[chipcook]

In the fall, I found a Conn C Melody Sax (straight neck) with brand new pads, essentially overhauled. But what mouthpiece? Seems to be especially crucial for a C Melody.

Ron Caravan offers a C Melody MPC, as well as Morgan. The Caravan was $149 (plus shipping), and the Morgan was $309. I decided I better try the Caravan first, especially since I was not sure how much I would play this new to me saxophone.

Well, I ended up loving the C Melody and I have been playing it one of the community bands I perform with. With the Caravan MPC, it seems to be in a threshold between an alto and a tenor in terms of sound. The Caravan MPC was somewhat darker than I would have expected and plays softly...for me, all good things! The mouthpiece was also finished well…the front facing was even, as well as the rails.

Of course, you buy one mouthpiece, you want to try another! A few weeks ago, I ordered the Morgan C Melody mouthpiece, tip opening .075 (3). I selected this opening, since the Caravan was a .067 (I didn't want to go too far off). The Morgan arrived, and I have been testing it and comparing it to the Caravan.

First, I will say Morgan does a fantastic job with presenting their product. Well designed storage box and mouthpiece bag. Morgan also includes a Rovner ligature and MPC cover, which is a very nice addition. The mouthpiece itself was VERY nice! Well finished, front facing even, as well as the rails.

How did it play? Well, this is where things get disappointing (for me).
1. Using either a Vandoren Java 2.5 or a Vandoren traditional 3, tuning was off…15-20 cents sharp! Even with making adjustments on the cork AND the microtuner, it was a challenge.
2. The lovely soft dark sound that sat between alto and tenor using the Caravan…that sound was gone. It was replaced by a brighter tenor voice.

Now, I went back and forth making comparisons between the Caravan and the Morgan, using different reeds, different ligatures, and even different tuners. The Caravan is sounding better (for me) than the Morgan.

Just my thoughts...every player has a different experience and mouthpiece preference.

 

[turf3]

From what I've read the Caravan is a true large round chamber classically-inspired piece, while the Morgans are derived from the Meyer; smaller chamber (though not really small) and a modest rollover baffle. I would expect a Morgan to have a bit brighter voice. The Morgan tending to play sharper bears out my expectatations about the chamber size of the two pieces. In general a larger chamber piece will play flatter when the distance from (whatever feature on the horn) to the MP tip is the same.

 

[paulwl]

Caravan didn't use to do a C melody piece. They're not considered classical instruments. They'd work well tonally in orchestras, but probably wouldn't be used unless the parts were originally written in C.

Caravan pieces were designed with orchestral playing in mind, but they're not at all common in that context.

 

[kfoster]

In the fall, I found a Conn C Melody Sax (straight neck) with brand new pads, essentially overhauled. But what mouthpiece? Seems to be especially crucial for a C Melody.

Just my thoughts...every player has a different experience and mouthpiece preference.

View attachment 255958

Having played one of Dr. Caravan's mouthpieces when I was an undergraduate saxophone major, I would agree with your findings. That is exactly why I have just purchased a Morgan C Melody mouthpiece. Dr. Caravan's mouthpiece is perfect for your playing situations and for playing the early 20th century music that players like Rudy Weidoff played. I was looking for a more tenor oriented sound that spreads more and has more brilliance. My C Melody is still at the spa getting overhauled, but my preliminary trials with my tenor indicate I am on to the sound that I am looking for.

 

[chipcook]

Having played one of Dr. Caravan's mouthpieces when I was an undergraduate saxophone major, I would agree with your findings. That is exactly why I have just purchased a Morgan C Melody mouthpiece. Dr. Caravan's mouthpiece is perfect for your playing situations and for playing the early 20th century music that players like Rudy Weidoff played.

Understood. I am playing my C Mel in a Moravian band with a SATB arrangement, with the music originally designed for trombone choirs (from 200+ years ago). Even though there are woodwinds now and the arrangements updated, these bands have old helicons, c trumpets, and tenor horns. Not quite Rudy Weidoff, but it's a classical ensemble for sure, and that darker sound from the Caravan helps my sax fit right in.

 

[kfoster]

Understood. I am playing my C Mel in a Moravian band with a SATB arrangement, with the music originally designed for trombone choirs (from 200+ years ago). Even though there are woodwinds now and the arrangements updated, these bands have old helicons, c trumpets, and tenor horns. Not quite Rudy Weidoff, but it's a classical ensemble for sure, and that darker sound from the Caravan helps my sax fit right in.

:cheers:

Perfect, you hit on one of my favorite things about playing the saxophone. There are so many different sounds available to us, with changes in performance technique and minor equipment changes.

 

[zapatista]

I wonder how does an original large bore Conn C Melody Mouthpiece compare...

 

[kfoster]

I wonder how does an original large bore Conn C Melody Mouthpiece compare...

If they are anything like the Steelay mouthpieces that came with the 6m, small tip opening, no baffle and huge chamber.

 

[chipcook]

I wonder how does an original large bore Conn C Melody Mouthpiece compare...

Interesting question, as I have the original Conn MPC for this C Melody, and oddly, it is very difficult to play in tune on this horn! I wonder if the issue is the reed? Does it need a REAL C Melody reed?

Also, like many others have reported, it is "stuffy" and very low volume. I have thought about getting it cleaned up (rails, table, re-do facing), but likely not worth the trouble.

 

[nigeld]

I have an original Conn mouthpiece for my Conn C-mel.
I think it’s good, but the sound is nothing like a tenor or alto sax. The sound is sweet and very quiet compared to my other saxes.
I’m guessing that this is how it was intended to be - a polite instrument for the home.
Blowing the Conn mouthpiece is very different from my other saxes - the tip opening is very small and it’s easy to close down the reed if I push too hard.

But personally I don’t see the point of getting a C-Mel and trying to make it sound like a tenor. I have a tenor sax for that.

 

[cvsimson]

With these mouthpieces (Morgan and Caravan) are the low notes in tune with the rest?
My experience with other mouthpieces is that the bottom C and below are flat, and it is easy to go out of tune on the high notes (A and above). At the top end I can compensate and adjust, but not so much at the low end. (I am currently playing a Buescher, with a Berg Larsen Metal mouthpiece and fibracell reeds, so a very different setup from yours)
What is your experience?

 

[chipcook]

With these mouthpieces (Morgan and Caravan) are the low notes in tune with the rest?
My experience with other mouthpieces is that the bottom C and below are flat, and it is easy to go out of tune on the high notes (A and above). At the top end I can compensate and adjust, but not so much at the low end. (I am currently playing a Buescher, with a Berg Larsen Metal mouthpiece and fibracell reeds, so a very different setup from yours)
What is your experience?

On my Conn C Melody, the Caravan plays in tune on bottom C and on high A. No issues.

What you are describing on your Buescher sounds similar to the issue I had on an Elkhart Band Instrument Company (EBIC) Alto Sax from circa 1927. Apparently, some 1920's Buescher and similarly made EBIC saxophones (Buescher's second line and stencil), suffered an intonation issue in the octave pip. I sent this alto to Mark Aronson and he fixed the pip, added a C# key bar, as well as some linings to specific tone holes. I spent WAY too much money on that alto for what it truly was worth, but it plays great now. Not saying that is the issue, but you may want to look at your octave pip.

 

[cvsimson]

Thank you!

 

[JasonWire]

I bought both. I play a Buescher C-Mel and bought the Morgan first based on the reviews and I was disappointed in it. It didn't have the intonation and tone that fit the horn. It was a lot better than the original mouthpiece, but wasnt a full sound that stayed in tune. Next I bought the Caravan and I love it! Impeccable intonation, beautiful deep rich sound and I could still get the volume I wanted out of it. Plus, at half the price of the Morgan its a no-brainier.

 

[bruce bailey]

What is the tip opening on the Caravan?

 

[zapatista]

Good Morning Bruce,

.067" per their website. I just ordered one. Look forward to comparing it on the Conn/Buescher/Martin C Melodies currently in inventory.

https://caravanmouthpieces.com/mp/c-tenor-sax.html

 

[paulwl]

Still don't get why Caravan would get involved with the C unless classical players set a precedent. Who's doing it? Where?

 

[cvsimson]

I guess there is a good enough number of C-Melody players looking for a more open and modern mouthpiece that will allow them to play in tune, and not much competition. Once they figure out how to do one (probably by request of someone that funded the development costs) it is good profit.
I don't play classical, but just ordered one to try it out, based on the positive comments here. I figured that if I decide not to use it, I can re-sell and not loose too much money.
Lots of people play it at church...

 

[lydian]

I just play my Morgan tenor mouthpiece on my Conn C-Melody. Intonation is fine, and the piece is bright, modern and open. I simply can't justify paying more for a mouthpiece than I did for the entire horn.

 

[cvsimson]

I received my Caravan C Melody MP and gave it a first try. I found it very good and easy to play. It works well with the Fibracell reeds I have been using with my Berg Larsen metal (Tenor) MP, but the upper range sounded thin and weak. I changed to cane reeds (Superial) and the sound improved a lot up there.
It has a nice tone and it is easy to play across the range. Unfortunately it didn't eliminate the problem of the low C and Bb being flat. All other notes are in tune or very close (middle C is a bit flat too, but if I use side Bb key with it I can get it perfectly in tune).
I guess key openings might need some adjustment to make it fully in tune.
I am happy with this experiment. It showed to me that my current favorite set up (Berg Larsen metal Tenor) is not the cause of the flat low notes, so no need to start the mouthpiece search over again. It also gave me an alternative set up for another sound concept, that I will be exploring further. I think I am keeping this MP too.

Just for reference - I am playing a Buescher TT late serial #, with Front F and roller G#, original snap on resonators, new pads.