect for him, and he said it sounded too bright for his taste. I washed out the piece, he tried it...and loved it! It sounded Way darker for him than it did for me. Thus, describing comparisons between pieces is too subjective to be accurate.
Mouthpiece values fluctuate so much too. I have seen original Slant 8 tenors go for $750-$1550, depending on how the market is at a certain time. I have also had original Link Slant 6's that can measure .088-.096 opposed to the .090 they are said to have had if they were original.
Just a few thoughts from a guy that has seen ALOT of mouthpieces.
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2,892 Posts
You make some good points, Mark, and you should know, considering all the pieces that you've seen and the fact that you measure them yourself.10mfan said:Mouthpiece tip charts are just a close idea of what they should be. I have had original Bergs and Links that aren't that close in tip size to what these charts say they should be...but they were original. Along the same lines...mouthpiece value charts are just an approximation too.
Theo's mouthpiece value chart in MANY ways, is WAY off in value. A lot of guys look at his chart as THE reference, and now many pieces have double or tripled in perceived value, and others are way lower in value on his chart than they actually go for in todays market. Mouthpiece tip opening charts are closer to reality...but not always accurate either.
Guardala would make custom pieces for guys all the time and put whatever tips the buyer requested on those pieces. I have had MB's that measure .107-.122 and were all original. Dave told me that guys would want the pieces but would want them a little bigger or smaller than how he made them, and he would customize them for the buyer.
"I want a Brecker, but I want the tip around .120, "cause I like to play a 9 tip." Stuff like this happened all the time Dave told me. So now many of his pieces are floating around that came right from Dave's shop originally with different tips than whats published on these tip opening charts. Also, a lot of pieces he'd bring around to various shows, were quite different from the ones you read about. ALOT of prototypes of his are floating around, that were original from Dave. I think Theo and others have done a good job overall, but there are variables and market swings that make a lot of whats written, something to take with a grain of salt.
I've been asked many times to put out charts on mouthpiece comparisons, and values...but its a double edged sword, and it would do more harm than good, in my opinion. What I hear as to the difference in two pieces...you may not hear at all, and not agree with my findings.
One time Bergonzi came over my house looking for mouthpieces, and he heard me on a piece that I thought would be perfect for him, and he said it sounded too bright for his taste. I washed out the piece, he tried it...and loved it! It sounded Way darker for him than it did for me. Thus, describing comparisons between pieces is too subjective to be accurate.
Mouthpiece values fluctuate so much too. I have seen original Slant 8 tenors go for $750-$1550, depending on how the market is at a certain time. I have also had original Link Slant 6's that can measure .088-.096 opposed to the .090 they are said to have had if they were original.
Just a few thoughts from a guy that has seen ALOT of mouthpieces.
Obviously, charts don't take into account custom made mouthpieces, or customized ones either. My point earlier was that the Guardala mouthpieces made for WWBW were around the size that old WWBW chart stated, not the current one, and that the guys at WWBW don't have a clue about all that.
Manufacturers guidelines for tip opening seem to be a very ball park figure only, with some of them, Berg Larsen for example, due to lax standards and Guardalas, due to custom orders, all over the place. You don't really know what you've got tip-wise unless you get it measured.
Of course the real bottom line is, who cares what the tip opening is if it works for you, but it sure would be easier to find pieces you like if it the finishing were more consistent......daryl
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