Goodwill Vito/Yamaha?
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Well, what you'll get on this question is a lot of, I play this, and so and so plays that, and yada yada. My first question is what do you want to sound like? What's your sound concept? There is where you have to start. Once you've done that then you need to identify the attributes of a mouthpiece that will facilitate that sound. That is; what baffle it should have, what chamber should it have and what tip opening is comfortable for you. Then you can narrow it down to a few specific mouthpieces. Good luck.
Baffle Types - Theo Wanne
The purpose of the mouthpiece is to create the instrument tone. The saxophones purpose is to amplify that tone and determine its pitch. While classical, rock, and jazz players may play the same horn, the mouthpiece will be very different. The part of the mouthpiece that creates the biggest...
theowanne.com
I really don't think you should worry that much about the air volume, the instrument is going to have to take more air regardless of what you're doing (or what mouthpiece you're using), it'll take a bit of time but like maybe 1-2 months tops to get used to the air if you practice even somewhat frequent with it. I hope the sax arrives in good condition. Best of luck mate.
I suppose the real answer to the "how do I want to sound" is "I don't know". Originally I wanted to sound like Paul Desmond on alto, but the mouthpiece I have become comfortable with doesn't sound like that. Not sure who it resembles, (maybe a bit like Adderley?), but I have decided it doesn't matter. Wife says I sound pretty good, and she's the only audience I will likely ever have.Well, what you'll get on this question is a lot of, I play this, and so and so plays that, and yada yada. My first question is what do you want to sound like? What's your sound concept? There is where you have to start. Once you've done that then you need to identify the attributes of a mouthpiece that will facilitate that sound. That is; what baffle it should have, what chamber should it have and what tip opening is comfortable for you. Then you can narrow it down to a few specific mouthpieces. Good luck.
Baffle Types - Theo Wanne
The purpose of the mouthpiece is to create the instrument tone. The saxophones purpose is to amplify that tone and determine its pitch. While classical, rock, and jazz players may play the same horn, the mouthpiece will be very different. The part of the mouthpiece that creates the biggest...
So: tenor sound? I like the Getz sound (I suppose he's the tenor analog to Desmond). Not really familiar with recent players, though I have watched a couple of Bob Reynolds' videos; he sounds pretty good. I appreciate Sonny Rollins, love to hear him play, but his tone isn't my favorite. Initially, I'm concerned with just producing a saxophone-like sound, which is why I was tending toward more of a beginner-type 'piece.
Thanks for that. As I mentioned before, I played tenor as a young teen after 1 and a half years of clarinet (defining "play" somewhat loosely here), so I should be able to get a sound out of this one. And yes, I hope the sax is playable upon arrival, but I'm not puttin' any money on it.
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I think you'd find a .100" ALTO mouthpiece beastly
But if you are happy with a 7 on alto, a .100" tenor would be of similar character, all other things being equal. You'll definitely need some trial and error, but I feel that's where you might want to start.
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Well, I will tell you that to achieve that Getz or Desmond type of sound your best bet is a mouthpiece with a flat baffle and a large chamber with no more than a 6 tip opening. Some people on here have suggested a hard rubber Link which is a good choice, just make sure wherever you buy from you have ability to return it if it's not a good fit for you.
White truck arrived at noon. Had a big box for me.
There's good news and bad news....
But almost ALL GOOD NEWS!
Packing was minimal. No prep inside case. It rattled when I moved it. Once I opened the case (which is in quite good shape on the outside), horn looked ok. Rattling was because the neck wasn't in its neck cubby but was banging around in the accessory compartment. No neck plug. Padding on neck end not in good shape. But horn looked ok. I looked at the keywork; everything seemed OK except the G# key. After a minuite I discovered the spring had come out of its detent-thingy. Once I moved it into place, "all the valves worked", just like GW said. It even did pretty well with a pop test.
2 MPCs were included! One is a pretty chewed up "Brilhart Special" of unknown tip opening; the other had a George Bundy signature and was marked '3'. I tried to measure openings with a glass plate and my vernier caliper, got about .072" for both. The Bundy looked to have a bit longer facing curve. It was much less chewed up, so I put a pad on it and had a go at playing it.
I put a Vandoren blue box 2.0 on it, and... IT PLAYS! All the way up to F, all the way down to B flat. I am certain it will benefit from some regulation, pad, cork, adjustment work (neck cork needs to be replaced), but I am very pleased. I even mostly got the bell rim back into place by bending it with my own 2 hands! I still have trouble with the lowest notes, and the LH pinky table is enough different from my Cleveland alto that I miss notes a bit, but all in all, I think I made out like a bandit!
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There's good news and bad news....
But almost ALL GOOD NEWS!
Packing was minimal. No prep inside case. It rattled when I moved it. Once I opened the case (which is in quite good shape on the outside), horn looked ok. Rattling was because the neck wasn't in its neck cubby but was banging around in the accessory compartment. No neck plug. Padding on neck end not in good shape. But horn looked ok. I looked at the keywork; everything seemed OK except the G# key. After a minuite I discovered the spring had come out of its detent-thingy. Once I moved it into place, "all the valves worked", just like GW said. It even did pretty well with a pop test.
2 MPCs were included! One is a pretty chewed up "Brilhart Special" of unknown tip opening; the other had a George Bundy signature and was marked '3'. I tried to measure openings with a glass plate and my vernier caliper, got about .072" for both. The Bundy looked to have a bit longer facing curve. It was much less chewed up, so I put a pad on it and had a go at playing it.
I put a Vandoren blue box 2.0 on it, and... IT PLAYS! All the way up to F, all the way down to B flat. I am certain it will benefit from some regulation, pad, cork, adjustment work (neck cork needs to be replaced), but I am very pleased. I even mostly got the bell rim back into place by bending it with my own 2 hands! I still have trouble with the lowest notes, and the LH pinky table is enough different from my Cleveland alto that I miss notes a bit, but all in all, I think I made out like a bandit!
Oh! Forgot something. When I swabbed the neck after playing, IT CAME OUT GREEN! EWWW!
I washed the swab cloth and ran hot water in the neck for a while (holding the pip with my finger), then ran a disposable dry wipe cloth through the neck a couple times. Swabbing the body resulted in a bit more undesirable color. I elected not to hose out the body, but I did wash the swab cloth. Gonna have nightmares about this tonight, no doubt.
I washed the swab cloth and ran hot water in the neck for a while (holding the pip with my finger), then ran a disposable dry wipe cloth through the neck a couple times. Swabbing the body resulted in a bit more undesirable color. I elected not to hose out the body, but I did wash the swab cloth. Gonna have nightmares about this tonight, no doubt.
Always a bari primary, Beaugnier/Vito 38B, Grassi Std bari, Chateau 90 sop
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133 Posts
I have watched with interest your horn arrival, and the advice given, but I wanted to congratulate you on your return to playing!! I am often mentioning my own 45 year hiatus, because it is often cogent to what I have to contribute, and you, sir, have bested me in that regard, with 50!!!! First time I've seen that since I joined in 2015. I'm assuming you are retired, and if you have the time and inclination, send me a PM and I'll set up a phone call. I mostly would like to share how my development has gone AND, scold you for saying that your wife will probably. be your only audience! I see her IN the audience with you on stage, perhaps surpassing where you were in high school.
Just learned that the Geo. M. Bundy signature mouthpiece that came with my Vito is something of a collector's item! There are listings on reverb and ebay for these for up to $75! I'm keepin' mine, though.
Getting too late tonight, but I will certainly PM you tomorrow. Yeah, me on stage in porkpie hat, Skechers, lounge pants and a Steely Dan t-shirt. Just when does Hell freeze over? HA!
So, you are a bari man? As you may remember from one of my earlier ramblings, er, posts, that was my axe back in the day.
Take a close look; that Bundy and that Brilhart are the same mouthpiece, made from the same mold, same plastic, just a different name stamped on. Neither one's worth much, both will play very well. Despite the "cheap" reputation, either of them could serve you for decades of professional service should they suit you.
So these 'pieces are plastic and not HR? I did notice that they were VERY similar. I'll need to check again, but I think the side rails aren't the same. I suppose one could have been modified, but I doubt it. From other stuff in the case, it appears this instrument was used by a high school girl in Ohio. Probably not into having MPCs refaced.
The two MPs were probably made at different times. Facing machine adjusted a bit differently. Or a multi cavity mold with slight variation in the cavities.
Almost certainly the material is PMMA, polymethylmethacrylate, which is often shortened to "acrylic" and which is more or less the same family of material as Plexiglass. It's rather brittle, which leads to requiring more draft angle on the bore of the MP, and these being cheap mouthpieces they weren't reamed to a final cylindrical bore but left as-molded; all of which tend to lead to the cracks so often seen in PMMA mouthpieces. When the material's white, the cracks are more visible. Your best plan is to make sure the cork's not too tight. If you really end up liking a PMMA el cheapo, you can ream it and make the bore cylindrical, but it's kind of a pain and you really need some telescoping bore gauges.
Almost certainly the material is PMMA, polymethylmethacrylate, which is often shortened to "acrylic" and which is more or less the same family of material as Plexiglass. It's rather brittle, which leads to requiring more draft angle on the bore of the MP, and these being cheap mouthpieces they weren't reamed to a final cylindrical bore but left as-molded; all of which tend to lead to the cracks so often seen in PMMA mouthpieces. When the material's white, the cracks are more visible. Your best plan is to make sure the cork's not too tight. If you really end up liking a PMMA el cheapo, you can ream it and make the bore cylindrical, but it's kind of a pain and you really need some telescoping bore gauges.
I just looked at them again, and yes, they look more plasticky than rubbery. The variations I see could certainly be from mold wear or somesuch. Ah, well. I might put a couple of bite patches on the more worn one (Brilhart Ebolin labeled); its tip rail looks a little better.
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20,389 Posts
Well yes, those are the listed prices but I am not sure someone would actually spend that on one.
On the other hand, they are pretty good...I mean, large chamber, good, manageable tip opening, so if not damaged yeah, you saved at lest #30 on having to buy a mouthpiece.
The Brilhart Special, contrary to the implication of its name, was a budget mouthpiece put out by Brilly. Plastic yes, tip opening on small side....nothing like a classic vintage Brilly BUT...not BAD at all. If it didn't have the bite mark it'd definitely be a good, usable 'piece as well. Might be if you go with a cushion...
OK so I hope the hose comment was tongue-in cheek
It probably needs a body cleaning, but to do that you'd need to of course disassemble the horn, remove the keywork. If you don't feel comfy doing that, and reassembling...don't try.
The horns sounds like it has leaks if the lows do not speak cleanly. If you wanna buy a leak light...you can check yourself.
If you are lucky, the leaks will be in the stack keys and they may be removable by using the adjusting screws on the Ckey and F# key benches, as well as maybe the G# ones.
If they are not....then there'd need to be either refloating, key bending, or pad replacing....in which case, probably a tech visit is in order.
Disassembly, cleaning body and neck, topically wiping the pads with some naptha, some leak removal, maybe change a few pads...that shouldn't run more than around $200 and maybe it won't even need all of that.
Depends on how much you wanna try some DIY.
Congrats, no significant body damage and playing up and down to a good degree..you cannot ask for more from a GW horn.
Turf: Yes, it says "Ebolin", but also where the opening number is, it says "special", which, in marketing-speak, means "not so special". Means "student" in this case. I put a pad on over the chew marks.
Jaye: Yes, the hose out comment was tongue in cheek. Thanks for the pointers. I feel an urge to try a few DIY things, but I am fearful of having to present a "bag job" to a tech. And yeah, I kinda feel like I should go buy a lotto ticket after this!
Jaye: Yes, the hose out comment was tongue in cheek. Thanks for the pointers. I feel an urge to try a few DIY things, but I am fearful of having to present a "bag job" to a tech. And yeah, I kinda feel like I should go buy a lotto ticket after this!
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The only thing I can suggest DIY if you don't wanna mess with removing the keys, is to buy a padsaver swab and spray it with a water+naptha 50-50 solution until it is slightly damp (don't soak it) - then you can insert it in the body tube, rotate it around a few times, and pull out...it might get some icky stuff out. If the solution gets on any pads, it's fine too.
No harm done.
Do same thing with a cloth on bellside, drop it in the bell, push it down with a stick or something, remove it thru the Low C tonehole (this would require removing the Low C and Eb keys but those are easy-easy to put back on).
If the toneholes have residue on their edges, get some 500 or 600 grit sandpaper (black preferable), slide it between the pad and hold, press key down lightly, pull the paper out, repeat until you start seeing brass on the edge again. Last time, instead of the sandpaper use a cloth,very slightly damp, to get off any metal residue.
Then the leak light...find where the leaks are.
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