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Discussion Starter #1
After another long and futile argument on here I believe the vintage vs. modern issue, as it relates to saxophones, can be summed up with one word, evolution.

Now if you don't believe in evolution period then don't waste your time responding.

However if you believe in the evolution of other man made things why not saxophones?

And I'm not talking about the hand made vs. machined components. That's another issue.

I'm talking about a specific brand like Selmer.

Are their modern horns better? Or did evolution mysteriously stop with the Mark VI?

So to sum up I'm not trying to revive the argument of which era is better.

I think that ship has sailed.

I'm specifically asking has the most iconic brand evolved or not?

That's it. It's really a yes or no question.

If you want to give a lengthy explanation understand that it will just revive the other argument about which era is better. That's your choice.
 

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"Evolves" doesn't automatically mean "improves".
 

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You don't really give much choice in how to answer because it does involve manufacturing processes and hand process to make a saxophone. In my mind you need to tell us what you mean by evolution in an inanimate object. Do you mean does newer equate to better ergonomics, sound or what it looks like? This does not take into consideration human involvement either. Not really much of a thread when you are forced to answer in a vacuum.

Without more specifics my answer at this time is YES/NO.

B
 

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We fundamentalists believe the saxophone was created perfect in one day. And then the maker, stamped Buescher on the bell. :bluewink:

Joking aside, your questions if fundamentally flawed. The Mark IV was not the perfect saxophone or the best ever made. It was a very common and long-lived professional saxophone model known for quality and good tone that became much of the basis for the modern saxophone sound. And right now, they bring lots of money in the vintage market. That's really it. You have to employ hype and myth to get more out of it than that.

Most will admit there have been better saxophone made before and since the Mark VI. It's just that none of these have reached the popularity of the Mark VI because the Mark VI had few comparable competitors during much of its run. And no one makes exact Mark VI copies using the exact same manufacturing techniques because those old techniques were inefficient and produced lots of variability and defects. This is very different than modern saxophones coming out of places like Japan today where almost all of them play within very tight tolerances. So you might have to go through many a Mark VI to find a really good one. But just about every Yamaha 82Z or Yanagisawa is going to be consistently good.
 

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I forgot to ask. Why did you not answer your own question? What are you currently playing? I think it would help to give some perspective. I'm just sayin'

B
 

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Discussion Starter #11
You don't really give much choice in how to answer because it does involve manufacturing processes and hand process to make a saxophone. In my mind you need to tell us what you mean by evolution in an inanimate object. Do you mean does newer equate to better ergonomics, sound or what it looks like? This does not take into consideration human involvement either. Not really much of a thread when you are forced to answer in a vacuum.

Without more specifics my answer at this time is YES/NO.

B
Hey read into what you will. I stand by the question. Has Selmer evolved or did evolution come to a screeching halt after the Mark VI?

I don't know how I can make it any plainer.

If you have a suggestion I'm open to it.

See I don't think many would argue that the sax has evolved since Adolph Sax.

So did the evolution stop or not?
 

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Discussion Starter #15
We fundamentalists believe the saxophone was created perfect in one day. And then the maker, stamped Buescher on the bell. :bluewink:

Joking aside, your questions if fundamentally flawed. The Mark IV was not the perfect saxophone or the best ever made. It was a very common and long-lived professional saxophone model known for quality and good tone that became much of the basis for the modern saxophone sound. And right now, they bring lots of money in the vintage market. That's really it. You have to employ hype and myth to get more out of it than that.

Most will admit there have been better saxophone made before and since the Mark VI. It's just that none of these have reached the popularity of the Mark VI because the Mark VI had few comparable competitors during much of its run. And no one makes exact Mark VI copies using the exact same manufacturing techniques because those old techniques were inefficient and produced lots of variability and defects. This is very different than modern saxophones coming out of places like Japan today where almost all of them play within very tight tolerances. So you might have to go through many a Mark VI to find a really good one. But just about every Yamaha 82Z or Yanagisawa is going to be consistently good.
Great answer but the question is about Selmer.
 

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AAAUUUGGGHHHH!!!! Why did I give in to the temptation of opening this thread??????????? There's a masochistic streak somewhere.
 

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Hey read into what you will. I stand by the question. Has Selmer evolved or did evolution come to a screeching halt after the Mark VI?

I don't know how I can make it any plainer.

If you have a suggestion I'm open to it.

See I don't think many would argue that the sax has evolved since Adolph Sax.

So did the evolution stop or not?
Why did you not word it this way in the first place? You made the initial questions too vague and requirements to answer way too rigid.

Okay. Now I can answer. Selmer product has evolved since the Mark VI because the manufacturing process has evolved. So on that point I say YES.

Are they necessarily better, that is a personal judgement call and can not be quantified by any means.

Saxophone manufacturing since the end run of the Selmer MK 6 has significantly evolved for all brands as has everything from candy wrappers to toilet seats.

What is the real point of this thread again? Is it?

:tsk:My new toy is better than your old toy:tsk:

B
 
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