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I know this question is a blast from the past. I had heard that the saxophone player (Dennis Payton) played a baritone sax when performing. I have included a link to a YouTube short video of the group performing one of their songs. You will see the saxophone throughout the video.

The saxophone does not look like the traditional baritone sax with the loops around the mouthpiece. Yet the saxophone in the vide0 looks very large. Is it just a big big tenor or in fact a baritone saxophone?

Thanks in advance. Here is the link.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AH1JEI79emU&NR=1

Ron
 

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I know this question is a blast from the past. I had heard that the saxophone player (Dennis Payton) played a baritone sax when performing. I have included a link to a YouTube short video of the group performing one of their songs. You will see the saxophone throughout the video.

The saxophone does not look like the traditional baritone sax with the loops around the mouthpiece. Yet the saxophone in the vide0 looks very large. Is it just a big big tenor or in fact a baritone saxophone?

Thanks in advance. Here is the link.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AH1JEI79emU&NR=1

Ron
Looks like a tenor to me!
 

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Yes, I'm just old enough to remember them [rolleyes], and only ever saw them with a tenor.
 

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It's a tenor - just like it was when I saw these guys the first time in high school.

There is a combination of factors involved here that distort the size of the horn's bell.
1. The player holds the horn out in front of himself. A wide lens on a front shot would make the horn appear more Bari-like and the player smaller.
2. TV optics in the 50's-60's were poor. Notice the distortion of bell size as he moves. (The old saw was: TV will put 10-15 pounds on you as a performer.)
3. White shirts and shiny surfaces created flare and spread as well.

Better view here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AZW_Ke4yh-U&feature=related

GPD
 

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There is a combination of factors involved here that distort the size of the horn's bell.
1. The player holds the horn out in front of himself. A wide lens on a front shot would make the horn appear more Bari-like and the player smaller.
2. TV optics in the 50's-60's were poor. Notice the distortion of bell size as he moves. (The old saw was: TV will put 10-15 pounds on you as a performer.)
3. White shirts and shiny surfaces created flare and spread as well.
4. Little guy playing the tenor.
 

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I think it was the other way around. Some of the recordings had bari on them, but he always appeared (at least on TV) with a tenor. I certainly remember at the time thinking that it sounded like a bari, but the sound on the YouTube clips is so bad I can't tell you which track(s) it was.
 

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Tenor sax, couldn't make the brand - had a bell key on each side of the bell. Denny wasn't much of a sax player but he looked good - very important in 1964. He played mostly to augment the beat. I don't remember hearing any baritone sax on their records - Denny had a deep sound on tenor. Here's a solo on 'Can't You See That She's Mine'. It's not bad, actually, and his sound was just right for that group. At one point they were were the hot British group here in the USA but after the Ed Sullivan Show, the Beatles ruled.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AZW_Ke4yh-U&feature=related

Maybe it's a Buescher tenor.
Looking again, I did hear a baritone (alone) on some songs, and the tenor becomes a new MK VI at some point down the road. The Selmer is what I remembered from 1965.
 

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In those days, there was no guarantee that the recorded sounds were actually made by the musicians that you saw performing... Session musicians often "helped out" (that was meant tongue-in-cheek) and miming was prolific.
 

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I live in an historic neighborhood where we have a small neighborhood bar that has made the Esquire list of great bars. I walk my dog by there and listen to live music which is sometimes pretty good. A lot of small road bands play there. There is a tendency for many of these bands to use horns including saxes. The only problem is that the horns are almost always for show - all hat and no cowboy. This seems to be the new fad. The other fad which kind of digusts me is where the bands bill themselves as trad (1920s) jazz and then just make fun of the genre - again, no cowboy there either.
 

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In those days, there was no guarantee that the recorded sounds were actually made by the musicians that you saw performing... Session musicians often "helped out" (that was meant tongue-in-cheek) and miming was prolific.
While this is certainly true, in this case the tenor sound and style is completely consistent on all their records. I am sure that there was no 'hit man' involved.
 

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Yes, agreed, the sound would have been better if session men were involved [rolleyes] - I'm a Brit, I'm allowed to say that !

I was reminded of that tho' when I watched the first Blues Brothers film (for the 105'th time) last night, and there they were, in Ray's Music Exchange, 'Shakin a Tail Feather' - with trumpet/tenor/alto as the horns, but with this mysteriously invisible great fat baritone sound farting along with them... :mrgreen:

http://www.wat.tv/video/ray-charles-the-blues-brothers-1aknc_2fgqp_.html

It was glorious, I only played a baritone for short periods, but what beef in a Soul band, it was often the basis of the sound. 'nuff said...

(Apologies for straying off topic, and btw, the Blues Bros. bari player could well have been Tom Scott, who 'guested' on a lot of the tracks - great to listen to tho' - eh ?)
 

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You're right - Denny's playing was not making saxophone history, but he fit right in with the group and got a lot of camera time. Who knows? Without him they may have flopped. In pop music, it's not about how good you are - it's about how much people like you.
I haven't seen the 'Blues Brothers 105 times, but I wish I had. What a musician's movie! I particularly like it because I was on the road here in the USA during the period depicted in the movie. Too bad you didn't experience that! I feel gratified to have lived through it.
 

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50's and early 60's Rock 'n Roll! I played in a house band at a summer resort and can't remember how many bands came through on one nighters with sidemen picked up out of some day job like working in a record store. One tenor player came up to me during an intermission and asked me what note I used. After a very pregnant pause and look of disbelief on my part he held up his horn fingering an "A" and said that was the one he used!

The group "The Kingsmen" came through riding their one hit wonder "Louie, Louie". Their bass player flaked and left them bass-less. The picked up a kid working at a local music store because the jacket fit. He was taught 4 notes and a guitar player tuned his bass for him... Stranger things happened back then but nobody in the teen audience caught on. Our guys were pretty much totally music majors from college playing for scale or close to it. Johnny one-note made as much for a gig as we did for a week. Life never was fair.
 

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Selmer low A bari! Nice choice. Can't make the mouthpiece though. I thought it might just be a gold-plated Berg.
 
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