[Lewis_Moon]

Dumb question from a beginner: Are the keys (and general ergonomics) more spread out on a tenor in comparison to an alto? I'm learning on my daughter's hand-me-down '80s King 613 alto and it seems more than a bit squeezy for big, basketball palming hands. Especially the right pinky table...which seems like it's in a really awkward spot.
I'm asking because I will be in the market for a sax of my own, and while I like the alto sound, my hands aren't getting any smaller.

 

[Reet McVouty]

You just have big hands that's all there is to it. I can't speak to the King 613 because I've never played one. However, my Yamaha tenor and alto have the same spread on the upper and lower stack keys. There will always be some difference on the side and palm keys because the tube itself is bigger on tenor than alto, but not so much that it should deter you one way or the other.

 

[milandro]

I have rather large hands and I can play soprano and have played sopranino too, yes they are smaller saxophones but physically possible to “ handle” .

 

[Lewis_Moon]

You just have big hands that's all there is to it. I can't speak to the King 613 because I've never played one. However, my Yamaha tenor and alto have the same spread on the upper and lower stack keys. There will always be some difference on the side and palm keys because the tube itself is bigger on tenor than alto, but not so much that it should deter you one way or the other.

Data I can use. Thanks.

 

[LostConn]

Dumb question from a beginner: Are the keys (and general ergonomics) more spread out on a tenor in comparison to an alto?

Maybe just a little, depending on the model, but certainly not in proportion to the difference in size of the horns. The idea is that any saxophonist should be able to play, reasonably comfortably, anything from soprano to baritone. (Maybe the other sizes too, but they're much rarer, so it's less justifiable to generalize about them.) People's hands don't change sizes from horn to horn, so the manufacturers do their best to standardize the key layouts. I do find the spread on my Yanagisawa curved soprano to be slightly tighter than on my Yanagisawa tenor, but it's not a big deal.

Different makes of horns do differ somewhat in their spread/layout. E.g., Keilwerths, and the Selmer Mark VII, have the reputation of being designed for larger hands.

 

[GaSax]

Just pick one and start learning it! Practice as much as you can and once you have a good understanding of the basics then start looking at upgrading.

Big or small you'll learn to adapt with time. Short, small people play Baritone Sax and big and tall people play Alto and Soprano. They all adapted to it and you can too with practice.

 

[Grumps]

Dumb question from a beginner: Are the keys (and general ergonomics) more spread out on a tenor in comparison to an alto?

Most student horns are gonna put the squeeze on big hands, even if they're baritone saxophones (looking at you YBS-52!). Think I mentioned in one of your other threads that's probably why I prefer vintage American horns over modern "ergonomically correct" horns (even pro horns) that seem to want to jam my fingers in places they're not comfortable. Even some tenors I don't like, including vintage American, as I not only have rather large hands, but somewhat offset pinkies. I've never been comfortable with the closeness of the G# key to the G key on VI tenors, nor the proximity of the Eb key touch in relation to the D key on The Martin horns.

I've owned both a VII tenor and a 10M, and though my fingers always felt at home on those horns, I passed them on for other reasons. Can't beat their spread however, for larger hands.

 

[Pete Thomas]

I agree with everyone that the spread of keytouches is more or less the same across the range and makes/models.

BUT

Having said that if you really have huge dirty great big stonking humungous hands and cannot get used to the conventional ergonomics, it shouldn't reall cost too much for a technician to do some alterations for you.

Not something you may want to do on a collectors item, but if you love a horn and are going to keep it, but those ergos annoy you, then a couple of hundred for a few hours of a tech's time moving and bending things - I'd go for it.

 

[AddictedToSax]

Yes, I saw it done on a small girl's alto. Her hands were too small to reach the right hand pinky keys so the tech fabricated new key touches for her tiny hands. It can work the other way too.

 

[JohnInDenver]

Get yourself a Mark VII tenor...apparently designed by and for people with huge hands!

 

[Carter]

Keilwerths and stencils seem a little larger to me as well.

 

[Jerry K.]

Take up the upright bass? I’ve seen some monster players with some serious sausage fingers!

 

[mmichel]

Keilwerths and stencils seem a little larger to me as well.

+1

You should try a Keilwerth if you get a chance. Many people complain that their keywork is too spread out. I have big hands and I find the Keilwerth keywork much more comfortable than that of modern Selmer (and similar) horns.

Also, while the stack keys tend to be in more or less the same place on the different voices (i.e., SATB) of a common brand, the positions and heights of the palm and pinky keys can vary dramatically.

 

[JayeLID]

Dumb question from a beginner: Are the keys (and general ergonomics) more spread out on a tenor in comparison to an alto? I'm learning on my daughter's hand-me-down '80s King 613 alto and it seems more than a bit squeezy for big, basketball palming hands. Especially the right pinky table...which seems like it's in a really awkward spot.
I'm asking because I will be in the market for a sax of my own, and while I like the alto sound, my hands aren't getting any smaller.

The Pinky of a 613 is just plain...bad. Located badly, and engineered badly. Crazy as it seems, the tables on the older Clevelands (the 613 is a renamed "Cleveland" model, basically) was much quicker and more navigable. So in their evolution of the model, they made the keywork worse, actually.

So I am not sure if it is the Alto size which is the issue as much as it is that particular model you have there.

I do NOT think you would necessarily HAVE to move to Tenor due to ergonomics due to scale of your hands. Some makers do have a reputation for being better for large or small hands....yes. But as most have stated here, it should not deter you from sticking with Alto if that is what you like.

I mean, I think it'd be fair to state that vintage pinky tables were/are more of a 'reach' than the modern Selmer/Yamaha-esque ones are (which to me tend to feel more 'on top of me')...so I think there would be some justification in saying that some traditional pinky tables might suit larger hands better.

Then there are some 3-across tables (meaning the Bb can be activated by moving the pinky to the left of the B) where the B touch is kinda "hidden" in between the C# and the Bb....Some Bueschers were like this. Didn't take much to acclimate to it, but indeed the scale of that touch was physically small.

 

[Lewis_Moon]

The Pinky of a 613 is just plain...bad. Located badly, and engineered badly. Crazy as it seems, the tables on the older Clevelands (the 613 is a renamed "Cleveland" model, basically) was much quicker and more navigable. So in their evolution of the model, they made the keywork worse, actually.

I talked to my daughter last night. The 613 was her first horn before moving to the YTS-6XX she is using now. She hated the right 613 pinky table even with her small hands.