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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So I just bought my first saxophone and am looking forward to becoming a saxophone player! I bought this "Bundy" Tenor Sax on Ebay for about 300$. It is a little rough around the edges but it seems to play OK and be in good shape for how old it is. Anyway, I'm having trouble identifying exactly what type of sax it is. The only markings I can find on it are "Bundy" on the pinky pad and a serial number 462071. I believe it is a Selmer Bundy from around 1969 but using the a lot of the Buescher Aristocrat parts and serial numbers. Is this correct? I've attached some pics below and can certainly attach more specific ones if it will help.

Thanks in advance!
John



 

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Selmer as in Conn-Selmer USA, not related if not in VERY remote past origin to Selmer Paris France.

Also Bundys are somewhat Bueschers (but opinions are divided)

http://forum.saxontheweb.net/showthread.php?100742-Bueschers-aren-t-Bundies

Don't go calling your post selmer buyout Bueshcer "Bundies"

HA Bundy labeled horns were Aristocrat bodies with less "hip" keywork. So was elkhart built by Buescher horns.

After selmer buyout there's still one good batch of buescher - buescher horns. And I've always worked primarily with Bueschers and have measured more bodies and details than I should, so here's the breakup:

Aristocrats made out of prime production pieces: those horns will always have the rhomboid post and guard feet (flange). Top notch Buescher production on aristocrats, 400's, and mixed series (aristocrats with 400 bells and such experiments)

Aristocrat stencils: will have the true tone style flange for posts and will have the post selmer guard feet (flange). This goes for HA bundy, Elkhart, some WINDSOR stencil horns, well, that kind of horns.

during the early Selmer years, and up to mid 400xxx serial range, they're still using top notch details.

After mid 400xxx serial range, you have buescher bodies with stencil keywork up to 65xxxx on tenors and up to as high as 79xxxx on altos. This means that while having the truetone side trill looking keys (the aristocrat side trill key style were destined to Signets in this period) and the New Aristocrat LH pinky table with the no-rollered G# table that says BUESCHER or BUNDY, these horns are indeed pristine buescher bodies (the necks on this horns are True Tone necks in bore and shape, while the aristocrat necks are saved for signets occasionally and buescher 400 always)

So really your bundy I is a BUESCHER and not the other way around.

When you play a late 30's to '50's buescher you get why Selmer bought them out and destroyed them. They produced fast keywork, and a variety of flavors for intonation and tone (spread, thick and focused, etc) way before Selmer came up with the "celebrated" MK VI. (They must be celebrating now the vast amount of money they made with marketing hype) :twisted:

I will make a point out of recording samples with my early, mid, late true tones, my New Aristocrats, My aristo I, my early Big B, my mid Big B, my 140 script aristo, my 400 THC and several so called bundy bueschers and post them. (I have all them breeds in altos, not on tenors) so you can take an educated or uneducated guess... the later aristocrats outplay my 140 and my later big B, and they're amazingly biting at my 400's ankles! ;)

BOTTOMLINE: tenors up to mid 600xxx serial ranges and altos up to late 700xxx serial ranges are Buescher by all means and should not be taken lightly or as cheap student horns. The nickel plate may or may not appeal to you, and on the later edge of that ranges they may look cheaper than before, but up to about the '80's the selmer american company was paying the bills with overproduction stock from the golden years. :) even with round post flanges!

It's so sad learning that part of the reason why Selmer was allowed to do this is because you didn't stand up for your domestic companies and while having such fine horns made at the home of the braves you were always looking across the puddle for froggie saxophones! :(
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
So that would make this a mid to late 60s Buescher Aristocrat marketed as a Conn-Selmer Bundy?

Also, did I overpay for this or is 300 a good deal?

Thanks for the help guys!
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I wish it was an M6.. It's just a 635. 3.5 straight 6 automatic. It does have the M-tech steering wheel though lol
 

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Any "good playing condition" tenor saxophone from a major manufacturer is worth more than $300 all the time! But you have a late 1940's/early 1950's Buescher body design with some simplified keywork, and these horns play WELL when in good playing condition. You could pay SIX TIMES that for one of the modern "student model" tenors and not have a horn that plays as well as this one. Make sure to have a tech put it in the best playing condition he can muster, and then play the whey out it! I have a 1951 Buescher 156 tenor from which your horn is derived, and it plays as well as ANY tenor I have ever played. The 1960's Selmer Bundy is, as I said earlier, a very close relative to this horn, and it plays like it! These are far undervalued and underappreciated, and I would love to find one for $300 as a backup horn for my 1951 Buescher! Play it, enjoy it, and make great music with it!
Sax Magic
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 · (Edited)
Awesome! This is good news! I'm glad I got a good deal on a nice vintage sax. I've always had an appreciation for older things such as cars and instruments. I just wish it was in a little better aesthetic condition.. But evidently 300$ is a good deal for any playable tenor.

How much could I expect to pay for a overhaul, I guess you'd say? My roommate's saxophone playing friend gave it a look over and she seemed to think it was in decent shape. The ebay dealer I bought it from was a horn repairer and he probably gave it a few things it needed. The cork looks newer and so do most of the main pads. The only problems I see are the palm key pads look a little gross (from saliva I assume). But I can't find anything wrong with how it plays other than my embrochure haha.

There are some scratches on the on the bell, dents around it, and lacquer wear in a few spots. Are these things that can/should be repaired? My guess is that that is more of a restoration job and would be really expensive and not worth the gain..

I'll post some more pics to give you guys an idea of what kind of work it might need and what I could expect to pay when I get to that point.













 

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You also happen to have one of the absolute best repair technicians in the midwest across the river in downtown Lafayette. If you have any trouble with it take it over to see Brent Laidler at his shop on South 4th Street. He's right across from Buckles Feed. He is extremely trustworthy and does incredible work and very reasonable prices. Have fun with that horn, it should serve you well!
 

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A full repad, oil, and adjust would run around $500 in the southeast. You probably don't need that yet, based upon the pics. Instead, have a great tech (like the one previously suggested) look it over, replace a few pads as needed, oil, and adjust. Might run $200 for all that, but it will PLAY! Don't bother to have any cosmetic work done, as some of the best horns I have ever played look terrible (since good horns tend to be played a lot!). If there are significant dents in the neck or deep dents in the bottom bow, have those removed to improve the playing response (dents around the keys would keep it from playing at all, but you have indicated otherwise). If you want to have the bell lip straightened, that won't add much to your repair costs. Don't relacquer the horn or replate any of the nickel-plated keys, as you will quickly get beyond the worth of the horn to anyone but you. Just get it to great playing condition and enjoy.
Sax Magic
 

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Just fix what needs to be done and don't repad unless most pads are in sad shape. Sometimes I will do only palm and low Eb pads which tend to wear the most. The good tech will know.
 

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@JEFlatt,
It has now been 8 years... how did this horn work out for you? What further repairs did you commission after our discussion here? Did you grow as a player, or resell the horn and go on to something new in your life?
 
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