[queperknuckle]

I have a sax that clearly have intonation problems. This is the pierret horn. When I looked at the pads on this Pierret horn and compared them to the pads on the Selmer, I noticed some shocking differences. One, for example, is that the Selmer's resonators are difference sizes on some keys. The resonator on the B key is bigger that that on middle C. On the Pierret, the resonator on the B and middle C keys are almost the same size. I'd even say the resonator on middle C is smaller. Can having the wrong size resonators on keys (these are metal, by the way) disturb the intonation. Please note, these are not the original pads. The horn got terrible work done on it which I'm spending to many $$'s trying to fix.

I'm trying to determine if overhauling and putting in proper pads will improve the intonation. Any thoughts?

 

[Fred]

As a general rule, pad heights would play a much greater role in intonation than resos. Pad heights would also be a likely victim of a poor overhaul. I'd check with a good tech about whether the setup you have can be improved before I started down the overhaul road again.

 

[queperknuckle]

It's just hard for me to believe that the intonation of the horn can be this bad. Something must be wrong somewhere... What are the pad heights? And what is the difference between using metal and plastic resonators? I've gone a long way already to restoring this horn...it would be such a shame if the intonation of the horn is just inherently this bad after all I've gone through with it. This horn is full of awful surprises!

 

[queperknuckle]

Just to add a note. The C, mentioned above, is a huge culprit. It is completely out of tone by 20-25 cents sharp.

 

[TenTenTooter]

Resonator sizes can affect response but should not affect intonation. What mouthpiece/reed setup are you using?

 

[queperknuckle]

Resonator sizes can affect response but should not affect intonation. What mouthpiece/reed setup are you using?

Super Session F with a Vandoren Java 3. My tech is the one that pointed the problem out to me showing me with the tuner how the horn is out of wack. I have since bought a tuner and clearly see that certain notes play out of tune. From A to C, the horn plays sharp. Could it be that Pierret just made a bad horn here (which is hard to believe they made one with intonation this bad)? Or that it is a victim of pathetic prior work and after an overhaul will play with better intonation.

 

[shmuelyosef]

20 cents out of tune for C is not so bad that it can't be adjusted with some key height work. If your tech did not suggest this (or just do it) you should perhaps find another tech...did the tech discuss with you possible reasons for the intonation problems and possible remedies and shoptime/cost of remedy?

The reso mismatches are not the problem, but key heights can profoundly affect intonation, both the average heights of all the keys as well as individual key heights affecting particular notes. If the keys overall are too high or too low, then you will end up with your mouthpiece too far in or out for the overall horn 'setpoint'.

Have you tried mouthpieces with dramatically different volumes (e.g. a Dukoff D vs. a Link STM NY)?

 

[queperknuckle]

20 cents out of tune for C is not so bad that it can't be adjusted with some key height work. If your tech did not suggest this (or just do it) you should perhaps find another tech...did the tech discuss with you possible reasons for the intonation problems and possible remedies and shoptime/cost of remedy?

The reso mismatches are not the problem, but key heights can profoundly affect intonation, both the average heights of all the keys as well as individual key heights affecting particular notes. If the keys overall are too high or too low, then you will end up with your mouthpiece too far in or out for the overall horn 'setpoint'.

Have you tried mouthpieces with dramatically different volumes (e.g. a Dukoff D vs. a Link STM NY)?

You were right. I took it to a tech today who demonstrated that by lowering the low c and d keys, e played more in tune. More specifically, lowering the low C key makes D play less flay and lowering the D key make E play less flat. The saxophone is such a precision instrument! But it's not that easy. The question is how do you lower these keys.

The tech said another solution is to put cork in the tone holes of both notes and he demonstrated how that would help adjust intonation. Very interesting stuff. He said that was the solution he preferred for my horn. After the overhaul is finished, I am going to investigate whether this needs to be done or I'll adjust embrochure to compensate for the horns intonation problems.