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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Hello everyone, I've been playing the tenor for less than a month. I'm a trumpet player. I have Amati 60s and a mouthpiece Vandoren Java T45. I switched almost immediately from the green vandoren java 2 reeds to 2.5. I wanted to try the Legere reed. I took a 2.25( american cut), I do not know if it corresponds to a 2.5, but so always from the site Legere. so was amazed by sound quality, roundness and volume. but the thing that amazes me I do not know if it is for suggestion or something else, I'm trying it only for two days, wich i'm less wrong. Especially the transition from C to D, which created so many problems for me now with this reeds I have no more if not in a much lesser way. Do you think it could be that this reed can help those who are beginners or mine is just a momentary honeymoon? Thaks and sorry for my english.
 

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Alto: Conn New Wonder II, Tenor: 1929 Holton Rudy Wiedoeft Model, Bari: Selmer Mark VI
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So for my opinion the Legere doesn’t give me the tone I want it gives a different sound. To me the reed makes me sound more like I’m playing a tin can. It can be easier but the trade off for me is sound.
 

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Cannonball Vintage Reborn Tenor Sax with Cannonball 5J hr (Meyer clone produced by JJ Babbitt))
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I have too many unanswered questions. Legere reeds run firmer than corresponding measures of real reeds. I find them to be at least 1/2 size firmer. Given that the T45 is a narrow tip, I suspect the culprit is more of an embouchure/ biting issue.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Hello everyone, I've been playing the tenor for less than a month. I'm a trumpet player. I have Amati 60s and a mouthpiece Vandoren Java T45. I switched almost immediately from the green vandoren java 2 reeds to 2.5. I wanted to try the Legere reed. I took a 2.25( american cut), I do not know if it corresponds to a 2.5, but so always from the site Legere. so was amazed by sound quality, roundness and volume. but the thing that amazes me I do not know if it is for suggestion or something else, I'm trying it only for two days, wich i'm less wrong. Especially the transition from C to D, which created so many problems for me now with this reeds I have no more if not in a much lesser way. Do you think it could be that this reed can help those who are beginners or mine is just a momentary honeymoon? Thaks and sorry for my english.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
today i was trying again, and as i suspected the honeymoon is over. the usual D again. but then I took my vandoren java 2 1/2 as a test and magically the D always came out clean. surely I'm still a beginner and I blow badly, but I don't understand the variations, if it doesn't come out it shouldn't always come out. instead here it depends on the reed I use. today with the vandoren java I have almost never gone wrong. thanks everyone for the advice
 

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The C to D transition should not have anything to do with the reed. If you like the Legere it should work for you for many months You won't have to mess around with cane and just focus on playing.
 

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I have all Legere reed (both Signature and American cut) for tenor and alto with the strength ranging from 2.0 to 2.5. Contrary to most findings by other members here, I found them run a little bit softer instead of harder. For example, according to their chart, the Legere Tenor Signature 2.25 is slightly harder than the Vandoren V16 2.5. But I feel that it actually feels same as Vandoren V16 2.0, while the Vandoren V16 2.5 is much much harder than the Signature 2.25. Same applied to other strength. The AC feels significantly harder than Signature for the same strength. I have tried several cane reeds but on tenor Legere beat all the cane reeds on response and tone easily.
 

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Antigua Powerbell tenor-Otto Link NY ,Vito Alto -Gigliotti Spectrum, Antigua sop- Morgan 4
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I've found positioning the reed correctly is very important. Make sure it's centered perfectly and experiment with moving very slightly forward and back-it makes a big difference. I've noticed my cane reeds like to warp when I first wet them, I like to flatten them on the mp table before it goes on, if you start playing with the warp it might sound bad for a little while. I like the Leger's, I like to play my horn off and on all day and I don't have to worry about what the reed is doing.
 

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Cannonball Vintage Reborn Tenor Sax with Cannonball 5J hr (Meyer clone produced by JJ Babbitt))
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today i was trying again, and as i suspected the honeymoon is over. the usual D again. but then I took my vandoren java 2 1/2 as a test and magically the D always came out clean. surely I'm still a beginner and I blow badly, but I don't understand the variations, if it doesn't come out it shouldn't always come out. instead here it depends on the reed I use. today with the vandoren java I have almost never gone wrong. thanks everyone for the advice
As your mouth gets accustomed to the round circle of an embouchure, you will be able to play longer and consistently. One month is not long enough. The next time it does not work, focus your embouchure from the corners of your mouth rather than biting. See if that helps. Also, take in a little more mouth piece.
 

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One month is too soon to know which reed or reeds will be right for you.

I've only played Legere reeds on my alto but their primary advantage, in my opinion, has been that they're always ready to play. I have an alto Legere Studio reed and, if I decide to play alto, I can be playing alto in less than a minute.

The Legere sounds different than the cane reeds I'd play if I took the time to soak them, but it doesn't sound worse, just different. I don't remember what hardness that reed is.

I play tenor most of the time and have never bought a Legere or any other synthetic reed for tenor. There are more reeds available than I'll ever try, but I've been pretty happy with Gonzalez Jazz and Java Red.
 

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Your English is fine. So are the Vandoren Green. As stated above, after a month it is too soon to start searching for the "right" reed. Plus, after a few years on sax (both alto and tenor), I find there is no right reed. Some days one responds great, another day it's a different one, whether because of how the reed ages, the weather or whatever inconsistencies I bring to the equation as a player. I've generally had good results with the Vandoren Java reeds, though they can vary a lot from one to the next, even within a single box. The appeal of synthetic reeds is that they will all play pretty much the same. I've not tried them myself. But whatever technical challenges you're working through will not be fixed by changing reed materials. Nor will switching reed strengths. The more time you spend testing reeds the less you'll spend improving technique.
 

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Your English is fine. So are the Vandoren Green. As stated above, after a month it is too soon to start searching for the "right" reed. Plus, after a few years on sax (both alto and tenor), I find there is no right reed. Some days one responds great, another day it's a different one, whether because of how the reed ages, the weather or whatever inconsistencies I bring to the equation as a player. I've generally had good results with the Vandoren Java reeds, though they can vary a lot from one to the next, even within a single box. The appeal of synthetic reeds is that they will all play pretty much the same. I've not tried them myself. But whatever technical challenges you're working through will not be fixed by changing reed materials. Nor will switching reed strengths. The more time you spend testing reeds the less you'll spend improving technique.
I'm having difficulty with your post as all the information you're stating are the exact reasons why a beginner should be playing a synthetic reed. You have 100% consistency, which allows you to learn every other aspect of the instrument. Finding the "right reed" isn't possible for a beginner. E.g. how do they know if/when it's not good? Change reed and you need to get used to that, or is it also not a good one? If your horn and mouthpiece are OK and the strength of the synthetic reed is in the right range, then it's a matter of getting used to playing. Even experienced players know that when you get a new mouthpiece it can take quite a while before you adjust to it so that it's natural to your playing. Beginners are adjusting to everything! Take out the most variable element A CANE REED and you've given the newbie a massive head start. It's really nearly incomprehensible how some people don't get this.
 

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I'm having difficulty with your post as all the information you're stating are the exact reasons why a beginner should be playing a synthetic reed. You have 100% consistency, which allows you to learn every other aspect of the instrument. Finding the "right reed" isn't possible for a beginner. E.g. how do they know if/when it's not good? Change reed and you need to get used to that, or is it also not a good one? If your horn and mouthpiece are OK and the strength of the synthetic reed is in the right range, then it's a matter of getting used to playing. Even experienced players know that when you get a new mouthpiece it can take quite a while before you adjust to it so that it's natural to your playing. Beginners are adjusting to everything! Take out the most variable element A CANE REED and you've given the newbie a massive head start. It's really nearly incomprehensible how some people don't get this.
I’d be right there with you IF the sound, feel and response of synthetic didn’t suck.
 

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I’d be right there with you IF the sound, feel and response of synthetic didn’t suck.
We're talking about a BEGINNER. What beginner doesn't sound like they suck? I suppose you've tried all of the synthetics out there? They do vary in the same way that cane does. I don't happen to like many of them myself (especially the Legere), but find the Hartmann fiberreeds pretty good. The point is obviously lost when one is dealing with a "believer" rather than someone who is objectively thinking of what's best for the novice. They can start experimenting with various brands of cane and becme a believer (like you) once they've got their chops together.
 

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Regarding the Legere (both Signature and American Cut) vs Cane reed (Vandoren, Jazz Select, BSS, Rigotti, etc) with respect to tone and response, here are my experience as a life time amateur:
On Soprano, cane reed give better tone than Legere; response feels similar.
On Alto, Legere gives better response than cane reed; tone feels similar.
On Tenor, Legere gives both better tone than response. It is strange to me that I never get along with cane reed on tenor (I have tried almost all the brands). At the end of the day I always come back to my Legere Signature 2.25 that gives me the best tone I can achieve and easiest response, and least chirping/squeaking.
 

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Antigua Powerbell tenor-Otto Link NY ,Vito Alto -Gigliotti Spectrum, Antigua sop- Morgan 4
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Yes agree, the signature on my tenor sounds really good, better to me than the american. I only have a Rico orange and Royal but I like the sig tone better.
 

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We're talking about a BEGINNER. What beginner doesn't sound like they suck? I suppose you've tried all of the synthetics out there? They do vary in the same way that cane does. I don't happen to like many of them myself (especially the Legere), but find the Hartmann fiberreeds pretty good. The point is obviously lost when one is dealing with a "believer" rather than someone who is objectively thinking of what's best for the novice. They can start experimenting with various brands of cane and becme a believer (like you) once they've got their chops together.
Point taken. Yes beginners will sound terrible regardless. But they will miss out on learning on the real thing and experiencing the magic of a good cane reed.

I tried my first synthetic back in the 70s and pretty much every brand since. I even play synthetic on a few horns regularly where convenience trumps sound quality (clarinet double, bari and bass occasionally). But I would never recommend to a beginner. They need to learn on the real deal for best long term success. If the goal is making kazoo sounds and flapping fingers, then I guess synthetic is ok. If the goal is to become a good player with a good sound, don't touch synthetic until you can get a great sound on cane. If a synthetic equal to cane existed, I'd switch immediately and advise all my students to also. But it doesn't and probably never will. Legere is the closest by far, but still has a way to go.
 

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Point taken. Yes beginners will sound terrible regardless. But they will miss out on learning on the real thing and experiencing the magic of a good cane reed.

I tried my first synthetic back in the 70s and pretty much every brand since. I even play synthetic on a few horns regularly where convenience trumps sound quality (clarinet double, bari and bass occasionally). But I would never recommend to a beginner. They need to learn on the real deal for best long term success. If the goal is making kazoo sounds and flapping fingers, then I guess synthetic is ok. If the goal is to become a good player with a good sound, don't touch synthetic until you can get a great sound on cane. If a synthetic equal to cane existed, I'd switch immediately and advise all my students to also. But it doesn't and probably never will. Legere is the closest by far, but still has a way to go.
I'm guessing you haven't tried the Hartmanns. If you're teaching beginners (as you seem to indicate), then maybe you should try out a beginner with a synthetic? Having a closed mind as a teacher seems unhelpful.

I've also tried synthetics from the outset, and as said I don't like most of them. There's also the tendency for some practices to become a "ritual". I started out in the 1950s and there was only cane. I also played clarinet, oboe and English horn. For oboe and English horn I had to make the reeds as none were commercially available. So reed making was a "ritual". This also translated over to having to work with cane reeds, which weren't particularly good with few brands to choose from. It's certainly evident with all the youtube stuff and continual comments, new gear, etc. that there is almost a cult of cane working. Great if one can actually make a crap reed play, but I also get the feeling that a lot of this becomes ritual. A Dumbo magic feather if you will.

The beginner has no rituals or prejudice. If you've got an open mind towards your students and what may (or may not?) be of benefit to them, give them a good quality synthetic and see what happens. I can't see how this could in any way be a negative thing for your students. I've certainly seen how this can benefit.
 

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I've found positioning the reed correctly is very important. Make sure it's centered perfectly and experiment with moving very slightly forward and back-it makes a big difference. I've noticed my cane reeds like to warp when I first wet them, I like to flatten them on the mp table before it goes on,
It funny that sometimes my reed looks warped but when I put it in water it straighten out
 
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