Hey everyone, I'm fairly new to playing saxophone and new to this forum, so please forgive me if I am asking something that has been asked 1,000 times. I can't seem to find much information about exercises to help fill a horn with tons of air. I play alto and the sound I want is like Cannonball Adderley. I've heard that most of that sound is about really putting lots and lots of air through the horn. Any help I can get with that would be really wonderful! Thanks
Exercises for filling the horn with more air
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This probably a common misconception, putting lots of air through the saxophone will NOT make you sound any better because it is not the way that saxophone works.
The way saxophone works is making vibrate the reed by applying pressure. The reed’s vibration makes the air column vibrate, the actual air displacement is very minimal.
So, if you are talking of breath exercises they aren’t generally targeted to produce a lot of air flow but a bout a steady and controlled air pressure , you may want to increase pressure but not flow
The way saxophone works is making vibrate the reed by applying pressure. The reed’s vibration makes the air column vibrate, the actual air displacement is very minimal.
So, if you are talking of breath exercises they aren’t generally targeted to produce a lot of air flow but a bout a steady and controlled air pressure , you may want to increase pressure but not flow
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Hello! I agree with milandro in that putting in 'lots' of air isn't really the key. With my students, I tend to focus on the quality of the air as opposed to the amount. Here are a few things that I give students to help with airstream and breathing. A good quality sound starts with good quality air.
Relaxed breathing technique - your body should be relaxed with minimal tension in the shoulders. If you lie flat on the ground with your arms by your side, you'll notice that your stomach rises and falls gently. This is what it feels like to breathe in a relaxed way.
Matching your inhaling with your exhaling - if your body is tense when it inhales, it will probably be tense when it exhales. This will affect your playing and sound quality. For good results, breathe early and not too fast. Don't wait until the last quarter of a beat before the next phrase to breathe. If you're improvising, make sure you don't rush your breathing too much. This will make it easier to breathe relaxed air into the saxophone, which will translate into a better sound.
Trust the horn - good quality saxophones whether modern or vintage tend to be well designed and tend to respond relatively easily without excessively forceful input from the player. If you play with good air support, you probably won't even feel the need to apply excessive lip pressure or make too many disruptive movements while playing. The instrument should sort of look after itself in this regard, which will leave you in a good position to ensure you play with a great sound.
A fun exercise - everybody knows that breathing is involuntary, but for some reason this doesn't always translate too well to our playing. Something I like to try with students with exceptionally tense breathing is to get them to start off by taking a deep breath and exhaling slowly. You should continue to exhale until you have no more air and then attempt one more puff. At this point, you can feel that your body is almost straining. If you let go, you will feel yourself inflate like a bag. This happens automatically and without any real thought. It's fun too.
I hope this helps,
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Whilst I also agree, it’s important to have the ability to put a good amount of air through the horn.
I find especially for Baritone that being able to push more air through the horn allows me to get the edge I need on the lower baffled, larger chambered pieces I prefer to use.
When you have a higher baffle and smaller chamber, perhaps you don’t need to put as much air through the horn.
I also tend to like more open tipped pieces, which I feel require more air to get the most out of.
I find especially for Baritone that being able to push more air through the horn allows me to get the edge I need on the lower baffled, larger chambered pieces I prefer to use.
When you have a higher baffle and smaller chamber, perhaps you don’t need to put as much air through the horn.
I also tend to like more open tipped pieces, which I feel require more air to get the most out of.
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If one wold not be worried of stinking up the saxophone and one were to blow smoke through the horn one would see how very little displacement of air there is and how slow it actually moves.
Therefore increasing quantity or speed is not only not needed but it would be harmful because a higher flow would reduce pressure which is what you need to make the reed vibrate ( yes there is a certain amount of flow bu only because that is the veiccle to produce the reed’s movement and convey the necessary pressure to set it in motion)
Of course the content of air of a baritone is higher than the one of the alto, because of that, you need more pressure to set it in motion, but what moves is not the air inside the saxophone but the reed which in turns makes the air column VIBRATE (while it hardly moves).
The only thing that the player really does is setting the reed in motion and maintaining a steady pressure and minimal flow , keeping it in motion.
When one increases the sound volume (as in dynamics exercises ) one increases the pressure, not the volume of air.
Therefore increasing quantity or speed is not only not needed but it would be harmful because a higher flow would reduce pressure which is what you need to make the reed vibrate ( yes there is a certain amount of flow bu only because that is the veiccle to produce the reed’s movement and convey the necessary pressure to set it in motion)
Of course the content of air of a baritone is higher than the one of the alto, because of that, you need more pressure to set it in motion, but what moves is not the air inside the saxophone but the reed which in turns makes the air column VIBRATE (while it hardly moves).
The only thing that the player really does is setting the reed in motion and maintaining a steady pressure and minimal flow , keeping it in motion.
When one increases the sound volume (as in dynamics exercises ) one increases the pressure, not the volume of air.
If you're fairly new to playing the saxophone as you say, don't expect too much too soon in regards to sounding like Cannonball Adderley. It takes time to develop a mature sound. And by the time you achieve that you may decide to pursue your own unique sound rather than trying to sound like someone else, or not, as the case may be. You'd be better served by finding a good teacher if possible rather than teaching yourself, though nothing wrong with that, but a teacher would save you time.
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Milandro is correct. The vibrating reed acts as a "valve" controlling and limiting the amount of air that passes into the mouthpiece. Blowing harder beyond a certain point only closes off the end of the reed. "Blowing through the horn or blowing to the end of the horn" are simply teaching concepts to get players to blow air with more pressure behind it. The air does not travel through the saxophone, the sound wave made up of air molecules moving back and forth does.
Brass players also talk a lot about "blowing through the horn". I read of a test where a tuba player blew a large amount of cigarette smoke into his instrument and began to play. It took several minutes for the first bit of smoke to slowly come out the bell.
Brass players also talk a lot about "blowing through the horn". I read of a test where a tuba player blew a large amount of cigarette smoke into his instrument and began to play. It took several minutes for the first bit of smoke to slowly come out the bell.
'The air does not travel through the saxophone,'
That is totally wrong - where do you think all that air goes? Air is compressible of course but there's no stopper in the bell of a sax. In fact, if I forget to remove the bell stuffer before trying to play, there's no way to play beyond a certain point that is higher than you would think on the sax.It even comes out of the bell when all the keys are closed. I'm not saying anybody could blow out a candle playing sax but all my life I've blown air out of the lower stack keys on alto, tenor and baritone - I feel it on my hands all the time, and I actually do not have a high-capacity for air. In fact, I don't do well in respiration tests but I can blow two saxes at the same time - alto with a Guardala Studio and tenor with a Guardala King Curtis, and handle fairly long phrases at a high volume. My problem comes in with not being able to hold notes for a long time at high volume on any horn, but I'd rather be able to push the air than have a huge reserve. Of course, it obviously would be better to have both abilities! Plus, the lungs lose capacity as we age, and I am definitely aged! I find myself having to think about taking deeper breaths and taking them before longer phrases, particularly on solos.
Wishing to blow more air through the horn is not 'wrong', but shouldn't be a goal by itself - you will do it naturally as you get more used to playing against the resistance of the reed and mouthpiece, and when you feel like you are being stifled, you will seek more open mouthpieces. Its a natural progression for some players.
That is totally wrong - where do you think all that air goes? Air is compressible of course but there's no stopper in the bell of a sax. In fact, if I forget to remove the bell stuffer before trying to play, there's no way to play beyond a certain point that is higher than you would think on the sax.It even comes out of the bell when all the keys are closed. I'm not saying anybody could blow out a candle playing sax but all my life I've blown air out of the lower stack keys on alto, tenor and baritone - I feel it on my hands all the time, and I actually do not have a high-capacity for air. In fact, I don't do well in respiration tests but I can blow two saxes at the same time - alto with a Guardala Studio and tenor with a Guardala King Curtis, and handle fairly long phrases at a high volume. My problem comes in with not being able to hold notes for a long time at high volume on any horn, but I'd rather be able to push the air than have a huge reserve. Of course, it obviously would be better to have both abilities! Plus, the lungs lose capacity as we age, and I am definitely aged! I find myself having to think about taking deeper breaths and taking them before longer phrases, particularly on solos.
Wishing to blow more air through the horn is not 'wrong', but shouldn't be a goal by itself - you will do it naturally as you get more used to playing against the resistance of the reed and mouthpiece, and when you feel like you are being stifled, you will seek more open mouthpieces. Its a natural progression for some players.
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For years I have tried increasing my lung capacity by filling my lungs, then gulp-swallowing until I could hold no more. Does it work ??? well IDK..I do know my lung capacity has not diminished at all over the years, I just turned 76. Talking Tenor I have gone from many yrs of playing on mpcs with tip openings over .120 to tip openings around .110-.113
Perhaps that shows some diminishing, but I attribute it to the fact I don't play the big stages much anymore. Mostly with my Duo I work small local venues these days. I have 3 steadies a week and adding a 4th after Super Bowl.
Perhaps that shows some diminishing, but I attribute it to the fact I don't play the big stages much anymore. Mostly with my Duo I work small local venues these days. I have 3 steadies a week and adding a 4th after Super Bowl.
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I see your point, but it is relative. The air stream we blow through the reed opening becomes a sound wave with compression and expansion of air molecules that travels through the instrument to the first opening where it changes direction and travels back to the mouthpiece. This trip down and back represents the "wavelength" of the fundamental of the note being played. This wave travels at the speed of sound. There may be some slight linear movement of the air itself but its velocity and intensity are far less than that of the soundwave that travels through the column of air which for the most part is stationary.
To illustrate: Remove the neck from the saxophone and play as loudly as possible while holding your free hand close to the opening. You will feel some movement of air partly due of the soundwave and partly due to the air that is blown into the mouthpiece. Next, remove the mouthpiece and blow as hard as you can into the neck opening, again feeling the air at the other end. This the feeling of air traveling through the saxophone. To go even farther, have another player blow into the neck attached to the saxophone while fingering low Bb and hold your hand next to the bell opening. The air movement you feel is significantly less since it is traveling through a tube that is not only longer, but increases in diameter as well.
When a large key near the bottom of a saxophone is "blown open" when one plays loudly, it is caused by that keycup being located at a "pressure anti-node" in the soundwave of the note being played. A pressure "anti-node" is where the air molecules are compressed together exerting the most pressure against the walls of the instrument. One additional thought: In my previous post I should have said that it would be more accurate for teachers to tell students to "feel as if" they are blowing more air into the saxophone, or through the saxophone. This would be more accurate and realistic.
Soundwave animation
In the simplest terms, filling the horn with more air is just blowing harder, but doing it with confidence and finesse because your tone quality and intonation can suffer if you blow too hard without maintaining control.
But if you really listen to Cannonball, he's not constantly blasting as loud as he can. He just plays with confidence. There's a lot of dynamics, ghosting, inflections and accents in his playing which are the result of a lot of variation in air pressure and articulation.
Having said all that, there's a whole lot more to getting a Cannonball sound than just blowing harder.
But if you really listen to Cannonball, he's not constantly blasting as loud as he can. He just plays with confidence. There's a lot of dynamics, ghosting, inflections and accents in his playing which are the result of a lot of variation in air pressure and articulation.
Having said all that, there's a whole lot more to getting a Cannonball sound than just blowing harder.
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"Filling the horn with air" is more of a conceptual thing than an accurate depiction of what's really going on. Maybe it would be better to call it playing with solid air support. But that is even a bit harder to describe exactly. The real idea here is to play with confidence and a 'big' open sound. 'Big' doesn't necessarily mean loud, but a sound that fills the room, and the ability to vary the dynamic from soft to loud while maintaining a good sound. This all takes practice. One exercise is to play long tones and pay close attention to your tone quality, intonation, 'air support', etc, while varying the dynamics (volume).
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This discussion prompts me to recall a lesson learned from a band leader I worked with in the 70s. Glenn Tamayama had been the lead trumpet player for the Julie Andrews band, and shared this idea with our band. While walking - not playing - practice taking a full breath of air, then exhaling in a controlled fashion. Count how many steps you take as you blow. This awareness will encourage you to take deeper breaths, build your support, and control your airstream.
I also advocate practicing outdoors whenever you can. Play with the intent of filling space. Just as JL commented above, it is not about being loud.
A lot of this is conceptual, but it really helps those who are used to practicing in a small room, or play into a microphone with high monitor levels.
I also advocate practicing outdoors whenever you can. Play with the intent of filling space. Just as JL commented above, it is not about being loud.
A lot of this is conceptual, but it really helps those who are used to practicing in a small room, or play into a microphone with high monitor levels.
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Ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooommmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
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Do the Vincent Herring method - put a towel in the bell!
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I should be an oboist. Seriously though, "filling the horn with more air" sounds like a great way to tense up.
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I think of "blowing through the horn" rather than filling it, and am very relaxed. We each have our own path.
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Ozzy, you don't need tons of air. Just a good reed. Ever play a bari sax? You'd be surprised!
Grafton + TH & C alto || Naked Lady 10M || TT soprano || Martin Comm III
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This is spot on you don't "fill the hron with air"
But you can learn breath control, air support and lung capacity. That's all you need.
Look up Sonny Rollins breathing exercises.
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