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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
during my travels recently in north africa, I met a gentlemen selling an extremely selmer mark vii tenor. first, serial number is M 205xxx, very different pinky table, and S shaped braces. the owner, a pro French player, claimed it acmes from the factory as is, and owned it for 30 years.. after blowing it for 5 min, I bought it.
curious what you guys make of it.
all feedback is appreciated

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Looks like a modded legit VII to me. The extra Bb pinky table is clearly an add-on, and I don't see any way those guards are original. Would love to know the real story, as these don't look like custom 'factory' additions to me. Also the serial number seems wonky somehow, and I would think a VII with that low of a number would be engraved, but I'm no expert.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
the serial number is sure too low for a mark vii, but the rest of it is definitely mark VII design... surprisingly, all braces fit perfectly, but not sure what to make of them. is the pinky table add on a common mod? I dont see any alterations or signs of work done
 

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You may be looking at some kind of prototype that was not adapted in favor of a more traditional appearance. I say this because the serial number is well into the MK VI range (as already stated above). I do not believe that horn was ever retailed or meant to leave the Paris factory, but there it is.
 

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Once I owned a tenor mark VI with sn: 230XXX, and my friend had an alto mark VII - 230XXX I joked that the serial is the same - and the price is not...
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I guess it could be a prototype tenor, as far as the pinky table, it is much smaller than the one of the Mark VIIs and can't see any signs of it being an addition.. I actually like it a lot
 

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Re: This thing real or not??

This is one for Douglas Pipher.

I don’t generally believe in “ prototypes” since whatever never found its way to production was never sold in the first place. But this may just have been one.

Douglas would know the exact production date, the shop it was sold to and if there was anything Proto-typical
 

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Re: This thing real or not??

That one's been on Ebay and on this forum before. I can't remember what the final consensus was. If I had to guess, I would guess it's a Frankenhorn and someone's modified the key guards. A true prototype would be unlikely to have been stamped with all the emblems, and at any rate I think (think! Don't know!) that if Selmer had a prototype banging around they would modify it back to standard before selling it.
 

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Re: This thing real or not??

Indeed this was talked about before 5 years ago, Douglas Pipher (not been around here for several days) is the only person whom would know more about this (he has access to the Selmer archives) and he wasn’t involved in identifying this.

EXTRAORDINARY claims should be supported by extraordinary evidence and lacking a formal identification ( By Selmer itself) I would be very skeptical.

https://forum.saxontheweb.net/showthread.php?355150-extremely-unusual-mark-Vii-tenor-need-help

during my travels recently in north africa, I met a gentlemen selling an extremely selmer mark vii tenor. first, serial number is M 205xxx, very different pinky table, and S shaped braces. the owner, a pro French player, claimed it acmes from the factory as is, and owned it for 30 years.. after blowing it for 5 min, I bought it.
curious what you guys make of it.
all feedback is appreciated

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Re: This thing real or not??

Well, my 2 cents...... It does look legit to me. Mechanically, it certainly looks Selmer, regardless of the strange added Low Bb (I believe) to the pinky table and the key guards. The finish, or I should say the wear to the finish looks consistent throughout in regards to the pitting, lacquer color, etc. The eBay seller says it was just overhauled by South Florida Horns, who I believe is a member here, so it would be great to hear his input regarding this beast. Having said that, I personally have no interest in VI's or VII's for that matter. Interesting looking thing for sure!
 

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The tech working on one of my horns described a horn similar to this last week... something about "conservatory options" for optional keywork.
 

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I would still want to know what it says in the archives, lacking any official confirmation is not going to help the sales
 

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The tech working on one of my horns described a horn similar to this last week... something about "conservatory options" for optional keywork.
I believe conservatory options were extra trill keys - Eb, G# and high D.

What makes me doubt the authenticity is the 3 point bell brace at a time that no one (afik) was using it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
I am the owner of this tenor, as you guys can see from the original post, I asked for your opinions because I figured someone on this forum would have at least seen or own one before. I wasn't sure what it was, but as anal as I can be, I found no evidence or repair or re-lacquer solder work... its all smooth and perfect...some suggested a prototype. I listed it for sale months ago and the guy from saxquest made me a decent offer that turned down. so I called him out of curiosity, he claimed he has seen similar Mark VII s with low serial numbers and extra keys. apparently Selmer experimented with different set ups/ designs ... That being said, he was intrigued but the key guards like all of us.. then I decided to have it overhauled since it was in good shape other than minor dings here and there, and of course I was curious to see how it plays. South Florida horns was recommended here and did a fabulous job !! Of course I asked for his input, and he believed its all original..
I recently emailed Selmer Paris with few photos, so I am hoping they will reply with some feedback
that being said, why would anyone fake a Mark VII? so they fabricated S shaped Guards, soldered it perfectly, used a mark VI serial sized picky table / serial number and other bits and lacquered the entire horn? it just doesn't make any sense. might as well fake a Mark VI, its will sell for more..
anyway, the thing plays wonderfully, but the tone is on the dark side.. it seems to like large chamber mouthpieces (using an early slant)
here are additional pictures
best

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